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Old 03-02-2008, 08:18 PM
 
54 posts, read 192,631 times
Reputation: 38

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I tend to agree with Vamp Girl. As to the comment about peoples memories and possessions, how long does it take to get your possessions out of a house? It took us a two months after Katrina to get it all out of three homes, what was left undamaged "like china etc." The origional homes look very different. I am not a proponent of tearing down peoples homes although it would have increased the value of those working so hard to reconstruct their homes on the homes that are currently neglected. I think it is really sad to see a couple of nice homes being rebuilt in the affected areas surrounded by all of the abandoned ones.
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Old 03-03-2008, 02:58 AM
 
Location: New Orleans, LA
80 posts, read 128,400 times
Reputation: 20
lol @ a job paying $7 or even a $10/hour job meaning a damn thing when the average rent in that city is over a $1000/month. Paying a house note (if you even have the credit, back-end/front-end ratios, the 20% down payment, the overall income to obtain a mortagage because due to this subprime housing crunch) getting more difficult; let's not even get into insurance. How in the hell is that even affordable, even if you have a job. Think about it...


$10/hour X 2080 hours (a 40-hour work week, all 52 weeks of the year)

= $20,800/year


which translates into $1,733.33 a month


and if the average rent in this city is around $1,000, that's well over half the monthly gross income going towards just rent. Most reputable property management companies won't even talk to you if you don't make at least three times the rent. And how is that even fiscially responsible if you have to account for utilites (which are constantly going up in this city thanks to Entergy), food (going up), gas (we all know about this), etc. Don't even talk about if you have kids. Sure, less money is taken out of your income taxes and you get a higher refund at the end of the year, but that is based on the reality that supporting children takes a financial strain. And what about savings?? Could anyone plausibly budget on that income with the way things cost now in this city, with a family??



That's the post-Katrina reality of the unskilled labor force of life-long New Orleanians who want to come back to this city. The jobs you're qualified for are paying you more (supposedly, because a lot of the food service places now have lower their wages since that initial jump months following); however, due to the almost double and tripled costs of basic living expenses, the purchasing power of those increased wages are, in fact, lower than what they were before Katrina -- a reality that's too often ignored by the local media and those who are quick to place judgement on the work ethic of those at the bottom of the captialistic food chain.

So the real message shouldn't be "well maybe if they had a job", but, in reality, the message "if you had the right job". Because, let's face it, unless you're making well over $30,000 a year in this city -- you're struggling or you barely have any time left in your day because you have to work multiple jobs to stay afloat.

And New Orleans was and still is primarily a service industry. You think Marriott, Hilton, Sheraton, Burger King, McDonalds, the local grocery stores, etc. are paying their entry-level workers $30K a year?? Come on... we all know the answer to that question. Why you think these companies (particularly the hotels and contractors) were giving work visas out to people in Mexico and Central America?? Cheaper labor. That influx didn't happen by accident. And those people came in this city by groups, which means they tend to live in groups, which eases the burden of living expenses of them all (it didn't hurt that some contractors provided housing for some of their migrant workers). Contrast that with native New Orleanians who are used to being a little more independent and you have what you see right now in the city.



Its easy and convenient when you have that college degree and some employer in New Orleans seeks you out from another state with that good job that affords you to live in a place where a $1000+ rent isn't a huge burden to sit and point the finger attributing the plight of the less well-off -- the "have nots" -- towards a lack of work ethic, as if their struggle is due to them not trying at all, rather than trying and not being compensated enough for the effort exterted to live somewhat comfortably. That's a pretty unfair, and closed-minded assessment in my opinion. There's many factors and dynamics involved that can and have came into play that aren't discussed by those quick to judge. Case in point: Before the storm, New Orleans was over 60% renters, and over half the rentals in this city was at or below $500 a month. I already gave an estimate of the average rent after the storm. Some adjust much easier than others.
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Old 03-03-2008, 06:27 AM
 
Location: New Orleans, LA
595 posts, read 2,341,063 times
Reputation: 193
So? No one is entitled to live off the hard work of others.
I cannot afford a house here myself but I work a full time job and have to to stay here.

I know many service professionals who do get by here, not living Uptown but living in St. Roch....but many people just didn't work before the storm at all, and its not up to anyone else to provide for them.
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Old 03-03-2008, 10:15 AM
 
Location: New Orleans, LA
80 posts, read 128,400 times
Reputation: 20
There you go again with that assumption. Who's says that many people in this city didn't work at all?? Where are you getting this from? Stats? Links? Something?


And you say service professionals? Professionals, as in those with a college degree. I'm not talking about them (obviously); I'm talking about those with sweep the floors in the hotels, who make the beds, clean the bathrooms, the cooks (not the professional chefs, but the lowly, entry-level cooks) who work in the various restaurants in this city, the crew members at the various fast food chains. The minimium wage/slight above minimum wage/$25,000-and-under-a-year workers who can't realisitically afford to live in an area that doubled its cost-of-living practically overnight.

That's was a nice chunk of population in this city. When you combine that with a poor education system and its no wonder why over half of the city before Katrina didn't graduate high school. All of that contributes to the workforce which I have illustrated in the previous paragraph. It doesn't help that this city didn't have/doesn't have a mass influx of companies willing to hire people in the city with quality employement. Hell, some of these companies recruit people outside of the state (which does jacks**t for those living in the city).


