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I met an agent one day, and signed a lease the next day. Spent maybe 3 hours total with the guy, and then wrote him a check for $2200. Boy, am I in the wrong line of work...
As others have mentioned above, it's not totally impossible to find an apartment without a broker, but it's pretty darn hard. One need only observe the proportion of by-broker to by-owner listings on craigslist to see that. And obviously, you're not the only one who doesn't want to pay a fee, so there's very strong competition for the apartments that do exist in any decent neighborhood.
If you're determined to do this on your own, all the more power to you -- but frankly then you probably don't value your time pretty much. I know some folks who are pretty broke, and even they wound up going with brokers when they got fed up looking on their own. And that was in Astoria, not Manhattan.
I met an agent one day, and signed a lease the next day. Spent maybe 3 hours total with the guy, and then wrote him a check for $2200. Boy, am I in the wrong line of work...
As others have mentioned above, it's not totally impossible to find an apartment without a broker, but it's pretty darn hard. One need only observe the proportion of by-broker to by-owner listings on craigslist to see that. And obviously, you're not the only one who doesn't want to pay a fee, so there's very strong competition for the apartments that do exist in any decent neighborhood.
If you're determined to do this on your own, all the more power to you -- but frankly then you probably don't value your time pretty much. I know some folks who are pretty broke, and even they wound up going with brokers when they got fed up looking on their own. And that was in Astoria, not Manhattan.
Any neighborhood that is one of these uber trendy, overpriced areas with tiny crummy apartments renting in the $2,000's outside of Manhattan is going to require a broker who will charge between 13% - 15% of annual rent.
I looked at numerous apartments in Astoria over the years. One bedrooms for around $1,300 - $1,700. They were all overpriced s***tholes and brokers telling me how they have 10 applications and you need perfect credit. They prey on the desperate but wealthy tranplanted yuppies whose parents are paying their rent & the brokers fees.
Most native NY'ers don't use brokers & many are leaving the city entirely becuase of this madness.
If you do it yourself and talk to the supers can you sometimes bypass the whole 45 times the rent thing as well as the credit rating etc? I have lived in LA and near Tampa and have never had to have a broker to find an apartment. This sounds like it is really hard to find a place.
I won't be moving for a couple of years so I will have time to get all my ducks in a row. I don't need a fancy apartment but I don't want a roach infested one either. What neighborhoods are good for someone who isn't into the whole party scene? Are there any quieter neighborhoods in NYC? As you can tell I don't know much about NYC. I have read a couple of books but they were a few years old. If anyone can tell me a good book to buy that would help me I would appreciate it. Thanks very much.
I looked at numerous apartments in Astoria over the years. One bedrooms for around $1,300 - $1,700. They were all overpriced s***tholes and brokers telling me how they have 10 applications and you need perfect credit. They prey on the desperate but wealthy tranplanted yuppies whose parents are paying their rent & the brokers fees.
Most native NY'ers don't use brokers & many are leaving the city entirely becuase of this madness.
Not sure where you were looking, but there are definitely nice apartments in Astoria in the price range you mentioned. There are good deals and crappy deals in that and every other neighborhood. And for what it's worth, I'm a native, non-parentally-assisted New Yorker, as are the friends I mentioned, and we still used brokers. Yes, it sucked, but it's a fact of life in this city that if you refuse to use one, you greatly restrict the number of choices you have. And given how low the city's vacancy rate is, that means you're going to have trouble. Guess we could all move to Iowa or something...
Quote:
Originally Posted by RiWrites
If you do it yourself and talk to the supers can you sometimes bypass the whole 45 times the rent thing as well as the credit rating etc? I have lived in LA and near Tampa and have never had to have a broker to find an apartment. This sounds like it is really hard to find a place.
Fact is, everything is negotiable. I negotiated the broker's fee down from 13% to 9%. People think that the "45 times rent" thing is set in stone, but I got a lease without even having a job (I was in between jobs at the time) -- just showed them I had some money in the bank to pay rent for a while, and they were fine, didn't even ask for a guarantor. The building was "no pets," but I asked, and I was allowed to keep my cat with a small extra security deposit. Especially if it's a small building, you may find there's more flexibility than you might expect.
