Why hasn't NYC SUBWAY SYSTEM ever had service betw. BRONX & QUEENS and then betw. STATEN ISLAND & MANHATTAN or BROOKLYN? (New York: middle-class, transferring to)
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Another thing to think about: Think about how much time and money was spent to build 8 miles of track for the JFK AirTrain.
In NYC there are numerous above ground train tracks to nowhere as well as there are numerous tunnels that have not seen a train in decades and some not at all.
The subway systems were built to remove mass transit from street level. Whether "sub-way" or elevated, they were an improvement over rail & trolley lines on clogged city streets. They were built by private companies, backed by NYC bonds, who competed with each other, and sought to make money, not necessarily provide a public service to neighborhoods that were not even built yet. The money was made by getting people to and from downtown.
Any actual proof of this?
Same as everywhere else in the country, and what people actually wanted.
What? The fare was 5 cents! How many rich bankers & lawyers, do you think there were, in the financial districts? The systems were built to get huge numbers of workers downtown, not a few bosses! http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi..._Ridership.pdf
In 1901, there were 253 million fares. That's almost 5 million fares per week, 2.5 million round trips. NYC's population was 3.4 million.
Thank you for the useful links about the never-done subway projects!
Okay, first, I'll go system by system because todays MTA is the combination of the original 3 systems.
The Interborough Rapid Transit, todays 1-7 lines, started life in Manhattan. Back when the first subway opened, they also operated 4 elevated lines in Manhattan which have since been closed. The final one being closed in 1955. Most of their lines took people from the built up downtown, the the suburbs of Harlem, Washington Heights, and the not yet built up Bronx. The Flushing line took people from manhattan to queens which, back in 1915, was still mostly farm land. That is why you'll almost always find tenament apartments along these lines.
Brooklyn Rapid Transit Company, later Brooklyn-MAnhattan Transit, todays lines J/Z, L, N, Q, Most of the R and New M. The B and D after crossing the Bridge and the F after Church Avenue. These lines ran mostly in Brooklyn, MAnhattan, and Queens. The BMT had actually begun constructing a subway to Staten Island, in fact, it got as far as 150 feet under the Narrows before construction was stopped. Why? Because Staten Island didn't want it and Mayor Hylan was also to blame.
The INDependent Subway, the original A-G. Portions of the R and M as well today. These were the lines that replaced the Elevateds of Manhattan and most of the Brooklyn Els. This system was are marvel and the goal was to put the other companies out of business and/or take over several Rights of way. That is why most of the A-G lines run parallel to and IRT or BMT line. The master IND plan was for no one in most parts of the city to be more than a half mile from subway. What we see today are the INDs First system. There were plans for a second system and provisions were built. Unfortunately, since the country was still in a depression, money could not be found to build it. There are rumors that the IND had a third system planned.
Most of the city's development followed the subways and Els so you can kinda say it built the city.
On 6/1/1940 on midnight, the 3 systems were consolidated into one entity, the current routing system was born in 1979, and MTA New York City Transit is as it's known today.
Lastly, unless a system runs 24/7/365 for an affordable fare and has regular Express/Local service while touching many parts of the city, no one other than us has the right to say we're the best in the world.
Okay, first, I'll go system by system because todays MTA is the combination of the original 3 systems.
The Interborough Rapid Transit, todays 1-7 lines, started life in Manhattan. Back when the first subway opened, they also operated 4 elevated lines in Manhattan which have since been closed. The final one being closed in 1955. Most of their lines took people from the built up downtown, the the suburbs of Harlem, Washington Heights, and the not yet built up Bronx. The Flushing line took people from manhattan to queens which, back in 1915, was still mostly farm land. That is why you'll almost always find tenament apartments along these lines.
Brooklyn Rapid Transit Company, later Brooklyn-MAnhattan Transit, todays lines J/Z, L, N, Q, Most of the R and New M. The B and D after crossing the Bridge and the F after Church Avenue. These lines ran mostly in Brooklyn, MAnhattan, and Queens. The BMT had actually begun constructing a subway to Staten Island, in fact, it got as far as 150 feet under the Narrows before construction was stopped. Why? Because Staten Island didn't want it and Mayor Hylan was also to blame.
