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I moved here to Hamilton Heights in West Harlem 8 years ago and it was a bit rough to say the least. I was one of the few white boys in the neighborhood and there was nothing to eat other than fried chicken. The liquor store had bullet proof plastic shields. And what was with the barber shops? Did we really need 5 barber shops per block? lol. But I went with it because of the super easy access to the express trains to get me downtown and the fact that i could get a massive (for NY standards) apartment for half of what I was paying for my 300 sq foot shoe box downtown.
Since then, especially over the past year the neighborhood has changed dramatically. In fact, according to a recent study HH housing prices went up more than anyplace else in the city. It seems a new bar or restaurant opens every month. I can actually walk to a top tier restaurant to eat! Mountain Bird. Other bars, etc. have opened as well including Harlem Public, The Grange, Amsterdam Social, Home sweet Harlem, Covo is opening another location near Broadway and 149th, Chipped cup and now ll Cafe Latte on 145th, the list goes on.
My apartment was GUT renovated before i moved in. It is beautiful. Stainless steel, granite, top of the line GE everything. They have done the same to all the other apartments but 3 (rent controlled) as people moved out. The building is now 100% young professional types other than the 3 rent controlled apartments. The building just renovated everything else (new electrical, copper piping, new gas pipes, new facade, new lobby, new windows, etc.
Well, a week ago we were given a "red Herring" which is an offer to buy into a co-op conversion that the owners are trying to do with the building. It turns out that 2 of the three rent controlled apartments took buy outs. They are offering me my apartment at well under market (about 25% under). It seems like a good deal and I won't have to worry about my rent going up if the neighborhood keeps gentrifying.
What do you all think of Hamilton Heights and its future? Would you buy in in my situation or sit tight?
I moved here to Hamilton Heights in West Harlem 8 years ago and it was a bit
rough to say the least
First a joke: You should have bought 8 years ago.
For serious:
How many apartments?
How big is yours? What price were you offered?
New elevator? new roof? doorman?
Are you rent stabilized? Can you stay on as a renter? How much is your rent?
How many are rent stabilized in addition to the 3 that are rent controlled?
How much per square foot?
What is the red herring maintenance estimate?
(I'm not being nosy, but these are things one must know to make an educate rent/buy decision?)
Gotta LOVE the term "red herring:
Quote:
The idiom
"red herring" is used to refer to something that misleads or distracts
from the relevant or important issue.[SIZE=4][[/SIZE]
How pertinent.
Last edited by Kefir King; 02-14-2014 at 04:36 PM..
For serious:
How many apartments?
How big is yours? What price were you offered?
New elevator? new roof? doorman?
Are you rent stabilized? Can you stay on as a renter? How much is your rent?
How many are rent stabilized in addition to the 3 that are rent controlled?
How much per square foot?
What is the red herring maintenance estimate?
(I'm not being nosy, but these are things one must know to make an educate rent/buy decision?)
Hey Kefir. Thanks for the reply.
LOL, I wish I had, but I was a broke kid fresh out of college.
There are 60 apartments.
Mine is about 1,100 sq feet. Two bedroom. One bath.
Yes, new elevator and a new roof. No doorman. It is pretty much a walk up with an elevator.
I am rent stabilized. I can stay if i don't buy in. BUT the rent they charge me is actually less than what they COULD charge me under rent stab. The rent stab rate is $1,990 but I get a market rate credit and only pay just under $1,700. I have heard this is done because noone would actually rent it at the full rent stab rate they COULD charge. IOW I am paying market rate.
About 25% are rent stab, but they are all VERY close to going market (Most are right around $2,400 as people have moved in and out and the owner did lots of renovations) but again, they get a market rate credit so they pay less.
I don't want to get into the numbers. i crunched them with a friend and hired an attorney to look it over but it seems to be a good deal.
What I'm really looking for feedback on is if investing in a place in HH seems like a good investment for the future.
An important question is "will I be paying more or less in mortgage interest (less USEFUL tax deduction) + maintenance than I am paying now."
You might notice that I am deliberately hedging about the future fate of Hamilton Heights and that's because I misplaced my crystal ball. My guesstimate would be no better than anyone else's and that's all they are, guesstimates.
Personally I think 25% under market is not a good enough offer for an insider price.
You need 9 people to buy in. If that's all you get, would you be happy keeping up 51 rent stabilized tenants until they die?
How much of the building's underlying mortgage will you be buying.
Hamilton Heights has had a big price run-up in the last year.
Last edited by Kefir King; 02-14-2014 at 05:04 PM..
An important question is "will I be paying more or less in mortgage interest (less USEFUL tax deduction) + maintenance than I am paying now."
You might notice that I am deliberately hedging about the future fate of Hamilton Heights and that's because I misplaced my crystal ball. My guesstimate would be no better than anyone else's and that's all they are, guesstimates.
Personally I think 25% under market is not a good enough offer for an insider price.
You need 9 people to buy in. If that's all you get, would you be happy keeping up 51 rent stabilized tenants until they die?
How much of the buildings underlying mortgage will you be buying.
51? Only 15 apartments are rent stab and they are all about to go market. We will have 1 rent controlled unless she kicks the bucket.
Sorry, I misread the number of stabilized units.
How are the 15 apartments all about to go to market rents in a non-eviction plan? You cannot decontrol an apartment regardless of the rent, presuming they are legal rents, a BIG presume, as long as a tenant stays on and makes less than 200K provable income for a couple years straight.
Now is the time to get to know your neighbors and negotiate together, presuming you have decided to buy.
Sorry, I misread the number of stabilized units.
How are the 15 apartments all about to go to market rents in a non-eviction plan? You cannot decontrol an apartment regardless of the rent, presuming they are legal rents, a BIG presume, as long as a tenant stays on and makes less than 200K provable income for a couple years straight.
Now is the time to get to know your neighbors and negotiate together, presuming you have decided to buy.
Hey. Thanks for the info.
From what I understand and have read, once the market rent stab rate hits $2,500 the apartment becomes unstab. Is that not correct?
Best line ever "And what was with the barber shops? Did we really need 5 barber shops per block?" Someone needs to do a Twitter or Tumblr hashtag of #ThingsWhitePeopleNoticeInTheHood
Anyway, OP it sounds like a good opportunity. The caution with moving into a transitioning area is that people may not be comfortable with the QOL issues that these areas currenty have. You've been in the area for almost a decade so that's a moot point. You're comfortable there now and while nothing is guaranteed, it is highly likely that the area will continue to improve at a rapid clip. You'll secure a place where your monthly payments are petty much fixed (you even get a tax advantage too) and when you do sell, it's very likely it will be for a lot more.
This is all about timing. Many neighborhoods go through transitions and those that get in early enough do very nicely but the two questions are whether or not HH has already gone through that initial phase on the way to prosperity and secondly if prosperity will ever come. I would say the answer to the first is NO and the answer to the second is YES.
I would go for it if you can afford it now and then hope for the best. I don't think you will lose value and NYC real estate always sells to somebody
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