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Old 12-11-2015, 11:08 PM
 
1,015 posts, read 1,080,364 times
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Originally Posted by hilltopjay View Post
The Bronx is about to get another chance to lift the curse of the Kingsbridge Armory, with two new proposals to develop the site. But it will have to overcome stiff opposition by the local soviets that have thwarted commercial enterprise at the “people’s armory” for years.

Only two years ago, recall, Bronx Borough President Ruben Diaz’s insistence on a special minimum wage scuttled a plan for the armory by the Related Companies that promised 2,200 jobs.

But The Bronx never misses an opportunity to miss an opportunity.

Some just resist change. Others — like the local activists who’ve been trained in the spirit of leftist organizer Saul Alinsky — don’t even need an excuse.

Then there are shakedown artists who’ll demand the usual bribe: the “community benefits agreement,” in the form, perhaps, of another blanket “living wage” minimum or funding for a school or preferences for locals. They’ll cite bogus “concerns” until the developer caves — and then brag of their big victory.

Unless, of course, the developers walk, as Related did — and The Bronx loses out yet again. Bronx residents can’t afford to let that happen this time. Fortunately, both Mayor Bloomberg and Diaz now appear determined to check off the armory as done on their “to-do” lists. And two promising proposals have emerged.

The first is the Kingsbridge National Ice Center — a plan for a world-class ice-hockey and skating-sports facility featuring nine rinks and an ice-sports-themed middle school. The second is an indoor Times Square-style commercial venture anchored by small retailers, a cineplex and a Crunch Gym.

Either would mark a huge step forward for the borough.

Yet, predictably, the Luddites are already vowing to fight any possible good news.

Insiders, for instance, think the ice center will get the nod. If so, critics will charge that Bloomberg and Diaz greased the skids in favor of NHL legend Mark Messier and Olympic champion Sarah Hughes, who are behind the project.

They’ll revive the ESPN E60 report on the dangers of “carbon monoxide, nitrogen dioxide or ultrafine particles” from poorly maintained Zambonis.

They’ll scaremonger over the idea of nine ice rinks using ammonia-based refrigeration systems. They’ll raise faux safety concerns by citing an ice-house in Florida that exploded when ammonia gas leaked.

Such warnings may sound laughable in a borough that already suffers the highest childhood-asthma and COPD rates in the city. But lamer notions have killed even more exciting plans in New York.

Yet the National Ice Center may represent just the kind of out-of-the-box thinking that will bring the borough positive attention, not to mention 3 million visitors annually.

The second bid, for the commercial center, comes from immigrant real-estate entrepreneur Young Woo — who certainly has the imagination and financial chops to make it a success. Like his planned Pier 57 redo, Young Woo’s Armory concept is an artsy open-air market with rental space for artists and small businesses. The plan revolves around a “zocalo,” or town square — a dynamic reflection of its host community.

Two years ago, Forbes magazine described Young Woo as having a feel for the pulse of New York. The same can be said of his armory plan, which intends to capture the frenetic energy of The Bronx and transplant it indoors.

Alas, that positive, caged excitement is exactly what some Bronx leaders don’t want. Like survivors of some terrible violence, some of the old-timers wrongly believe that embracing something new means betraying those who didn’t survive the trauma of arson, drugs and economic dislocation that long wracked Bronx neighborhoods.

But The Bronx will never turn the economic corner until more of its people let go of the familiar and embrace a bold future.

The hope is that the shakedown attempts, scare tactics and fear of change won’t be enough to “ice” either plan.

Bronxites must stand up to the activists and extortionists. We must cease picking at old psychic wounds and embrace an unfamiliar, but hopeful, future.

Too much is riding on redeveloping the Kingsbridge Armory, changing The Bronx’s trajectory and making it a destination point for the greater community. Bloomberg and Diaz must be allowed to build something — finally — to attract new life and offer hope to those who live here.


Benjamin: Will Bronx bozos kill Kingsbridge Armory again? - NYPOST.com
LMAO!!! "The Local Soviets" demanding "Community Benefit Agreements" hahaha that is so funny bro!