Not sure where you were looking, but there are definitely nice apartments in Astoria in the price range you mentioned. There are good deals and crappy deals in that and every other neighborhood. And for what it's worth, I'm a native, non-parentally-assisted New Yorker, as are the friends I mentioned, and we still used brokers. Yes, it sucked, but it's a fact of life in this city that if you refuse to use one, you greatly restrict the number of choices you have. And given how low the city's vacancy rate is, that means you're going to have trouble. Guess we could all move to Iowa or something...
Fact is, everything is negotiable. I negotiated the broker's fee down from 13% to 9%. People think that the "45 times rent" thing is set in stone, but I got a lease without even having a job (I was in between jobs at the time) -- just showed them I had some money in the bank to pay rent for a while, and they were fine, didn't even ask for a guarantor. The building was "no pets," but I asked, and I was allowed to keep my cat with a small extra security deposit. Especially if it's a small building, you may find there's more flexibility than you might expect.
I actually moved to CT (Hartford Cty). Incidents like the entire subway being knocked out because of heavy rain & confiscatory tax burden in NYC along with the absurd cost of living makes me glad I made the move.
Everything may be negotiable but not in a landlords & sellers housing market like we have been in for the past 6 years in NYC. These days landlords & co-op boards are in complete control. Notice how the housing slowdown has not hit the NYC metro area & rents along with sale prices for homes continue to spiral higher.
When I was looking in Astoria back in 2005 or so I couldn't find anything that was worth paying $1,300 - $1,600 a month for. Most one bedroom apartments were smaller than my studio apartment in Flushing that I was paying $800 for at the time.
And I don't know how recently you looked, but the 45 times the monthly rent rule is virtually set in stone along with the requirement of a FICO score of at least 720. My FICO at the time was only 630 with an income of only $68,000 a year at the time, but despite having a perfect 11 year record paying rent at one apartment most brokers told me that I wouln't have a chance without a guarantor.
And I don't know how recently you looked, but the 45 times the monthly rent rule is virtually set in stone along with the requirement of a FICO score of at least 720. My FICO at the time was only 630 with an income of only $68,000 a year at the time, but despite having a perfect 11 year record paying rent at one apartment most brokers told me that I wouln't have a chance without a guarantor.
It was less than a month ago. So, yeah. I don't doubt that what you've said is frequently or even usually true, but it just goes to show that it never hurts to try to negotiate, no matter what the state of the market. I think it also helps to try to deal with a smaller landlord rather than a monster property management company, as a little guy's "rules" might not be as set in stone.
Maybe you had the right idea in getting out of the city. Sadly, some of us aren't in a position to do that.
Real Estate Agents want one thing, MONEY. If you want to live the real New York experience, don't spend thousands of dollars on a broker. Research neighborhoods and walk around the area. Talk to the superintendents about availability and price. Almost all Manhattan apts. REQUIRE renting through a broker. That's total BULL ****. People basically HAND these agents money. I'm thrifty so I find my apartments by how I described above. Don't fall prey to these agents. I'm sure they are good people but they are making money off of naive newcomers and people who don't have time but have money. I am only saying that YOU DON'T NEED A BROKER. It is plenty do-able without them. Be smart, nothing is impossible
From my experience, you can always find an apartment without a broker. HOWEVER, I also noticed that direct rentals from Landlords usually have a higher monthly rent than rentals you would secure from a broker.
From the Landlord perspective, it's a win-win situation. The realter does all the work finding a tenant, shows the apartment, does the credit screen etc, while the eventual tenant pays the fee.
The only reason a landlord would NOT use a realtor, is if he wants to charge more than his apartment is worth on the market, given the neighborhood and conditions of the apartment, or if, he is otherwise shady in some other way.
So if you want to stay in an apartment short-term, by all means, don't use a broker. But if you intend to stay in an apartment long-term, the 1 months rent fee of a broker is worth it, because you save yourself $100-$200 a month on rent in the end. (And after 1-2 years, that broker fee becomes a wash.)
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