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I've read many a neighborhood thread on this site, but feel the answers to my specific niche of neighborhood questions have since changed from the most relevant pre-existing threads.
My wife and I (younger, 28 and 29) are looking to move this summer to an "affordable" (middle-class/education and non-profit salaries) neighborhood that's still got urban amenities and easy city access, though "hipness" is no longer the priority it once was to us.
We moved to the city about 2 years ago and have lived in a steal of an East Village gem, but are satisfied that we got our downtown Manhattan fix of an experience and are ready to look for neighborhoods to settle into long-term with plans to start a family and have a child in the next year. As such we're thinking along the lines of $1800 and under (1500-1700 ideal) for a 2 bedrooms.
We moved to this city drawn to the diversity of people and cultures, that's what we're most interested in being around vs the coolest bars, and are comfortable in edgier spots, though a few neighborhood spots to eat/pick up groceries/a park are nice.
All that said, here's what's currently on our radar. We're extremely open- I'd love opinions, alternate suggestions, etc:
West Harlem- was our main focus, we have several friends who love it with crazy deals ($1700/1500 for two bedrooms)
Crown Heights BK- Sounds like a good place to move to right now, more going on than Bed-Stuy though I'm less familiar
Bed-stuy- Seems beautiful, a little empty feeling though
Sunset Park BK- somehow this stands out to me as a lesser discovered gem of an urban neighborhood, without the hip bars of Harlem/Crown Heights but that's OK. Would love thoughts on Sunset Park
Red Hook- is it affordable still?
Prospect Lefferts Gardens- I know nothing except someone mentioned it's beautiful and affordable, and we love Prospect Park for our dog...
Astoria- Lots of restaurants I hear, though I hear about it all the time, is it still affordable?
Jackson Heights- Sounds interesting, close to Manhattan, though apparently not a lot of green space?
East/Spanish Harlem- I feel like it's a little dumpy, but that might be an unfair bias. Folks tell me it's not safe, but I haven't felt unsafe there personally...
Downtown Manhattan- Is there anything affordable left anywhere? I feel walking around far east Alphabet city, and the edges of the Lower East City/Chinatown/Two bridges there must be affordable housing, but it sure doesn't show up with web searches....
Upper upper Manhattan- Parts of inwood seem great, parts of washington heights seem great, but very far away.
Folks more familiar with these neighborhoods as they currently stand, how would you narrow it down? Other suggestions?
This info is purely anecdotal, but my daughter and her boyfriend recently went looking for a smaller and cheaper apartment. They had lived in Washington Heights for 2 years, in a small 2 bedroom on Riverside Drive - not fancy by any means (no dishwasher in apartment but laundry in basement). They left because they needed to get a cheaper place (BF has student loans). They were paying $1900 when they left with another increase coming up if they had renewed their lease - I can't remember the exact details but the rent would have been over $2000. They liked the area OK but shopping is not the greatest and it is a hike from anything. They had a hard time getting their friends to come up to visit! Also, depending on the street, it can be noisy in the summer.
I agree with you about Sunset Park. I used to live in Park Slope so am somewhat familiar with SP and I am surprised it hasn't been "discovered" (sorry, Spike Lee). Sunset Park has a dog run which would be nice for your dog. On their recent apartment search, my daughter and her BF saw several places in SP. They were not impressed by the apartments they saw but their budget is lower than yours.
Red Hook - you didn't mention if you had a car but Red Hook is a PITA to get to without a car. The Smith-9th Street stop on the F is the closest stop (and it's not that close). I don't know what the rental market is like in Red Hook but the prices of houses have been rapidly escalating for some years now which doesn't bode well for the rents.
Prospect Lefferts Gardens is another rapidly gentrifying area but I think you might be able to find something in your price range. Some of the adjoining areas are a bit sketchy, though, and real estate brokers are stretching the boundaries of PLG to increase prices (what else is new). Like Crown Heights and Bed Stuy, it's block-by-block.
I don't know if you would consider this convenient (I wouldn't but YMMV) but my daughter and her BF ended up renting an apartment in Bay Ridge. It's a nice, safe neighborhood with plenty of shopping and restaurants but it is serviced by the miserable R train. They got a 1 BR for $1350.
A couple of other Brooklyn suggestions: Greenwood Heights (between Park Slope and Sunset Park) and Kensington (east of Park Slope/Windsor Terrace) are small neighborhoods that aren't really on the radar and may have some bargains.
From most or the neighborhoods that you listed, I'd say hipness is still a priority to you. Especially with the Brooklyn ones you listed. If diversity and affordability are your real concerns than you'd probably have more Queens neighborhoods listed rather than these ghetto Brooklyn neighborhoods that really have very little diversity and a crap load of crime still. Because of crime, I'd put Jackson Heights and Astoria far above Bed-Stuy, Crown Heights or PLG. And if those two Queens neighborhoods are out of your price range, than there are many others that wouldn't be and at the same time would be more affordable, safer and more diverse than the Brooklyn ones. In general for the neighborhoods closer to the city, brooklyn is more rich and poor while queens is more middle and working class. People are moving to bed-stuy or crown heights these days for trendiness, not affordability or diversity. Unless you consider a mix of blacks, Jews and hipsters that live near yet separate from another to be diversity. I'd say Sunset Park is more like Queens where you find many different Asians, Europeans, Middle Easterns and Hispanics from different cultures among their own race.
