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Old 06-26-2012, 10:55 PM
 
Location: Harlem, NY
7,871 posts, read 7,769,196 times
Reputation: 4113

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the south bronx needs to be redeveloped. BADLY. 138th, 141st, 149th, morris, all in mott haven. every last abandoned warehouse, car wash, non working gas station, or non use building in the area, should be demo'd. i like the changes that are happening along third ave, but for the south bronx to reach its potential, sweeping changes need to be made, at once.
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Old 06-26-2012, 10:58 PM
 
Location: Bronx, New York
4,436 posts, read 7,643,750 times
Reputation: 2049
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harlem resident View Post
One of the young people in my neighborhood explained to me that people in his church were telling them how to annoy the "new people" - litter, try to hold them up getting on the train, make noise. Hang out on the steps all night. Increase the motorbike-brat presence. Take up the whole park with barbecues populated by sullen and hostile people. And so on.

And yes, this is a true story.
I would love to know who, in church, were telling youth to "annoy new people". Were they laypersons, or people in leadership positions? (pastor, minister, deacon, trustee). It may seem unimaginable that anyone from a place of worship would encourage harrassment of its neighbors. But given my experiences with some parents of young people in church, or people, period, it is unfortunate that that idea may not be too far-fetched.
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Old 06-27-2012, 08:12 AM
 
8,743 posts, read 18,321,531 times
Reputation: 4168
The fact that this story is coming to light is GOOD NEWS actually. Why do I say that? Because it means there are inroads being made, and the fight is growing, and change is in the air. If we didn't hear these stories, or didn't hear people struggling to bring change to the community, THEN you should be worried.

But as I stated before, this same article was written in the LES in 1980, UWS (in the lower 100s) in 1990, in Hells Kitchen and parts of Brooklyn in 1995, in Harlem in 2000, and now the Southern Bronx in 2010. The trend is clear, and change is coming.

On a side note 2 things recently occured in my particular corner of Mott Haven/Woodstock:

1. I have a white transplant (teacher) neighbor who bought a new construction 3 family home and has been living here for 3+ years now. I saw him Monday morning walking towards the Jackson Ave train at 7:30 am and a "local" was yelling at him in the middle of the street: "You in the wrong neighborhood twinkle toes. This ain't Harlem!" I had to laugh about that....so now he belongs in Harlem...the irony! Needless to say the bum was all talk, destitute, and ignorant. My friend ignored him. He began walking towards me and said "You better follow your friend back on that train." To which I replied "Good morning to you too" and kept walking. Just remember, these people are 99% talk and are beaten down, destitute, and have nothing but hate inside them..best to ignore them.

2. Another white hipster cluster moved into the adjacent new construction 3 family house about a month ago. The fact that they are now venturing outside of the Port Morris area and into my particular area right above Mott Haven (Woodstock) is very telling.

Anecdotal? Absolutely...but the more change impacted in the community, the more pushback from a small minority of "Locals" you will see. And to me, that's a good thing..because it means the change is being felt by everyone now.
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Old 06-27-2012, 11:24 AM
 
Location: South Bronx
51 posts, read 104,098 times
Reputation: 64
Pic is too funny!
Attached Thumbnails
Neighbors Struggle to Coexist on Bronx Block After New Co-Op Opens-22588211.jpg  
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Old 06-27-2012, 01:14 PM
 
2,691 posts, read 4,314,123 times
Reputation: 2311
Quote:
Originally Posted by NooYowkur81 View Post
I would advise the people in the co-op to develop a relationship with the precinct. It will help. If cops think you care about your neighborhood they see that.

