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When the median income of a NYer is about $45K, but the median cost of a one family house is $540,000, that doesnt sound very manageable to me. I only know two people anywhere near my age (under 30) who own any housing of their own. This is also something you must factor in. Also, the homeownership rate in New York is only 30%. Renting a two-bedroom apartment in South Jamaica, NY, which is not Beverly Hills by any stretch of the imagination, will cost you at least $1200/month. Try paying that if you make $2000-3000 per month before taxes and still eating/going out and paying other bills. The fact is that most people in New York "manage" their living expenses by having roommates, living with spouses/significant others, or just living at home.
I do not know one single person who lives by themselves in this city, NOT ONE!
I do (live on my own -- woo hooo!!) but only pay $849 for a studio in Flushing Queens. A one bedroom in the same neighborhood would be double $1,600 or more + the standard 15% brokers fee which has extended far past Manhattan. There is no reason to spend close to $2,000 in rent or put down
$60,000 in cash to 'BUY' a tiny apartment
And you are right, $540,000 for a 'median house' (in South Jamica right??) or $1,200 for rent on a two bedroom (in South Jamica) is unmanageable if you are like the average NY'er and blow all your money on overrated 'Clubs & Lounges' & designer clothes from Soho. But that is more important for most people here, following the trends, wearing the right clothes, driving the right car (which is usually leased), going out to 'right places' other than saving & investing. I guess that is why most live with roomates or mom & dad until they are in their 40's.
And you are right, $540,000 for a 'median house' (in South Jamica right??)
People who live in new homes built in lower income areas get subsidies from the gov't to stay in the areas. Some buy the homes with the discount and rent it out from upstate, or Florida, or wherever they go. And all these homes in low income areas are not single family. These are multifamily. 2-3 family homes. The owner uses the rent from the 1-2 tenents to pay off the house.
And people try not to move much anymore thanks to the crazy real estate prices. It's unbelieveable the rents even in low income areas. That's why so many are on gov't assistance.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NickL28
So, we should ignore FBI stats; instead we should trust your in-depth statistical analysis, which doesn't exist?
LOL
I work in a precinct in a high crime area, in NYC. Unless the bullets come out of the floors in Atlanta, it can't be any worse. The worst areas are the worst everywhere, with slight variations, drug wars, gang wars ect. These murders most of the time have an intended target, it's always been that way. The ghetto/low income areas are always bad in every city. The downtowns, tourist areas never have too much of a problem.
Actually Washington Heights is getting nicer - especially near the River. Gentrification has moved in and the less desirable elements are moving out. And, thanks to the A train, it's not far to midtown.
There are also nice neighborhoods (like Long Island City) which have better rents and are ONE subway stop from Manhattan.
Atlanta? It's minute compared to NYC. Maybe it's because it's the south, but I find Atlanta pretty dull. Not cosmopolitan. Not easy to get around. But I've live in NYC most of my life and think the only city that comes close is Chicago.
When the median income of a NYer is about $45K, but the median cost of a one family house is $540,000, that doesnt sound very manageable to me. I only know two people anywhere near my age (under 30) who own any housing of their own. This is also something you must factor in. Also, the homeownership rate in New York is only 30%. Renting a two-bedroom apartment in South Jamaica, NY, which is not Beverly Hills by any stretch of the imagination, will cost you at least $1200/month. Try paying that if you make $2000-3000 per month before taxes and still eating/going out and paying other bills. The fact is that most people in New York "manage" their living expenses by having roommates, living with spouses/significant others, or just living at home.
I do not know one single person who lives by themselves in this city, NOT ONE!
I do (live on my own -- woo hooo!!) but only pay $849 for a studio in Flushing Queens. A one bedroom in the same neighborhood would be double $1,600 or more + the standard 15% brokers fee which has extended far past Manhattan. There is no reason to spend close to $2,000 in rent or put down
$60,000 in cash to 'BUY' a tiny apartment
And you are right, $540,000 for a 'median house' (in South Jamica right??) or $1,200 for rent on a two bedroom (in South Jamica) is unmanageable if you are like the average NY'er and blow all your money on overrated 'Clubs & Lounges' & designer clothes from Soho. But that is more important for most people here, following the trends, wearing the right clothes, driving the right car (which is usually leased), going out to 'right places' other than saving & investing. I guess that is why most live with roomates or mom & dad until they are in their 40's.
I grew up in NY and eventually had to move out of state because of the cost of living. In NY, it's pretty normal to find grown adults in their 30s still living at home with mom & dad; or living in a basement; or a rented room (yeah a room, not an apt). It's insane. I think NY is the best city in this whole country but I got tired of living like i was on welfare when in fact, i am a college educated professional. Now i can't afford to go back at all. It really is a city for the very poor and the very rich. If you did not buy real estate there already, you better come up like Donald Trump to buy something now. I miss NY every single day but now that i'm in my mid 30s, i'm thinking long term and I need to save money for my future instead of wasting it on $12 martinis. That was the going price last time I was there. Has it gone up since?
Has anyone been to Chicago? Is it similar to New York or what is different? I would like to visit there and check it out to.
