U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > New York > New York City
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 04-17-2012, 12:42 PM
 
2,503 posts, read 4,099,718 times
Reputation: 1947

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by bmwguydc View Post
Keith Haring painted the public art piece in 1986 in the playground on 127th Street at the Drive, right near the Willis Avenue Bridge, entitled "Crack is Whack." The mural piece was to send a message to the surrounding community, and has needed restoration, but still stands as a message from the era. I can remember driving through areas of Harlem for one reason or another, such as accident on the Drive, etc. when I was a child, and the devastation that one would see mere blocks from an area like the UES was a stark contrast.

As to gentrification, there's always a negative connotation that it is designed to change everything to luxury, which is not always the case, as there can be gentrification with respect to crafting middle-class enclaves as well, returning such neighborhoods to stability. Manhattan is a different entity, because land is limited, and there is upside potential in areas close to core business areas, but improvements in areas of the Bronx, Brooklyn, and Queens, helped in part by the devastation of crack that spurred a response to combat what the city had become.

Part of the history goes back to the years before crack, when the city was in decay, and near bankruptcy, when many people fled the city for the stability of Westchester, NJ, LI, and CT. As a result, areas fell into disrepair, and rents collapsed, even in some formerly stable areas, as exemplified by brownstones in Brooklyn and Harlem that had been respectable middle-class housing. Crack accelerated the decline, to the point where something had to be done, lest even the remaining stable areas of NYC be swamped.

The UES and better parts of the UWS, as there were still areas of the UWS that were gritty, were also not immune to crime, especially the snatch and grab sort of crime with jewelry or handbags. The subways were a wreck, such that I can count on my fingers how many times I rode them as a child, as I was either driven where I needed to go, or walked during daylight hours only, only with an adult.

The NYCHA was never intended to warehouse and sustain criminal elements, rather such elements robbed the NYCHA from the deserving working class people for whom it was designed, and implemented. I always remember hearing a story from one of my aunts who had a researcher who worked for her law firm, who was thrilled to get a placement in the NYCHA projects, back when they were still pretty stable areas. He looked to it as a leg up, so that he could have a clean, safe environment for his family, and when his educational level improved, and he received a promotion, they moved to a small house on LI. I think that when the decline started in the NYCHA, those who could get out, did so, and only the elderly remained as the buildings sank into disrepair around them. Thus, the projects, by the time crack hit the city had been mixed, and crack devastated any vestiges of the original purpose of the NYCHA.
Well said. And you bring up a good point in that gentrification doesn't always mean transforming the area for the wealthy. I can also we used to transform an area from war-zone low income to middle class neighborhoods. I think that's the direction the Bronx should take in the gentrification process. We all know the Bronx has a high concentration of ghetto low income that make the Bronx undesirable to other people with middle class incomes and higher living standards. Why not cater to these middle class folks and diversify the low income demographics of the Bronx so that the low income culture and stronghold on the Bronx is weakened? So all these "affordable housing" crap you hear being built in the Bronx is doing a disservice to the Bronx as these "affordable housing" complexes cater to the existing low income crowd as oppose to catering to middle class folks. That's why I say that the buzz word "affordable housing" is really code word for low income, subsided housing. It does nothing to improve the quality of the area other than to improve the curb appeal of the block but that too won't last long as the destitutes will deface and vandalize these new buildings as well.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 04-17-2012, 01:38 PM
 
1,552 posts, read 3,060,303 times
Reputation: 1267
last night i went to the yankees game and took the 1 bus home to riverdale
i read the thread and watched the videos and on the bus ride back (not that its a thing of beuty now by any stretch of the imagination) I was thinking that 25 years ago there is no way in hell I would have

1)waited for the bus for 15 mins on 161st and the concourse
2)took the bus through those terrible neighborhoods

The other option of the d train to the a train tot he 1 train would probably also have been a horrible idea

I also play in a baseball league and sometimes we have games at taft high school
There is no way in hell I would have been walking around that neighborhood back then (its still pretty bad now but its a paradise compared to what it used to be)
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-17-2012, 02:37 PM
 
Location: Port Richmond, Staten Island, New York City, New York, 10302
317 posts, read 933,258 times
Reputation: 166
Considering that in 2012 I can stand on my stoop and watch Zombie-fied 20-something-year olds purchase crack on the corner and then proceed to sit on the stoops of other houses on the block (none of them live on my block) and smoke said crack in broad day light on a 75 degree day, I can only imagine what it was like in the 80's, lol. Smh.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-17-2012, 02:37 PM
 