The INDependent Subway, the original A-G. Portions of the R and M as well today. These were the lines that replaced the Elevateds of Manhattan and most of the Brooklyn Els. This system was are marvel and the goal was to put the other companies out of business and/or take over several Rights of way. That is why most of the A-G lines run parallel to and IRT or BMT line. The master IND plan was for no one in most parts of the city to be more than a half mile from subway. What we see today are the INDs First system. There were plans for a second system and provisions were built. Unfortunately, since the country was still in a depression, money could not be found to build it. There are rumors that the IND had a third system planned.
Most of the city's development followed the subways and Els so you can kinda say it built the city.
On 6/1/1940 on midnight, the 3 systems were consolidated into one entity, the current routing system was born in 1979, and MTA New York City Transit is as it's known today.
Lastly, unless a system runs 24/7/365 for an affordable fare and has regular Express/Local service while touching many parts of the city, no one other than us has the right to say we're the best in the world.
Yes, that's what's so great about the Greater New York City Metropolitan Area. ALL of the subway lines run 24/7/365 (both the MTA serving NYC and the PATH serving between Manhattan and New Jersey) and even the commuter rail runs 24/7/365 (both the Long Island Railroad and the Metro-North Railroad going north of New York City). And even the Staten Island Ferry runs 24/7/365.
I think (???) that ALL the MTA buses run 24/7/365 as well. Do all the MTA bus lines, in fact, run 24/7/365? Or just some of them? Or none of them do? (Looking at a few sample bus schedules on the MTA web site, it didn't "seem" like they had buses running in the middle of the night in Queens, for instance . . . between midnight and 7 am).
I don't know if your question was answered, but what I know is that they doing everything new. I always travel the #1 train and for a month I was unable to use it because my stop was on construction Although I hate the subway, they doing a good job!
What? The fare was 5 cents! How many rich bankers & lawyers, do you think there were, in the financial districts? The systems were built to get huge numbers of workers downtown, not a few bosses! http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi..._Ridership.pdf
In 1901, there were 253 million fares. That's almost 5 million fares per week, 2.5 million round trips. NYC's population was 3.4 million.
Workers meaning middle class clerks in finance, not factory workers. There's a reason why the Lower East Side was (and still is) so poorly served despite having an enormous population at the time. They were not the people who took the subway.
Many major industrial areas of the period, like the Brooklyn Navy Yard, were left out as well.
Say there were a million riders a day. That would be 500K round-trip commutes, which is only around 14 percent of the population.
Yes, that's what's so great about the Greater New York City Metropolitan Area. ALL of the subway lines run 24/7/365 (both the MTA serving NYC and the PATH serving between Manhattan and New Jersey) and even the commuter rail runs 24/7/365 (both the Long Island Railroad and the Metro-North Railroad going north of New York City). And even the Staten Island Ferry runs 24/7/365.
I think (???) that ALL the MTA buses run 24/7/365 as well. Do all the MTA bus lines, in fact, run 24/7/365? Or just some of them? Or none of them do? (Looking at a few sample bus schedules on the MTA web site, it didn't "seem" like they had buses running in the middle of the night in Queens, for instance . . . between midnight and 7 am).
Metro-North doesn't run 24/7. Only a couple of LIRR branches run 24/7.
Only some of the buses run 24/7, but most neighborhoods in NYC have at least one bus line that runs 24/7 (they usually run every hour, and it might only be in one direction, like north-south or east-west, whereas during the day, you have service in all directions)
Heavy, underground rail is very costly to build and there isn't a critical mass of riders wanting to go from Brooklyn to the Bronx to justify the expense, as evinced by the cutback on the G Train.
To be fair, the G train numbers are not a useful stat here since the G train has almost no useful layovers with other subway lines and is only used by people who live within a walking distance of a G train stop.
The IND built the G as a shortcut from Brooklyn to Queens. It's used by a lot of people, it was cut back to Court Square during the daytime hours when the V train was introduced. That's the same reason why it runs half length trains, the extra cars were needed for the V. And Every transfer the G has is very useful.
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Although I hate the subway, they doing a good job!
