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I made this thread because I see threads everywhere about Harlem, and in all of them you find people calling Harlem completely revitalized and safe. You would think it is safer than Chelsea! But this is just wrong. This is the biggest misconception on these boards. Here is why:
Lower central Harlem (28th precinct) & East Harlem (25th precinct) had violent crime rates of 9.6 & 9.1 (per 1,000). In the whole city of New York, that makes LCH and EH the 4th & 7th worst neighborhoods in terms of crime. This is magnifies even more when you realize that there are 74 precincts in NYC. These two wonderful neighborhoods are in rarified air as they are 2 of the 7 neighborhoods in the entire city that your chances of being a victim of crime are at least 9 (per 1,000).
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Harlem's second line of Defense
The upper central Harlem and is crime rate of 7.8 per 1,000 would put it on par with Southside Jamaica (the worst of Queens). This "second defense line" just so happens to be the 12th out of 74 most violent neighborhoods in the city.
You're probably thinking now, "Ok Harlem seems to be worst than I tought, but it can't continue! there must be some good" ..I answer, not yet buddy. Welcome to the 30th precinct located in upper west Harlem. It's crime rate of 6.9 per 1,000 ranks it roughly equal to the notorious neighborhoods of the "Alamo precinct" (46th) of University Heights, Fordham, Tremont, & Morris Heights. Still not enough? Well it is on par with a neighborhood that was earlier this year called the Heroin capital of NYC and as bad as Washington Heights in the 1980's, Fordham-Bedford. To top it off, it matches up with notorious drug neighborhoods of the south Bronx such as Highbridge and Concourse. Ready for the finale? It can also go head to head with Bushwick, which is about an infamous a neighborhood as you can find in Brooklyn.
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Harlem's Relief unit
Comes in the form of the 26th (lower west Harlem) and 23rd precincts (lower east Harlem). This relief core just offers you the same crime rates you find in Crown Heights & Clinton Hill, and a higher rate than dreaded Soundview in the Bronx. Oh btw, the 23rd precinct has a higher crime rate than Washington Heights and Inwood. Not bad for the softest parts of Harlem.
I don't understand why people keep touting Harlem as safe. If Harlem is safe, then what does that say about every other neighborhood in NYC? Is it because it's in Manhattan? I guess there is a misconception going around that if it's in Manhattan it has to be safe. Gentrification is probably the biggest reason people call Harlem safe. So instead of LCH having 0% white population, it has 10%...big deal? Most every hood in the city has seen an increase in whites since the year 2000, so why is no one calling them improved and safe? Another thing people spout is that it has changed an incredible amount since it's "dark days". But I ask you, what neighborhood in the city hasn't seen a complete turn around in crime since the early 90's. This is not unique to Harlem, every single neighborhood (well, bad hood) is safer now than it was 20 years ago. And obviously, Harlem has improved less than other places if it is still a cesspool of crime in 2010, especially relative to NYC.
All the crime rates are from this interactive map.
So I ask, what is it about Harlem that gives people this wrong idea? What is it about neighborhoods such as Harlem and Bed-Stuy, that in 2010 were about as high a crime nabe that you could find in NYC, that give off such a good vibe? Meanwhile, East NY is the worst thing ever and yet it had a considerebaly lower rate of crime than Utopia Harlem and Bed-Stuy. Does the word gentrification really hold so much weight?
Question: Do you think that the White newcomers are more obvious targets in these neighborhoods therefore, many of the victims are White(which may or may not drive up the crime rate) or that its a coincidence that gang/drug violence are high in these places that Whites are moving to? Also, Whites are generally more likely to report crimes than minorities. Lastly, many White Hipsters are frequent drug-users and drive the drug market in these hoods. As a result, crime could be a result of increased profits and competition for the "White Dollar".
Of course, the most obvious answer is Location, Location, Location.
Question: Do you think that the White newcomers are more obvious targets in these neighborhoods therefore, many of the victims are White(which may or may not drive up the crime rate) or that its a coincidence that gang/drug violence are high in these places that Whites are moving to? Also, Whites are generally more likely to report crimes than minorities. Lastly, many White Hipsters are frequent drug-users and drive the drug market in these hoods. As a result, crime could be a result of increased profits and competition for the "White Dollar".
Of course, the most obvious answer is Location, Location, Location.
I don't have any numbers regarding minority on white crime but there are two train of toughts here. One being that whites stick out in minority neighborhoods, and therefore are more often victims of crime. But at the same time, most crime is minority on minority and like you said some criminals probably know that whites would report crime more and would make bigger headlines. There is the no-snitching code in the hood, so most criminals probably are more sure of robbing another minority knowing that if he snitches, the hood would turn its back on him..in all likelihood, the victim would stay shut.
I believe the high crime has been embedded in the neighborhoods long before whites moved in. It actually started when whites moved out during white flight of the mid 1900's. Whites move back to these already high crime neighborhoods for the cheaper rent and proximity to Manhattan. Maybe whites see these hoods as safe because they are not really targeted. You have higher chances of being a victim if you're minority (black or hispanic) and involved in the drug trade. So Bob Smith may not have the same opinion of the south Bronx as say Joel Martinez.
