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Well, I offer experience I offer some ideas. You guys just offer bitchy criticisms - no thought, no reflection.
As for what I want for society - you are right I am not entirely sure, but I lived in Sweden in the 1980's, traveled all over Scandinavia and their system while not perfect had many advantages and was quite progressive in some areas - for example in environmental preservation they were recycling batteries and using lily ponds to clean water
in 1986. NYC started to promote proper disposal of batteries - in the mid 200's. When did the US even put forward a more universal healthcare with Obamacare, 2008.
As for the loopholes and subsidies - well it is a bit more complicated. Loopholes sometimes are set to soften the impact of significant changes in policies that are meant to improve all economic classes in the long-term. Subsidies sometimes address long-standing inequalities that are only rectified from successful culmination of protest for political change When King fought against Jim Crow laws and for voting right acts he and his constituents were NOT the ruling class - in fact many middle and working class families joined in the protests. And King learned from Ghandi's form of non-violent protest which got some of the poorest sectors of society to create some great positive (initially) changes.
Now I do agree, there is always a point where those whose revolutions are successful become part of the ruling class and might become enmeshed in new inequalities and distortions.
This is my last post on this and I think the thread should be closed. Why? I share my experience and show, at least, I have participated in making society a little better, all I get from the detractors is you guys are expert armchair economists and political philosophers who are happy making useless accusations and probably buy into the idea that it is fine getting wealthy making useless crap to feed your passing appetites and inflate your sense of superiority. If that is you and truly your vision of the American dream than I'd gladly settle for a Scandinavian nightmare.
Last edited by astroia 34567; 08-11-2013 at 11:22 AM..
A retired person has very little income, yet he has a lot more assets, e.g lots of equity in his home, and retirement funds. Wealth GINI shows this. Income's GINI does not reflect this.
Quote:
Originally Posted by astroia 34567
Well, I offer experience I offer some ideas. You guys just offer bitchy criticisms - no thought, no reflection.
Experience? Do you have any experience living in Cuba, or another socialist country? Because I do, and would like to share stories with you.
Besides do you know much about the theory that underpins the economic and political systems in these countries? If so, sure, let's discuss.
Quote:
Originally Posted by astroia 34567
I wonder what you do for a living and who have you helped?
Not sure what that has to do with our discussion, but I'll let you go first on that..
Well, I offer experience I offer some ideas. You guys just offer bitchy criticisms - no thought, no reflection.
Again ... really ?
How is it that anything not in agreement with you lacks "thoughts" and "reflection"?
All "experience" must lead to exactly your "thoughts" and "reflections," or experience is lacking.
This is the common transplant, white liberal view in New York. Which is, in fact, usually itself based on few experiences - it changes once these acrue. Actually, I am assuming that a poster in the New York forum IS here, perhaps you are another one of these arm chair New Yorkers who are becoming a plague.
Funnily enough, this tendency in thinking is exactly the problem.
A retired person has very little income, yet he has a lot more assets, e.g lots of equity in his home, and retirement funds. Wealth GINI shows this. Income's GINI does not reflect this.
Gotcha.
But guess what? You're still wrong.
Sweden does not have a greater wealth disparity than the U.S
Not by a long shot.
Henry10 - go ahead I'd love to. Oh and I saw the wreck of communism when in St Petersberg (Leningrad) in 1986 with stores empty the buildings worn and never sure how safe the water was. Strangely as tourists we were monitored but more for not stealing historic artifacts which were a huge problem then. And I know that the USSR was quite excellent at covering up disasters then - when I was residing in Sweden the alarms at Swedish nuclear facilities were broadcasted quickly as they had better nuclear reactor security than even the US and the media was on top of it. This in turn finally led to the USSR admitting Chernobyl blew up.
So go ahead, share your Cuban stories, I saw first hand the nightmares of the USSR which was basically a totalitarian regime with an overly centralized, messed-up economy.
But please, re-read what I wrote - I never approved Cuba as a model. I learned of the oppressive society from a good Cuban family who migrated to Jersey when I was a kid. Swedish socialism and society is much more open - and these days more open than the US where we have Holder pretending he did not know of the extent of the wire-tapping of press and business through cellular providers such as Verizon.
PS. I ask what you do for a living to understand better what economic perch you make some of your pronouncements.
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