Location: Bronx, NY
5,727 posts, read 19,404,410 times
Reputation: 2351
Quote:
Originally Posted by bxlefty23 View Post
last night i went to the yankees game and took the 1 bus home to riverdale
i read the thread and watched the videos and on the bus ride back (not that its a thing of beuty now by any stretch of the imagination) I was thinking that 25 years ago there is no way in hell I would have

1)waited for the bus for 15 mins on 161st and the concourse
2)took the bus through those terrible neighborhoods

The other option of the d train to the a train tot he 1 train would probably also have been a horrible idea

I also play in a baseball league and sometimes we have games at taft high school
There is no way in hell I would have been walking around that neighborhood back then (its still pretty bad now but its a paradise compared to what it used to be)
The Bronx is pretty much dead. It's a million times better than it was back in the 80's. Same with upper Manhattan. I am speaking about the areas I frequent. I even see white families visit parks in University Heights. If you want gritty dangerous Bronx then you'd have to go Mott Haven/Hunts Point area.

But the western Bronx is dead. DEAD.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-17-2012, 02:38 PM
 
Location: Bronx, New York
4,260 posts, read 7,266,369 times
Reputation: 1916
Folk robbing your top floor apartment by coming off the roof and pushing the top window ledge down in order to get into your house. Now, remember, the top floor is the 8th floor of a public housing project.

Now, consider the danger of that attempt; you fail, and it's 8 stories below! And consider that despite that, the robbers made three additional attempts after the first one. Just to let you know, our family knew who it was. The person was a crazy crack fiend back then, and got some of his friends to attempt the robberies!

That's how bad it was, folk!
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-17-2012, 02:40 PM
 
Location: Bronx, New York
4,260 posts, read 7,266,369 times
Reputation: 1916
Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperMario View Post
The Bronx is pretty much dead. It's a million times better than it was back in the 80's. Same with upper Manhattan. I am speaking about the areas I frequent. I even see white families visit parks in University Heights. If you want gritty dangerous Bronx then you'd have to go Mott Haven/Hunts Point area.

But the western Bronx is dead. DEAD.
The same Mott Haven where there's a nightclub and a yuppie bar down the block from the PJ's? (Gallery Lounge and Bruckner Bar)
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-17-2012, 03:21 PM
 
Location: Harlem World
555 posts, read 1,140,477 times
Reputation: 311
Maybe someone can give me a better idea on this subject.
But is it me or does the city seem to go in dramatic cycles.
mid 1800s-1900s it was a crazy rat house. You had places like 5 points and it was murderville USA
then it turned around In the 40s-50s-60s it was beautiful thriving and people weere probably having simliar conversation to what we are having now, and how they could not imagine living here or being around x amount of years ago
then the 70s-80s-90s hit and it went bad again. Murder at a all time high and people made a run for it.
00-present. Its nice, city clean, prices up and people could not imagine living in the 70-80-90s here.
So I guess enjoy it now while it last and for all those who want the "real" new york back we will just have to wait another decade or so. But when it happens dont complain about it being a total dump and you have to get out of here asap.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-17-2012, 03:48 PM
 
Location: Bronx, NY
5,727 posts, read 19,404,410 times
Reputation: 2351
Quote:
Originally Posted by scatman View Post
The same Mott Haven where there's a nightclub and a yuppie bar down the block from the PJ's? (Gallery Lounge and Bruckner Bar)
The same Mott Haven that had a murder rate over 20 last year (2nd in the city), and the highest robbery/assault rate of any NYC precinct.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-17-2012, 04:02 PM
 
Location: Bronx, New York
4,260 posts, read 7,266,369 times
Reputation: 1916
Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperMario View Post
The same Mott Haven that had a murder rate over 20 last year (2nd in the city), and the highest robbery/assault rate of any NYC precinct.
That would've been a quiet year in the 1980s! (LOL!)

Last edited by scatman; 04-17-2012 at 04:31 PM..
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-17-2012, 04:15 PM
 
Location: USA
8,012 posts, read 10,894,630 times
Reputation: 3443
people would have called that
time "scary" in today's terms.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:



Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > New York > New York City

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:45 PM.

© 2005-2023, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top