All I'm going to say is that Kingsbrigdge Armory should not be a Iceskating rink. This is not something that benefits the mostly Dominican community in the area. I used to live and go to high school in the area. It should become a community center with social services, free public education, and public works programs for the community. Perhaps manufacturing or something of that sort.

The Soviets are only demanding that the jobs be living wage, which is not an unfair request where over half the population lives in poverty due to a lack of living wage jobs.
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Old 12-12-2015, 06:20 AM
 
25,539 posts, read 22,454,969 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BoogeyDownDweller View Post
LMAO!!! "The Local Soviets" demanding "Community Benefit Agreements" hahaha that is so funny bro!

All I'm going to say is that Kingsbrigdge Armory should not be a Iceskating rink. This is not something that benefits the mostly Dominican community in the area. I used to live and go to high school in the area. It should become a community center with social services, free public education, and public works programs for the community. Perhaps manufacturing or something of that sort.

The Soviets are only demanding that the jobs be living wage, which is not an unfair request where over half the population lives in poverty due to a lack of living wage jobs.
The mostly Dominican community is going to get gentrified out. It is already happening in Harlem and Washington Heights.

As for a community center with social services, public works, etc., who is going to pay for it?

Clearly not NYC taxpayers. Clearly not the federal government which gives tax credits to developers to basically get rid of rent stabilized apartments and displace people.

Fordham or Lehman could use the facilities, sure. But there is a reason it will not become affordable housing. Poor people will be pushed out of NYC to poor suburbs or poor small towns, and that's for the ones that stay in the Northeast.
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Old 12-12-2015, 06:07 PM
 
16,016 posts, read 12,807,693 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NyWriterdude View Post
The mostly Dominican community is going to get gentrified out. It is already happening in Harlem and Washington Heights.

As for a community center with social services, public works, etc., who is going to pay for it?

Clearly not NYC taxpayers. Clearly not the federal government which gives tax credits to developers to basically get rid of rent stabilized apartments and displace people.

Fordham or Lehman could use the facilities, sure. But there is a reason it will not become affordable housing. Poor people will be pushed out of NYC to poor suburbs or poor small towns, and that's for the ones that stay in the Northeast.
A community center with a pool, and other things, the patrons still have to pay. In Flushing, there is the FMCP aquatic center, and across is a little gymnasium. It is owned by the city, and still you have to pay for membership. It is cheap though.

The armory is too big for a community center alone though. You can do many things with it, but a national ice skating center is not one of them.
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Old 12-12-2015, 06:48 PM
 
1,015 posts, read 1,080,364 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ Brazen_3133 View Post
A community center with a pool, and other things, the patrons still have to pay. In Flushing, there is the FMCP aquatic center, and across is a little gymnasium. It is owned by the city, and still you have to pay for membership. It is cheap though.

The armory is too big for a community center alone though. You can do many things with it, but a national ice skating center is not one of them.
I agree more with this. More forget the issue of living wage jobs for a second, and just think about a National Ice Center in the Bronx. It's kind of like building a beach in alaska, doesn't make alot of sense for the community. Such a valuable, large, undeveloped space; more thought should go into what this becomes then just sort of letting the developers decide. The reason I found OP's comment so hilarious is because he's acting like community involvement in the decision making process is "over the top" when I think actually it's being marginalized. The community SHOULD have a BIG say in this. If this is done right, it could revitalize the area in a beautiful way.
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Old 12-12-2015, 08:26 PM
 
25,539 posts, read 22,454,969 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ Brazen_3133 View Post
A community center with a pool, and other things, the patrons still have to pay. In Flushing, there is the FMCP aquatic center, and across is a little gymnasium. It is owned by the city, and still you have to pay for membership. It is cheap though.

The armory is too big for a community center alone though. You can do many things with it, but a national ice skating center is not one of them.
Sure you can do a national ice skating center. Same as they did a big stadium (Yankee) and a big botanical park and zoo in the Bronx. If you'd ask for community input for that stuff from the current Bronx residents it wouldn't have that either.

