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Old 07-28-2013, 11:42 PM
 
1,743 posts, read 2,453,956 times
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I was having a conversation with one of my friends from back home in Michigan. She refuses (as does the vast majority of my college friends) to live here because she feels there is no room for the middle class. I tried to think of things to tell her to convince her otherwise but knew I had nothing to stand on. Is she right? Am I an idiot to stay here as a middle class person? And, if that is true... how will NYC real estate fare? I often wonder. Who is the backbone of this city? Wall Street or the middle class? This is not trolling, this is real life. I feel we are being pushed out and can't continue doing business here.
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Old 07-29-2013, 12:34 AM
147
 
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Rent is Too Damn High!
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Old 07-29-2013, 12:47 AM
 
Location: Bronx
16,217 posts, read 21,963,823 times
Reputation: 8325
Quote:
Originally Posted by EastBoundandDownChick View Post
I was having a conversation with one of my friends from back home in Michigan. She refuses (as does the vast majority of my college friends) to live here because she feels there is no room for the middle class. I tried to think of things to tell her to convince her otherwise but knew I had nothing to stand on. Is she right? Am I an idiot to stay here as a middle class person? And, if that is true... how will NYC real estate fare? I often wonder. Who is the backbone of this city? Wall Street or the middle class? This is not trolling, this is real life. I feel we are being pushed out and can't continue doing business here.
I don't think their is no right or wrong and every one is entitled to his or her opinion. NYC may have success for you but will it bring success to your friend? I know quite a few BA waving Transplants who failed at NYC and jetted back to momma and poppa basement or attic im the midwest. For many young educated folks, I assumed most will move to professional class cities like NYC, Chicago, SF, Boston, DC, Houston and Seattle, but many end up staying in their dwellings back home with their parents middle class is eroding in much of the Northeast and midwest. Here in NYC thr middle class has been on thr decline since the height of the white flight and still has not gotten any better, plenty of blacks and hispanic working and middle class folks are leaving to greener pastures while educated locals are moving to where the jobs which are in the sunbelt/biblebelt and thats reality. Even in your neck of the woods the middle class has eroded due to the deindusrialization of the rustbelt, dissaperaing jobs, breakdown of the family unit, single motherdom, and etc. I csn no longer say the middle class is the backbone of this city and has not been for the past decade, I can say the middle class is a disc or one of the vertebrae that helps to keep the city standing. Me personally I would never suggest young educated people to move to NYC. When I visit places across America, I always run into some shrub who wants to move to NYC and ask why and many do have valid points on to why they want to move here. I generally counter attack with col, qol, long lines and other issues, but these folks here so much cool things about Williamsburg. Overall I would suggest that your friend should move to a region that is midde class friendly, affordable and at the same time carve out a career. What's up with Michigan residents fleeing the state? Its always someone from Michigan, Ohio, Wisconsin or from Tabernacle Iowa that live here in NYC?

http://www.businessinsider.com/too-m...arents-2012-11

http://www.wnyc.org/shows/news/serie...oomberg-years/

Last edited by Bronxguyanese; 07-29-2013 at 01:15 AM..
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Old 07-29-2013, 01:15 AM
 
Location: Warren, OH
2,745 posts, read 4,001,372 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronxguyanese View Post
I don't think their is no right or wrong and every one is entitled to his or her opinion. NYC may have success for you but will it bring success to your friend? I know quite a few BA waving Transplants who failed at NYC and jetted back to momma and poppa basement or attic im the midwest. For many young educated folks, I assumed most will move to professional class cities like NYC, Chicago, SF, Boston, DC, Houston and Seattle, but many end up staying in their dwellings back home with their parents middle class is eroding in much of the Northeast and midwest. Here in NYC thr middle class has been on thr decline since the height of the white flight and still has not gotten any better, plenty of blacks and hispanic working and middle class folks are leaving to greener pastures while educated locals are moving to where the jobs which are in the sunbelt/biblebelt and thats reality. Even in your neck of the woods the middle class has eroded due to the deindusrialization of the rustbelt, dissaperaing jobs, breakdown of the family unit, single motherdom, and etc. I csn no longer say the middle class is the backbone of this city and has not been for the past decade, I can say the middle class is a disc or one of the vertebrae that helps to keep the city standing. Me personally I would never suggest young educated people to move to NYC. When I visit places across America, I always run into some shrub who wants to move to NYC and ask why and many do have valid points on to why they want to move here. I generally counter attack with col, qol, long lines and other issues, but these folks here so much cool things about Williamsburg. Overall I would suggest that your friend should move to a region that is midde class friendly, affordable and at the same time carve out a career. What's up with Michigan residents fleeing the state? Its always someone from Michigan, Ohio, Wisconsin or from Tabernacle Iowa that live here in NYC?

We came from Long Island and were "middle class" making $100,000 plus and still couldn't make it. We were born in New York, I had a decent business but the cost of living was getting out of hand. We were paying $20,000 in taxes in 2010 and it made no sense in staying there. We are currently living in Ohio and couldn't be happier. The homes here are under $100,000 and taxes under $2,000. The people are friendly and the air fresher. It seems that in NY you are either rich or poor. There will be no more middle class there. I tell all that will listen, that if you are middle class- (lower or upper) move to the Midwest. It's the only place to go.
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Old 07-29-2013, 03:07 AM
 
273 posts, read 482,262 times
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I make around $135K and was still reluctant to make the move to NYC last year. If I land a job in NYC making around $190K I'd consider moving to NYC. I have a good friend that makes $300K working for a hedgefund in NYC. He still considers himself "middle class". Hope that helps to answer your question.
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Old 07-29-2013, 07:05 AM
 
2,770 posts, read 3,250,242 times
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OP, your friend who refuses (more like can't afford) in NYC is probably smart.
With the median american salary, she can live a normal life in michigan, own a house, car, raise kids etc and have some savings and retirement.
In NYC, she probably has to live in some sheety rat infested tiny apartment with roomates, ride an ironic bike, have no savings, end up broke and ultimately moving to back to michigan in a mountain of debt that she can never recover from.

