[B]Help on landlord tenants issue----please[/B] (lease, eviction)

[md87]

[/b]This is a 2 family house in queens and all units are rented out. The 1st floor apt is rented to a single guy A. A only put his name on the lease even though he has his uncle and other 2 guys with him. And the lease expired 1 year ago, so after that they are month to month. In July, A sent me text message saying they will move out end of August. So they didn't pay rent for August, instead they used 1 month deposit as rent. I was stupid to trust them until I found out they won't move. Actually, A moved out of state, but his uncle and the other 2 guys didn't move and even rented A's room to a woman with a kid. So I started holdover case, right after A's uncle received the notice, he started another petition against me for the following:


1. No hot water -- of course we have hot water, but the court inspection date is 10/22 and court date is 10/29. How can we have early inspection? It dosn't make sense to have such late inspection if they don't have hot water. And I am wondering what can they do to stop the hot water for inspection.

2.landlord changed front door lock and locked mailbox so they cannot get mail. --- I didn't do any of this. But how to approve? The 2nd floor apt also use that front door and there is no complain. They removed old mailbox and put an new one with lock. When I heard this from other people, I called police but I was told they won't come for this. And I have phone bill to show I called police that time. The mailbox they put is a bad one and everyone still can open without unlock it.

3. I use his ssn to open con edison account and pay on behalf them---- A opened con Edison act under his uncle name and 1st floor is using the same meters as basement. So I have a sub meter and pay $100 per month for basement electricity. This is deduct from rent and I have receipt for this. After A moved, I noticed they got termination notice from con Edison due to non payment. I know the electricity acct number, so I checked from web. I paid $400 to avoid the shut off. Now he complain I didn't pay electricity. Can I ask con Edison to show who opened up acct?

4. Most important thing is they gave court a copied lease and this is a fake one. --- because I have the original one and only have A's name on it. They made a fake one and added A's uncle name on it. Even the lease is expired, will the court consider this is illegal to provide unlawful documents?

5. They complained renting out basement--- when the inspector came if he cannot get in basement, how he can give me violation?

my concern is is this going to stop my holdover case? My court date should be earlier then 10/29?
any idea of how to provide evidence that the judge can accept? Thanks

[dumpling]

did you hire an attorney for your holdover case? if not you may consider doing so just to make sure that you properly give notice and the court papers are properly served. i am currently filing a holdover case against a deadbeat too - its a pain. is your basement legal? If it is I wouldn't worry about it. get a statement from con ed, talk to your other tenants and see if they are willing to be your witness. get the process going quickly and correctly. a good attorney is necessary in this case. good luck!

[jcoltrane]

[Forgive the typos, not spellchecking nor proofing]

Originally Posted by md87

[/b]This is a 2 family house in queens and all units are rented out. The 1st floor apt is rented to a single guy A. A only put his name on the lease even though he has his uncle and other 2 guys with him. And the lease expired 1 year ago, so after that they are month to month. In July, A sent me text message saying they will move out end of August. So they didn't pay rent for August, instead they used 1 month deposit as rent. I was stupid to trust them until I found out they won't move. Actually, A moved out of state, but his uncle and the other 2 guys didn't move and even rented A's room to a woman with a kid. So I started holdover case, right after A's uncle received the notice, he started another petition against me for the following:

1. No hot water -- of course we have hot water, but the court inspection date is 10/22 and court date is 10/29. How can we have early inspection? It dosn't make sense to have such late inspection if they don't have hot water. And I am wondering what can they do to stop the hot water for inspection.

2.landlord changed front door lock and locked mailbox so they cannot get mail. --- I didn't do any of this. But how to approve? The 2nd floor apt also use that front door and there is no complain. They removed old mailbox and put an new one with lock. When I heard this from other people, I called police but I was told they won't come for this. And I have phone bill to show I called police that time. The mailbox they put is a bad one and everyone still can open without unlock it.

Affidavit and testimony of your 2nd flr tenant refuting the allegations.

3. I use his ssn to open con edison account and pay on behalf them---- A opened con Edison act under his uncle name and 1st floor is using the same meters as basement. So I have a sub meter and pay $100 per month for basement electricity. This is deduct from rent and I have receipt for this. After A moved, I noticed they got termination notice from con Edison due to non payment. I know the electricity acct number, so I checked from web. I paid $400 to avoid the shut off. Now he complain I didn't pay electricity. Can I ask con Edison to show who opened up acct?

Why did you pay the $400? Because of the basement?

Well here you have a bit of a problem. One that is commonly found in coverted two and three family homes. Legally, ou cannot have the electricity of the public/common connectd with your tenant's electic lines/meters.

