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Evidence has been found that a great deal of searches were done randomly and without reasonable suspicion. This was provided by the NYPD. You can bet that many random searches are either not logged at all, or given a completely bogus reason for doing so. Just recently an off duty black nypd police chief was stopped and frisked, lol. Yeah, no racial profiling there. I'm sure there was reasonable suspicion as well.
Which is why the judge defined the conditions when cops can stop and frisk, as well as ordered them to wear cameras while on duty for stop and frisk.
Reasonable suspicion, as the court defined it, would be running away from a crime scene or actively planning to commit a crime (standing outside a house or building with a crowbar and trying to pry a window open, aggressively following someone on the street while panhandling or trying to sell them drugs, etc.).
People who get caught jumping over subway turnstiles are definitely stopped and ticketed, if not stopped and frisked (while they check out your id). If you have no id on you they can take you to jail (the crime is fare evasion). That person was ACTIVELY caught committing a crime, and therefore can be LEGALLY stopped and frisked.
People who get caught jumping over subway turnstiles are definitely stopped and ticketed, if not stopped and frisked (while they check out your id). If you have no id on you they can take you to jail (the crime is fare evasion). That person was ACTIVELY caught committing a crime, and therefore can be LEGALLY stopped and frisked.
Even just spitting can get you stopped and frisked.
Which is why the judge defined the conditions when cops can stop and frisk, as well as ordered them to wear cameras while on duty for stop and frisk.
Reasonable suspicion, as the court defined it, would be running away from a crime scene or actively planning to commit a crime (standing outside a house or building with a crowbar and trying to pry a window open, aggressively following someone on the street while panhandling or trying to sell them drugs, etc.).
People who get caught jumping over subway turnstiles are definitely stopped and ticketed, if not stopped and frisked (while they check out your id). If you have no id on you they can take you to jail (the crime is fare evasion). That person was ACTIVELY caught committing a crime, and therefore can be LEGALLY stopped and frisked.
Evidence has been found that a great deal of searches were done randomly and without reasonable suspicion. This was provided by the NYPD. You can bet that many random searches are either not logged at all, or given a completely bogus reason for doing so.
Before all the stats, there was no reporting of S&Fs. Frankly, they were something that has always happened. There's a big difference between random & unreasonable. If you think NYPD were just driving down the street stopping random pedestrians, you're dreaming. If you think that officers were stopping people fitting the usual description of the thugs ravaging the streets, you may have a point.
Quote:
Originally Posted by krichton
Just recently an off duty black nypd police chief was stopped and frisked, lol. Yeah, no racial profiling there. I'm sure there was reasonable suspicion as well.
Recently? 2008! You've been reading the wrong blogs! Plainclothes officers in trouble - didn't recognize off-duty chief - NY Daily News
Illegally parked car justifies the "stop", visible gun justifies the further police action (not a "frisk", BTW)
"The cops gave a different account: When one officer spotted Zeigler's service weapon through the rolled-down window, he yelled "Gun!" ... Both cops raised their weapons and ordered the driver out of the car ... Instead of saying he was an armed member of the NYPD, Zeigler shouted, "Don't you know who I am?" When one cop reached over to check the identification badge around Zeigler's neck, the chief pushed him away ... Only then did Zeigler tell the two officers his name and rank ... One cop got into a heated argument with the chief"
The best part, as always, is the denouement! Top black cop accused of tryst with officer when faceoff occurred - NY Daily News
"The city's top black cop was visiting a secret girlfriend in Queens when he became involved in a racially charged incident"
The married chief told Commissioner Raymond Kelly he was in the area to deliver a package ... Actually, Zeigler was rendezvousing with his paramour, Officer Valerie Sloan ... Zeigler's wife is Neldra Zeigler, deputy NYPD commissioner for equal employment opportunity."
And, it turns out that the "racist white cop" has a black girlfriend! http://www.nydailynews.com/news/stop...ticle-1.329814
Last edited by bigjake54; 12-05-2013 at 11:32 PM..
You continue to be wrong. I'll try to explain again.
93% of the perpetrator descriptions for NYC street crimes are young black or latino males. Not surprising since if you consistantly target the same group of people those are the numbers that you would get
Most of those descriptions are provided by the minority victims of these street crimes. So arrest them why should everyone else have to suffer? S/F those who actually COMMIT crimes and not just the people that look like them
92% of those SQFed are black or latino. AFAIK, young males.
That is not disproportionate. It is directly proportionate.
Whites are actually SQFed at a higher rate, than their percentage of perp descriptions.
Does this make sense to you? What if there is no description given? What would be the logic of S/F darker people and why not S/F everyone equally regardless of color? Unless that you are insinuating that whites do not need to be stopped as much because they don't commit crimes?
Scenario: Black female accosted & robbed on street by young black male, who runs away.
She calls 911 & provides description & direction of flight.
Some officers respond to her location, others canvass area.
Who should the police be looking for?
Choices: Young black male, elderly latino male, white/asian female.
You have a description in this one and there is a reason to S/F anyone that fits that description but that makes sense, but the police are not always looking for someone that fits that description so in the meantime what is the logic for searching blacks and latinos if you are not sctively persuing someone?
Scenario: Street robberies have been occurring in a minority neighborhood. Descriptions provided have been young black males. Anti-crime officers in unmarked cars are patrolling neighborhood and notice several YBMs, who appear to be assessing potential robbery victims (older, alone, carrying items), occasionally following those people; some appear to be lookouts.
What should the officers do? SQF? Or wait for a robbery to occur, and try to chase & apprehend the robbers after the fact?
So what if these S/F are being done in non-minority neighborhoods i.e common racially mixed areas what is the reasoning for S/F just the darker people?
Unfortunately, some here will view you as an apologist as best, complicit at worst.
Be safe.
No, I'm looking at the fact if this is not nipped in the bud know it may spread across the country. This has not proven to stop crime but it has managed to aggravate some people who are constantly S/F for no reason.
Stop and Frisk is not intended to really catch people but to deter them from carry drugs and guns on the street. If you illegally own a gun, why would you carry it with you if there was a chance of being frisked. Without the threat of being frisked, thugs will carry their own guns not intending to use them but out of fear others/rivals will have guns...creating a greater risk to communities. Drug use on the streets is also a dangerous issue that the threat of being frisked helps curb.
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