Chicago is similar to New York in the hustle and bustle of the downtown area, and the massive skyscrapers and such, but there's a different vibe to it. While a huge city in it's own right, Chicago seems much more manageable and less intimidating than New York. In New York, there is just so much....more....or everything. There's more people, more skyscrapers, more neon lights, more horn-honking, more siren-wailing, and it extends far out, not being contained to just the city, but also residential neighborhoods as well. In Chicago, this activity seems to be more concentrated. There seems to be much more quiet residential neighborhoods in Chicago, removed from the hustle and bustle and at a lower-density than in New York.
What else is different? Well, winters in Chicago are more brutal than they are in New York and there can be a very chilly wind coming off Lake Michigan as well. Another difference is the incorporation of the water in daily life in Chicago. Chicago lies right on the lake and there are actual sand beaches (albeit tiny) with bike paths and volleyball courts in good condition and used by residents, lining the shore. I suppose the same can be said for New York (Coney Island and such) but in Chicago, it just seems to work better. Both cities are extremely cosmopolitan but New York is moreso and much more integrated than Chicago and while there are old school ethnically insular and closed-minded communities in New York, they are few and far between nowadays, and people are far more likely to live and work and rub shoulders together in New York than they are in Chicago which has been ranked in the past as the nation's most segregated city. Then there are the people. New Yorkers of course tend to be more brash, aggressive, sarcastic and fast-paced, whereas Chicagoans are less so of all the above.
Oh, and they say "pop" instead of soda in Chicago.
When I mean manageable I meant for a young single in his 20s or 30s. Personally I do not see the need for somebody who does not have a family to have a huge house. Why not settle for an apartment because it a house for one person just sounds ridiculous to me.
You make a valid point when you point out rents are too high for a single person renting an apartment or when a family cannot afford a decent amount of living space. I am wholeheartdly for affordable housing and rent controls because working class people need to survive.
NYLATINQT-
I really think you made a good response. You epitomized the fustrations endured by many that try to struggle in NYC. I thought it was one of the more effective portrayals of the struggle. And you really point out the growing class divide that exists.
All I can say move to where you feel more comfortable. I hear Atlanta is getting very expensive...and at some point its prices will rival that of NYC.
But you know I do not think any other city will get as big as NYC. The whole metropolis identity is unique to NYC where building upon building exists and a whole island full of skyscrapers and neighborhoods. I think if any other city tried to go the NYC route they would face too much resistance.
I've lived in the Bronx, Brooklyn, Manhattan, Rochester(upstate) and now Jersey City. Well I had a one bedroom for 11 years in Washington Heights and moved out when the rent was $646. The building went down terribly. Folks moved in who played their music so loud the glassess in my cabinets shook till 4am on a SUNDAY night. The cops just laughed if you phoned in a complaint. People were partying in the lobby who didn't live in the building. The super let some guy handle the mopping who used the same water three times over and took to sifting through the garbage like a spy. Mailboxes were broken into and graffiti began to deface the walls. Now there were some senior citizens who lived there like 50-60 years and to see a once beautiful building become a hellhole had them in tears. I was in tears too when I gave up a Manhattan one bedroom for $646.
Now my apartment is going condo and I'm like o.k. I think it's time to relocate to the southeast like so many others have done. Urban chaos has left me weary.
atlanta is over rated i think "six of one half a dozen of the other. NYC is a much busier place and the jobs pay more and there is a higher chance of getting a second job. you do not have to drive everywhere and the house is in line with the income (not always sometimes) but atlanta doesnt pay much, the traffic, weather and crime is bad so is it just the cheap house that one should think about? living in nyc you just have to know your priority like everywhere you make money save it and live your life. People tend to make alot and spend alot that cannot happen then blame yourself bc anywhere you live you have to have goals and keep your eyes on the prize. Frankly speaking if nyc offers everything at my fingertip why should i move to atl where getting a job is so hard and traffic is bad, no subway and crime rate is high, i prefer nyc any day bc i learn to control the city, the city doesnt control me and a one bedroom in atl for $800 is the same here or less and... yeah i have a friend in long island who pays 750 for a gorgeous 1 1/2 bedroom so nyc anytime over atl.
You'll need your car for Atlanta. You'll drive to work, drive home, drive to go out, drive to do errands. NYC you'll walk to the train, walk for our errands, walk to go out. IMO NYC is a better place to merge with people. You'll be isolated in ATL in your car. You may as well go to any suburb in America if cheap is what you're looking for cause there's no difference between ATL and a common place suburb.
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I Agree
The building went down terribly. Folks moved in who played their music so loud the glassess in my cabinets shook till 4am on a SUNDAY night. The cops just laughed if you phoned in a complaint. People were partying in the lobby who didn't live in the building. The super let some guy handle the mopping who used the same water three times over and took to sifting through the garbage like a spy. Mailboxes were broken into and graffiti began to deface the walls. Now there were some senior citizens who lived there like 50-60 years and to see a once beautiful building become a hellhole had them in tears. I was in tears too when I gave up a Manhattan one bedroom for $646.