This can be a real issue as Tenants can claim that they have been overpaying for electricity. Yes, you have been deducting $100 from their rent, BUT who is to say and how, that the deducted amount actually covered the basement's eelectric use? You have little way of knowing and proving.

Let me ask, what about the rest of the common/shared areas, whose electric are they on?

I also, have to ask, given the electrical situation, is the house LEGALLY a 2 family? Is there a Certificate of Occupancy stating such? If you do have such a CofO then it is not a legal dwelling. In which case, you have bigger issues, but will likely make it easier to get the tenant out.

In any event, I strongly suggest you install a third meter, and have the public/shared space (hallways, etc,) and basemen put onto the third meter.

Now, also, let me ask, are renting out the basement space? If so, then I'm certain it is illegal, and you need to rectify the circumstance asap!

In any event, if you are renting the basement, then you need 4 meters!

4. Most important thing is they gave court a copied lease and this is a fake one. --- because I have the original one and only have A's name on it. They made a fake one and added A's uncle name on it. Even the lease is expired, will the court consider this is illegal to provide unlawful documents?

Well, if, indeed, the lease is *expired*, then there is little to be concerned with as long as you served the proper 30 Day Notice, necessary to evict month to month tenants.

5. They complained renting out basement--- when the inspector came if he cannot get in basement, how he can give me violation?

Oh! Ok, so I suspected correctly!!!

How? When you go to court and the Tenants do what they do. The Judge is going to Order and Inspection, and you will have no choice, but to let them, or be in Contempt of Court!

Sorry to advise, buut you've got BIG problems and they are ALL of your own making for NOT DOING THINGS Legally and properly. Now, it will cost a good bit of money to straighten things out.

Problem 1: you have a savy tenant, who appears to know his way L&T laws and around a courtroom. These ate the worst tenants.

Problem 2: you have a seriously ILLEGAL DWELLING!!!!

Which, legally, speaking means the tenants do not have to pay anymore rent; AND, you legally are liable for ALL the rent collected while the building was illegal. In addition, there will be fines.

my concern is is this going to stop my holdover case? My court date should be earlier then 10/29?
any idea of how to provide evidence that the judge can accept? Thanks

Well, obviously you have bigger concerns.

You NEED the counsel of a VERY experienced Landlord-Tenant attorney IMMEDIATELY! Many issues need to be sorted, before court. You cannot deal effectively with this alone. Too much knowledge and experience you do not have.

Where is our property located, what borough? If you do not know of a good L&T attorney, I suggest you contact the local County Bar Association and ask them to provide a reccommendation. They have a phone service for this.

A few realizations you need to come to grips with:

One realization you have to make is that you have a very savvy tenant to contend with. One who it appears know more about the system than you.

Two, the illegality of the dwelling puts you in a very poor position, now that you are involved with the court system.

Three, you do Not Have what the legal system deems "Clean Hands", and clean hands are what is needed for the coourt system to help you. If you come to court with an infraction or an illegality, the court is not inclined to view you favorably.

For example, a LL with an illegal dwelling makes the Tenant all the more believable. The Tenant is likely to get the benefit of the doubt.

Anyway, find a lawyer quick, and start getting the money together to make your building LEGAL! In the meantime do a forum search for "illegal" and "illegal basement". Quite a number of threads on the issue.

I'd wish you luck, but I can't. Be smart!

[rose grady]

I have a tenant issue. My tenant let an obvious, long-term faucet drip cause serious damage to the bathroom cabinet and floor. They reported the finding of the leak to me and it was repaired within 36 hours. Two days later they complained about a "smell" and have escalated demands for repairs to include a new cabinet and floor. They are refusing entry to service people without a time frame that meets their liking, but insist more and more that there must be mold and that they are getting sick. They have blocked any suggestions for remediation of the initial problem and do not believe the report of the licensed general contractor who inspected the damage that there is no mold. The smell is the fiberboard in the cabinet, which we have offered to replace. Today, five days after this has begun, they state that they are moving to a hotel, storing their belongings and charging it to our management company. They deny all responsibility for the damage and are bent on proving there is mold and the house is unfit for habitation. They have not paid this month's rent and have told us to stay out of the house even in their absence. How strong is our position? I have emails back and forth that substantiate most of what I have said here.

[crescent22]

Well, charging the management co. is an idle threat. The management co. won't pay even if you say nothing.

The tenants appear to be using what leverage they think they have to get you to give them a new bathroom.

You need to use what leverage you have: State again that the mold inspection was negative, that you consider the matter closed, that there will be no extra repairs in any situation and they owe you rent regardless of their opinion of the mold.

If they don't, then you will start eviction proceedings and their names in the Housing Court database will forever blacklist them with future landlords.