It's always just about the money.I think the high crime rates in parts of Harlem are continuously downplayed because there has been so much real estate investment.The real estate industry and the city have invested way too much to let facts or reality get in the way of their profits.They know that if they keep putting out the propaganda that "all of Harlem is safe now" a lot of people will just accept it.
Americans have an alarming tendency to accept what they hear without question or investigation.It's the same phenomenon (but reverse) of all the people who believe that "all of The Bronx is a hell hole" based on circumstances 30 years ago in SOME areas.And when they have never set foot in The Bronx.
When you look at the city crime maps they always show that the majority of the highest crime precincts in the city are in Manhattan,including E.Harlem,the lower East Side and midtown but if you watch TV or read the papers you only hear about crime in parts of Brooklyn or The Bronx.Same goes for subway crime.The highest crime subway stops are all in midtown but people talk about being afraid to ride on trains in The Bronx or Brooklyn.It makes no sense at all but it shows the power of money and propaganda.
People accepting that Manhattan has high crime neighborhoods and high crime subway stations would not be good for business (real estate and tourist) so it's all just swept under the rug.
Most of the crime we hear occurring in Harlem involves a teenager being shot or a push-in rape. It occurs all over the country, but probably never in the level of Harlem. This is how the hood gets its reputation.
A 14-year-old boy was shot twice in the chest with a rifle yesterday while visiting his grandmother in Harlem. Tyreek Manguel suffered at least one broken rib when he was shot on 147th Street and 7th Avenue yesterday afternoon, and police say the violence stemmed from an earlier dispute that involved a mugging of the victim's mother and brother. One neighbor said, "It's been going on for the last two or three weeks." Manguel is at Harlem Hospital, where he is in serious but stable condition.
Harlem man Lawrence Elliot charged in rape, robbery of Hamilton Heights college student (http://feeds.nydailynews.com/%7Er/nydnrss/news/ny_crime/%7E3/b-0oslw1cR0/2010-11-13_harlem_man_lawrence_elliot_charged_in_rape_robb ery_of_hamilton_heights_college_s.html - broken link)
Second suspect is charged in slay of Harlem student Cheyenne Baez (http://feeds.nydailynews.com/%7Er/nydnrss/news/ny_crime/%7E3/QcRI19NBYZg/2010-11-10_2nd_suspect_is_charged_in_harlem_students_slay. html - broken link)
Cops charged a Harlem man Saturday night with sexually assaulting and robbing a Hamilton Heights woman.
Territorial gang warfare between gun-toting teens has been escalating and terrorizing citizens all over the city lately, from East New York to the Bronx. Since September, a rivalry between two such gangs, 2MF (2 Mafia Family) and 40 Wolvez, has claimed the lives of at least two teens, age 18 and 15, and no one has been willing to speak about what's going on. One veteran cop told NY Magazine, “A few years ago, you would see kids 19, 20 years old. Now these kids are babies—15, 14—and they are vicious. They will shoot you in a heartbeat and not think twice about it.”
A second man was charged with murder in the courtyard shooting that claimed the life of an innocent Harlem teen last month, prosecutors announced Tuesday.
Suspect arrested in Harlem teen's shooting death (http://feeds.nydailynews.com/%7Er/nydnrss/news/ny_crime/%7E3/_KHII6f2oXs/2010-10-13_suspect_arrested_in_harlem_teens_driveby_shooti ng_death.html - broken link)
DNA nails thug Curtis Tucker for 2004 attack on 15-year-old Harlem girl (http://feeds.nydailynews.com/%7Er/nydnrss/news/ny_crime/%7E3/O4dUM9mFs0k/2010-10-06_dna_nails_thug_curtis_tucker_for_2004_attack_on _15yearold_harlem_girl.html - broken link)
Detectives have arrested the suspected gunman in the drive-by shooting death of a 17-year-old girl in East Harlem.
A career criminal -- doing time for robbing and beating up an elderly Parkinson’s victim in Harlem -- was linked by DNA to a brutal, attempted rape at the same address five years earlier, officials said today. Curtis Tucker, 46, this afternoon pleaded not guilty to the fiendish assault...
It's the worst middle school in the Big Apple -- but the city can't fix it and can't shut it down. The
Academy of Collaborative Education in Harlem is one of just eight city schools to get an "F" on the Department of Education progress reports issued...
A violent thug was charged Tuesday in the 2004 attack on a 15-year-old Harlem girl - a crime prosecutors said could have been solved years ago with stronger DNA laws.
ahhh, thats all the way from 2009. crown heights isnt that soft now.....i think...
the 77th side of crown heights has never been to soft. well to me at lease, as for the 71st side of crown heights franklin/utica never been soft. Crazy stuff pops off in those 2 streets.
I bet most of the crime happens in and around the housing projects (which is to be expected). Lots of thugs visiting or living there. But much of Harlem is not so horrible as it used to be.
I bet most of the crime happens in and around the housing projects (which is to be expected). Lots of thugs visiting or living there. But much of Harlem is not so horrible as it used to be.
I think bluedog has hit the nail on the head.
And Cyrus, can't you say that about virtually every neighborhood in the city?
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