Last edited by ShirlMastic Beach; 03-23-2014 at 03:49 AM..
From most or the neighborhoods that you listed, I'd say hipness is still a priority to you. Especially with the Brooklyn ones you listed. If diversity and affordability are your real concerns than you'd probably have more Queens neighborhoods listed rather than these ghetto Brooklyn neighborhoods that really have very little diversity and a crap load of crime still.
"You must spread more Reputation around before giving it to G-Dale again"
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"The man who sleeps on the floor, can never fall out of bed." -Martin Lawrence
G-Dale I guess I can be honest and own that hipness is not a non-priority, more accurately though it is now far from a top priority is a better way to say it. What I would say is that my wife and I do appreciate visits to "discovered" and hip neighborhoods for the developing/developed arts and food scene, not ashamed to say we like that stuff, but living in the thick of it is in no way a need.
That said your assessment of why and how the Queens neighborhoods and Sunset Park are more truly diverse is exactly why we're considering and open to them. The folks we know name drop the trending neighborhoods so that's what we know about, but we are interested in others. Though again, this is truthfully why Brooklyn as a whole seems more appealing than Queens for proximity and accessibility to the trending neighborhoods as you described them. But I'm ready to be convinced this shouldn't be a priority if there are other Queen's neighborhoods where quality of life rules for whatever given reason
Yes I don't know why I didn't mention Bay Ridge. It seems to pop up a lot as a really comfortable livable place, though something about it never quite steals my heart. Perhaps that's related to my response to G-Dale above, in some ways the vibe is almost more suburban, distance from other areas, etc. Though perhaps an unfair bias.
Don't know why I didn't mention transit. I'm slightly transit crazy....we prefer train access and bikeable areas, but we also have a motor scooter and a car. We are very conflicted over the car, only kept it due to a necessary mass transit awkward reverse commute I do though now we've grown used to (spoiled) by having it. Assuming we hang on to it, Bay Ridge/Redhook become more appealing but for my wife train access to the city is important, she despises driving, and a walkable live style is one of the major reasons we love the city and will never return to "the middle" of the country. I guess this is also why I didn't mention Kensington. Feels extremely spread out.
Try the Norwood section of the Bronx. You have the 4 train, the D train and Metro-North along with express bus service, affordable rents in art deco buildings, and nice parkland.
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"The man who sleeps on the floor, can never fall out of bed." -Martin Lawrence
In terms of Brooklyn, Bay Ridge is better than any of the other Brooklyn area listed. Sunset Park is ok.
Neighborhoods further east such as Bensonhurst/Gravesend would get you at the bottom end of the budget, I pay less than 1500 for my 2BR.
"You must spread more Reputation around before giving it to G-Dale again"
Ha, honestly I welcome any sort of opinion, even if it's calling me into question somewhat. Though I did quietly disagree that the neighborhoods in BK I mentioned are all "Ghetto" and not diverse. Queens though is clearly more diverse as he said.
No need to start an argument about what ghetto, high crime, or diversity really means here, that will derail the productive neighborhood conversation.
If it helps paint my own personal boundaries of comfort for neighborhood interest sake, I have worked with families and kids from high-poverty (thus unfortunately often high crime) areas daily for years, and love/enjoy working in that context. I'm quite comfortable in such neighborhoods and love the people there, and generally accept some risk, though like any rational person I believe would say, for the sake of my wife and someday kid excessive violent (hard to define) is discomforting (i.e. frequent fear of stray bullets I suppose)
Ha, honestly I welcome any sort of opinion, even if it's calling me into question somewhat. Though I did quietly disagree that the neighborhoods in BK I mentioned are all "Ghetto" and not diverse. Queens though is clearly more diverse as he said.
No need to start an argument about what ghetto, high crime, or diversity really means here, that will derail the productive neighborhood conversation.
If it helps paint my own personal boundaries of comfort for neighborhood interest sake, I have worked with families and kids from high-poverty (thus unfortunately often high crime) areas daily for years, and love/enjoy working in that context. I'm quite comfortable in such neighborhoods and love the people there, and generally accept some risk, though like any rational person I believe would say, for the sake of my wife and someday kid excessive violent (hard to define) is discomforting (i.e. frequent fear of stray bullets I suppose)
No offense, but your primary list of neighborhoods felt like I was reading an article from the New Yorker. Look into my suggestion.
__________________
"The man who sleeps on the floor, can never fall out of bed." -Martin Lawrence
Try the Norwood section of the Bronx. You have the 4 train, the D train and Metro-North along with express bus service, affordable rents in art deco buildings, and nice parkland.
Thanks for this suggestion! All about tips for areas I would never otherwise consider that sound like great quality of live. Parkland and architecture are big selling points.
Also to the Bay Ridge advocates, could someone expand on why exactly you feel it's so much better than say Sunset Park? I know in many ways it feels nicer, but more distance and a less urban feel are the current turn offs.
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