That picture of the old puertorican looking man sitting by the no loittering sign is hilarious btw...and judging by what he says in the article he is definitely doing it on purpose and trying to push buttons. The Bronx has the most parkland of any borough. You could get lost in Van Cortlandt and not come out for a month. There is no excuse for people hanging out on the street like that...
Ok I just looked up the exact address of this Co-Op and there are two very large, very green, parks within a VERY short walking distance, 5-10 minutes, (Claremont Park and Crotona Park). Why on earth would anyone choose to hang out in lawn chairs on a sidewalk when there is a perfectly decent park up the block? As silly as it sounds, I can almost understand (but don't condone) the lawn chair loitering if there is no decent public space around and/or you don't have outdoor space of your own. I get it, sometimes it's nice to just sit outside, but there are two parks right up the block
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Old 06-27-2012, 01:28 PM
 
2,517 posts, read 4,241,649 times
Reputation: 1948
Quote:
Originally Posted by jad2k View Post
Ok I just looked up the exact address of this Co-Op and there are two very large, very green, parks within a VERY short walking distance, 5-10 minutes, (Claremont Park and Crotona Park). Why on earth would anyone choose to hang out in lawn chairs on a sidewalk when there is a perfectly decent park up the block? As silly as it sounds, I can almost understand (but don't condone) the lawn chair loitering if there is no decent public space around and/or you don't have outdoor space of your own. I get it, sometimes it's nice to just sit outside, but there are two parks right up the block
They hang out in lawn chairs cause THEY LIKE THE ATTENTION. They like to be seen. It's pretty much an open invitation for other neighborhood people to come chill with them. Before you know it, it's hang out city!
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Old 06-27-2012, 02:20 PM
 
7,296 posts, read 11,813,703 times
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Also in the sidewalks, there are fire hydrants nearby that they can pry open.
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Old 06-27-2012, 03:48 PM
 
Location: West Harlem
6,885 posts, read 9,887,670 times
Reputation: 3062
Quote:
Originally Posted by scatman View Post
I would love to know who, in church, were telling youth to "annoy new people". Were they laypersons, or people in leadership positions? (pastor, minister, deacon, trustee). It may seem unimaginable that anyone from a place of worship would encourage harrassment of its neighbors. But given my experiences with some parents of young people in church, or people, period, it is unfortunate that that idea may not be too far-fetched.
It was my impression that he meant the other congregants.
I cannot imagine that this would be officially advocated !
Although, look at the congregation of ATLAH (? I think). Not exactly the same, but still.
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Old 06-27-2012, 03:52 PM
 
Location: Bronx, NY
5,720 posts, read 19,993,785 times
Reputation: 2358
I really don't see what's wrong with people hanging out in front of their building. We humans are not supposed to live crammed up in a 6 story building. This is not natural. Many of the people loitering are just there to get fresh air, and to socialize with their neighbors. As for parkland? Some people live far from actual parks, and when it is nice outside, the park is full of people. It doesn't have the advantage of being close to home either. Where as, if you're chilling on the block, your apartment is right there. No wasted money on gas, metrocards, and doctor scholls (if you walk far enough). As for the fire hydrant? big deal. In my block and neighborhood, all the fire hydrants open full blast on extremely hot days. Nobody is doing anything wrong, unless trying to cool down is wrong. I will however concede, that I have called 311 a couple of times when the open hydrant restricts water to my apartment. They are really slow to respond though, but that's another topic. As long as I still have access to water, I live and let live.

The southern Bronx sucks. That is a basic fact of life. Too many Puerto Ricans and African Americans, who don't go to school, and who are in generational poverty. The real killer of the south Bronx is all the housing projects. Where I live, you'd have to go pretty far to encounter NYCHA. Not so in the neighborhoods south of 174th street. Those people who moved into the Coops should have done research. I can't believe that a elderly man sitting on a lawn chair suddenly becomes a quality of life issue to these overly sensitive entitled losers.

If the loiterers are selling drugs, smoking weed, robbing and assaulting people , etc then I understand wanting them to leave. That should not be tolerated. But just sitting down socializing, or having a BBQ, or listening to Soca/reggae/calypso (this is directed to you BXguyanese, stop using Merengue as an example, it's not PR music, Salsa is), really? lol
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Old 06-27-2012, 03:56 PM
 
7,296 posts, read 11,813,703 times
Reputation: 3266
There is nothing wrong if they hang out in front of their own buildings. But if they hang out in front of someone else's building and the residents there are bothered (because the way to and from their homes is obstructed), then it becomes a problem. Why don't you see that happening in the UES?
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