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That is also true for the SAT, NMAT, LSAT, GMAT, GRE - not all test content is taught and those who can afford Kaplan have an advantage. So be it until someone can think of a more objective way to assess applications.
Or you can get a few Kaplan books for abt $100. Many of the tricky questions have proven methods of attacking them. Not sure abt the other exams, but the GRE is also very much about your speed at doing the questions. I think they ran out of ideas years ago and made more longer questions. Those that are quick and accurate with numbers benefit the most.
There is material in the GMAT that is not taught to all students in all colleges. A liberal arts major may not have studied all the quant topics in the GMAT so he will have to learn on his own.
The tutored students are taught with new concepts in the textbook that are to be taught to the rest of the students in the next grade level based on the past test content.
If all students have been taught the same concepts and then some of them are willing to pay for additional tutoring to better understand the concepts to prepare for the test, that is a different story, which applies to the tests that FHD listed above.
I agree with your original post that the testing was meant to find gifted/above average students but the testing companies are big business. As long as parents are willing to pay for the tutoring it's going to be a factor. Only the brightest and best test takers of the untutored students are going to have high enough scores to get a seat.
The real concern related to this was described in an article not long ago about how many parents are sending their 3-5 year olds to tutoring school targeted at the city wide G&T schools like Anderson, NEST etc... where is this heading for?
There is material in the GMAT that is not taught to all students in all colleges. A liberal arts major may not have studied all the quant topics in the GMAT so he will have to learn on his own.
If a person is still b*tching and whining about this stuff while trying to get into a top MBA program they really have problems....lol
The real concern related to this was described in an article not long ago about how many parents are sending their 3-5 year olds to tutoring school targeted at the city wide G&T schools like Anderson, NEST etc... where is this heading for?
There would be no need for Anderson, NEST, etc. if all local schools could simply do the right thing and teach all capable kids in their districts 1 - 2 grades above grade level. Some suburban schools accomplish this by rigorously practicing differentiated instruction (there are others that do it half-heartedly).
You do, however, need schools like Stuy and BSHS to prepare capable students for further study in science and engineering. As these schools cannot admit all then testing becomes the necessary means to screen admissions.
To make it more subjective so that applicants who can cry about life's struggles and portray themselves to have "overcome" challenges will have a better chance of getting in than those who study hard and get good grades in school.
this is a complete non issue here. you're making up a problem in this case where there is none
these high schools are packed with hard working students and it's not going to change. the competition is too fierce
the OP was just about whether the advantage of expensive test prep is a big enough that it should be mitigated, and if so how
no need to go down the road that this reasoning leads
my expertise is not exactly in designing objective and fair test papers...but i could give it some good thoughts if the schools are willing to change it
This is not much about rich and poor issue as I see it. Putting it in other words, the entrance exam seems more like selecting better students from 9th (privately tutored) and 8th graders (non-tutored) using the same 9th grade level test papers. I do not know how many students tested for Hunter in your days. It is like 2,500 or so students testing for around 300 spots in recent years. So being tutored or not being tutored makes a huge difference in this situation.
the thing is i've never heard any good suggestions about how to change these tests in any positive way
it's all well and good to point out a (potential) problem but if no one has a better suggestion it's kind of meaningless
now if someone came up with better testing ideas that could reasonably be implemented on the huge numbers of students who take these tests, i'd be all ears
as far as the ratio of applicants to spots, it was similar when i tested IIRC. maybe not exactly the same but it was very very selective even back then
My son put Tech as his one and only choice. He took the SHSAT with out any paid for test prep. He scored high enough for Stuy. He was however already in Gifted & Talented. He also was accepted into Midwood medical program. I am personally NOT impressed with Tech. Faculty and guidance never return calls or reply to emails.
the thing is i've never heard any good suggestions about how to change these tests in any positive way
it's all well and good to point out a (potential) problem but if no one has a better suggestion it's kind of meaningless
now if someone came up with better testing ideas that could reasonably be implemented on the huge numbers of students who take these tests, i'd be all ears
as far as the ratio of applicants to spots, it was similar when i tested IIRC. maybe not exactly the same but it was very very selective even back then
The first step is for the schools keep their test content and format discrete rather than publicizing sample tests to serve as guidance for targeted tutoring beforehand. Also, they should not diminish above grade level content, or if that is not possible to make the test difficult enough to separate the students, they should at least making all prospective students aware of up to which grade level of textbook knowledge will be covered in their tests so all the students could plan accordingly and decide whether it is worth of studying on their own, using tutoring or just call it quit. Just some quick thoughts and I am sure there are enough professionals out there who can come up with brilliant test designing ideas to overcome the apparent pitfalls in the current testing and selection system.
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