NYC is not for everyone.
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Old 07-29-2013, 07:19 AM
 
Location: Manhattan
24,762 posts, read 34,753,161 times
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The term "middle class" means nothing unless it is defined and it is not.

There is no other terminology that is more abused by failing to define it...well perhaps "true God" might qualify.

It USED to mean "owning you own business" but that term is not currently in vogue. Now it seems to mean something like "not poor."

How about something as simple as dividing the population into three equal segments: poor, middle class, and rich Though that seems to make sense, people would seem to rather let the term be amorphous and vague so that ANYTHING can be said about it, and anyone, no matter how rich or poor can imagine himself a member of the middle class.

(Silliness: "the middle class" can move to Ohio and buy a house for less than $100,000?????" Joe Median can buy a $90,000 house and few people include Joe Median with his $50,500 household income in the amorphous "middle class.")
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Old 07-29-2013, 07:40 AM
 
Location: Helsinki, Finland
5,466 posts, read 10,837,284 times
Reputation: 2411
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronxguyanese View Post
I don't think their is no right or wrong and every one is entitled to his or her opinion. NYC may have success for you but will it bring success to your friend? I know quite a few BA waving Transplants who failed at NYC and jetted back to momma and poppa basement or attic im the midwest. For many young educated folks, I assumed most will move to professional class cities like NYC, Chicago, SF, Boston, DC, Houston and Seattle, but many end up staying in their dwellings back home with their parents middle class is eroding in much of the Northeast and midwest. Here in NYC thr middle class has been on thr decline since the height of the white flight and still has not gotten any better, plenty of blacks and hispanic working and middle class folks are leaving to greener pastures while educated locals are moving to where the jobs which are in the sunbelt/biblebelt and thats reality. Even in your neck of the woods the middle class has eroded due to the deindusrialization of the rustbelt, dissaperaing jobs, breakdown of the family unit, single motherdom, and etc. I csn no longer say the middle class is the backbone of this city and has not been for the past decade, I can say the middle class is a disc or one of the vertebrae that helps to keep the city standing. Me personally I would never suggest young educated people to move to NYC. When I visit places across America, I always run into some shrub who wants to move to NYC and ask why and many do have valid points on to why they want to move here. I generally counter attack with col, qol, long lines and other issues, but these folks here so much cool things about Williamsburg. Overall I would suggest that your friend should move to a region that is midde class friendly, affordable and at the same time carve out a career. What's up with Michigan residents fleeing the state? Its always someone from Michigan, Ohio, Wisconsin or from Tabernacle Iowa that live here in NYC?

Too Many Millennials Are Living With Parents - Business Insider

News: New York Remade: The Bloomberg Years - WNYC
NYC recieves a lot of folks from the breadbasket of America. Not much to do there if youre not interested in picking up agricultural work or standing in the unemploymen line in the nearest post apocalyptic, heyday back in the 50's steel manufacturing city.
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Old 07-29-2013, 07:45 AM
 
2,115 posts, read 5,134,681 times
Reputation: 1131
I've spent a lot of time in Michigan (lived in East Lansing for a while, spent long periods of time in Metro Detroit). I'm from the Chicago area originally & still represent the city & surrounding area proudly. The thing about Michigan is except for Detroit proper & depressed high-crime satellite cities like Pontiac & Flint, is that the state is recovering somewhat from the Recession. There are actually a decent amount of opportunities if a person is willing to move around a bit and look at opportunities throughout Metro Detroit, Ann Arbor, Kalamazoo, Grand Rapids, etc. Then on top of that, the top big city draw for Michiganders is not NYC. It's the much more nearby Chicago just across Lake Michigan in Illinois. The folks that aren't crazy about Chicago will not like NYC at all. A lot of folks in Michigan seem to appreciate their cars, their low cost of living, open space and easy access to getaway trips for camping, hunting & nature in Northern Michigan.

Quote:
Originally Posted by EastBoundandDownChick View Post
I was having a conversation with one of my friends from back home in Michigan. She refuses (as does the vast majority of my college friends) to live here because she feels there is no room for the middle class. I tried to think of things to tell her to convince her otherwise but knew I had nothing to stand on. Is she right? Am I an idiot to stay here as a middle class person? And, if that is true... how will NYC real estate fare? I often wonder. Who is the backbone of this city? Wall Street or the middle class? This is not trolling, this is real life. I feel we are being pushed out and can't continue doing business here.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-29-2013, 08:14 AM
 
273 posts, read 482,262 times
Reputation: 178
The MidWest is a friendly place and all, but I don't see any joy in actually living there. I can see why people would want to roll the dice and move to NYC. I suppose that there is a middle class in NYC, but they probably live in the outer boroughs or New Jersey.

I lived in NYC in my teens and left to go to college and start my professional career in the South. Now I'm at a point where I can likely live comfortably in the city (between $175-190K). My only hope is this is enough money to keep my car and afford a decent 2bed/2bath apt for my wife and I. We have $0 in debt, so my hope is I can make some huge advances in my career in the city.
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