A lot of what I'm saying is pretty common knowledge for those who understand the economic environment of New Orleans, pre- and post-Katrina. Before New Orleans was affordable enough to support those with the low-end jobs (a large portion of the population), now if you don't have a college degree or the right connections, your options f'ing suck. Sure, it appears to work in your benefit by giving a little more money, but the jump in costs more than offset that supposed "benefit". As a result, those who lack of quality jobs (that doesn't mean they aren't working, just not working a good job) are struggling a lot more in this city.


This has been my point all along. Continuing to steer my points towards justifying supporting those who don't work at all by creating the mispreception that this city is full of bums who sit on their asses waiting on a welfare check is missing the point and a horrible oversimplification of obvious problems in this city. My point is given what New Orleans was before the storm and the hiking up of every basic need in this city after the storm, there is a huge demand/need for affordable housing options in this city. That portion of texas7's point I agree with wholeheartedly.
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Old 03-03-2008, 10:39 AM
 
Location: New Orleans, LA
595 posts, read 2,341,063 times
Reputation: 193
a. The city isn't full of bums who don't work, but the city had a sizable population who didn't work. Much larger than most.

b. It doesn't matter if it's affordable or not, no one has the right to live off the government dime, and "affordable" housing is what the market will bear. The market is at an affordable rate NOW. If housing is too expensive then those people don't have to live here. It's simple economics.
I'm a professional and I'm living extremely modestly in New Orleans to make sure I don't overextend myself.

No one deserves "affordable" housing below the market rate.
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Old 03-03-2008, 04:44 PM
 
Location: Houston, TX
8,893 posts, read 19,941,736 times
Reputation: 6365
Not all people have been fortunate to have had the same opportunies as you but it doesn't mean that they aren't as smart or as good as you are - it simply means they grew up in poverty without the means or encouragement to break that cycle. Now they are stuck in low paying jobs and it becomes a vicious cycle - a cycle where many of them hope and pray that they can educate their children so they don't live within the same cycle. Had they been presented with the same opportunities as you -- they could quite easily be on an even par in every aspect with you. Service workers at all levels are very needed but when that is the case - you also need affordable housing for those citizens (not what is affordable market rate to professionals). Not free - but affordable. If suddenly you lost everyone in NO with those lower paying jobs in the service industry/security/retail - what would happen to everyone else? Everyone would suffer. NO should make an effort to slap up some more low cost apartments to replace the dilapidated ones that were already in existence and put some restrictions on the tenants - such as job requirements, etc.
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Old 03-03-2008, 08:01 PM
 
Location: New Orleans, LA
595 posts, read 2,341,063 times
Reputation: 193
Well on a personal note dont assume I've had opportunities that other people didn't. I did grow up poor, as in dirt poor, as in family of 4 with an income of $12,000 a yr (in the 80s which was incredibly poor even then).

And the poor in this city, perhaps should not have come back here if that was so important to them. This is a bad place to be poor.
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Old 03-04-2008, 05:48 PM
 
Location: Houston, TX
8,893 posts, read 19,941,736 times
Reputation: 6365
Same opportunities don't necessarily mean economic. Could mean grades to earn scholarships (some people are just average students), could mean a guiding influence in their life family or outside to help young people see the importance of their future and so on. Congrats on stepping out of poverty though - that is an accomplishment.
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Old 03-04-2008, 07:37 PM
 
Location: New Orleans, LA
595 posts, read 2,341,063 times
Reputation: 193
Well another point as well is that the wealthy and the poor make up most of New Orleans, hypothetically, the middle class is the missing segment of the population here as they cannot afford to buy a house here, pay homeowner insurance rates and aren't poor enough to qualify for government assistance, I'd rather see the middle class get a hand up than the poor who already make up a large segment of the population. New Orleans cannot go on as a wealthy/poor city only. (Although no one deserves below market rate housing)

Besides you do miss the fact that the Westbank and Metarie generally have cheaper housing so if its so important, let the poor live there.

I would still never applaud giving people below market housing when people like me struggle to make ends meet, work FT and go to college.
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Old 10-21-2008, 01:25 PM
 
54 posts, read 192,631 times
Reputation: 38
TN rox,
Downtown suffered little damage and is extremely expensive to live in unless your single or are strapped with cash. Of course what was damaged there was quickly fixed up, you should have driven around more of the city, or look at it from google maps to see the areas that were flooded. Uptown, downtown, and Metarie faired well but nearly every other area was flooded with at least 5 foot of water. I was in chalmette last week and 80-90% of the homes are still unoccupied and rotting. Same with everything on the east bank thats still a little damaged? You must have gone to uptown and downtown only, which of course is coming back because I would guess the average home there to be 500K. New orleans is really rough right now and has a huge problem with identity theft. All of the abandonded homes also make perfect meth factories. I wonder exactly how many homes are still abandoned in the entire city being left to rot? And there is very little confidence in the engineers on the levee rebuilding. Yeah they held up to Gustav but Gustav was no Katrina, and even then it was close. Can you imagine a large cat 5?
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