They'll just market it to people around the metro area, and I'm sure will get other sporting events there.
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Old 12-12-2015, 11:23 PM
 
1,015 posts, read 1,080,364 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NyWriterdude View Post
Sure you can do a national ice skating center. Same as they did a big stadium (Yankee) and a big botanical park and zoo in the Bronx. If you'd ask for community input for that stuff from the current Bronx residents it wouldn't have that either.

They'll just market it to people around the metro area, and I'm sure will get other sporting events there.
Yeah the point is that we don't want another zoo, botanical garden, or stadium. That is precisely what I think the community is trying to avoid. With such a large part of Bronx residents living in poverty the price of admission to these places put all three out of reach of the average Bronx family. They actually act as just tourist destinations. Tourists and folks from Manhattan are the only ones who get to enjoy perhaps the three nicest things about the Bronx. Tickets for the botanical garden, zoo, and cheaps seats at Yankee Stadium run $30 each. That's a utility or phone bill for a family, and most families don't have that kind of disposible income to begin with. The problem is that the botanical garden, zoo, and yankee stadium give very little back to the community in this sense, and so Bronx residents want that to be different with whatever comes out of the armory.
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Old 12-12-2015, 11:31 PM
 
16,016 posts, read 12,807,693 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NyWriterdude View Post
Sure you can do a national ice skating center. Same as they did a big stadium (Yankee) and a big botanical park and zoo in the Bronx. If you'd ask for community input for that stuff from the current Bronx residents it wouldn't have that either.

They'll just market it to people around the metro area, and I'm sure will get other sporting events there.
Will this national ice center have a high level team playing there like NAHL, or USHL, or USNDT?

Yankee stadium was there when the socio-economics and demographics of the area were different, but even still baseball is more well suited for that area than ice hockey, or figure skating. Same with the Zoo and botanical gardens. Unless the Rangers start playing at this national ice center, placing it on Jerome Ave and 225th St is a bad idea.

Plus Yankee Stadium, zoo, and gardens are right off of a highway. The armory is not.

The Bronx has a number of private schools with a hockey team, and one is close by: Fordham Prep for example. You can possible do what they have done in Flushing with the FMCP Aquatic Center. There is the World Ice Arena right in the same building. This would be more useful. You can do figure skating, youth hockey, and open skating, all for fees. It would pay for itself.

But still, that idea wont fill up the whole armory. It will only be about half or less. The other half can be divided into further lots and sold off to investors.
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Old 12-13-2015, 04:16 AM
 
Location: Concourse
578 posts, read 901,787 times
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You are all missing the point that, as a destination center, the KNIC will bring people into the area who will spend money locally generating economic opportunity for the businesses and residents. That is why the community board supports it. Economic development (Jobs) for locals and safer streets are a good thing for the community and the Bronx as a whole. The Zoo, Botanical Gardens, and Yankee Stadium do all of this, too.
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Old 12-13-2015, 09:10 AM
 
Location: Bronx, NY
5,727 posts, read 19,419,367 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NyWriterdude View Post
The mostly Dominican community is going to get gentrified out. It is already happening in Harlem and Washington Heights.

As for a community center with social services, public works, etc., who is going to pay for it?

Clearly not NYC taxpayers. Clearly not the federal government which gives tax credits to developers to basically get rid of rent stabilized apartments and displace people.

Fordham or Lehman could use the facilities, sure. But there is a reason it will not become affordable housing. Poor people will be pushed out of NYC to poor suburbs or poor small towns, and that's for the ones that stay in the Northeast.
Don't say that.
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Old 12-13-2015, 10:44 AM
 
11,445 posts, read 9,534,396 times
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Originally Posted by SuperMario View Post
Don't say that.
Yeah I don't agree with that either to be honest

Just because there are more white people in the Bronx and upper Manhattan now than 20 years ago doesn't mean that the Dominican population will mostly disappear, at least not any time soon
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