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Does anyone else think it's peculiar that so many newbies want to live in hoody areas like Bed-Stuy, Harlem or Bushwick when perfectly safe, urban and convenient nabes like Jackson Heights, Midwood, Borough Park, Elmhurst, Bensonhurst, Bay Ridge, Forest Hills are untouched by transplants? Will these areas ever gentrify? What do you think is the reason for this?
Bensonhurst, Bay Ridge, Midwood, Borough Park, etc. (can't speak for the Queens areas) are relatively out of the way/far from Manhattan (i.e. far from a number of significant entertainment options, jobs, etc.). I appreciate that I only live a 10-12 minute train ride from Manhattan, which wouldn't be the case if I lived in Bay Ridge.
Bensonhurst, Bay Ridge, Midwood, Borough Park, etc. (can't speak for the Queens areas) are relatively out of the way/far from Manhattan (i.e. far from a number of significant entertainment options, jobs, etc.). I appreciate that I only live a 10-12 minute train ride from Manhattan, which wouldn't be the case if I lived in Bay Ridge.
True, but with people talking about gentrifying the South Bronx and ENY it makes you wonder if you're going to go that far out why not go to an already middle-class area? Is Jackson Heights really all that much further than Crown Heights? Is Midwood really less convenient than Washington Heights?
Jackson Heights is gentrifying. You see a lot more Whites there than you used to, and real estate prices have grown considerably higher in recent years.
As for why certain parts of Brooklyn would gentrify before Forest Hills, it's simple.
Gentrification in both Brooklyn and Queens starts in the AREAS CLOSEST to Manhattan.
When the East Village began to get too expensive for struggling artists, gays, and other marginalized white populations, they began moving to Williamsburg. Williamsburg was right across the river and a short ride from the places where these people worked and socialized (Union Square area, the Village, Chelsea, Soho, etc). Once Williamsburg became expensive they moved into Bedstuy and Bushwick. With those neighborhoods rapidly gentrifying, there's now talk of ENY.
In Queens Astoria has long had struggling artists, gays, etc. Jackson Heights long had a gay population too. Only these neighborhoods are pricing out those neighborhoods as well.
Corona itself has major real estate development. Their planning a huge shopping mall on Citifield's parking lot. Corona and Elmhurst are starting to gentrify too. You see it in the form of renovations, major expansion of retail, etc.
Queens of all the boroughs has the most rapid increase in real estate prices.
Forest Hills of course isn't going to get the rapid development of LIC because LIC is right across from the river, had a lot of empty space so nobody got displaced, and Forest Hills likely is zoned against major development so realtors aren't going to put as much money it. It's also further away from Manhattan.
Lastly areas that are mostly middle class don't gentrify. Either empty industrial neighborhoods do, or poor areas with lots of poor renters who can be evicted do. Forest Hills and Rego Park have lots of homeowners including those that own co-ops. Meaning they don't have to sell or move unless they want to.
Jackson Heights has a lot of homeowners as well, and for those that do decide to sell they are getting good prices. Renters (mainly poor immigrants and poor gays in Jackson Heights) there may be displaced but those who already own will hold their ground in the neighborhood. Meaning Jackson Heights cannot change demographics as fast as Bedstuy because it always had more homeowners.
There are plenty of transplants moving into Ridgewood Queens. Plenty. Some may say too many. That goes for LIC and Astoria as well. These three neighborhoods can come close to challenging most Brooklyn neighborhoods in terms of transplant populations.
Kind of hard to gentrify Forest Hills considering its never seen a bad day in its history. So a gentrifier would need to have some sort of wealth or funding, whereas in the ghetto parts of Brooklyn, all a gentrifier would need is a liberal arts degree of some sort.
Does anyone else think it's peculiar that so many newbies want to live in hoody areas like Bed-Stuy, Harlem or Bushwick when perfectly safe, urban and convenient nabes like Jackson Heights, Midwood, Borough Park, Elmhurst, Bensonhurst, Bay Ridge, Forest Hills are untouched by transplants? Will these areas ever gentrify? What do you think is the reason for this?
These areas are relatively middle class and nimby. Don't expect any form of gentrification soon. Another problem is that some of these middle class neighborhoods are very far from Manhattan for jobs, and far from centers of entertainment, arts and cultural activities. In this case one can scratch off all of Staten Island, Morris Park throgs neck, city Island and much of the bronx, sheepshead Bay, kings Highway. Gravesend and so on. Also these areas are also affordable, but transplants won't move there because it's far and away from everything.
There are plenty of transplants moving into Ridgewood Queens. Plenty. Some may say too many. That goes for LIC and Astoria as well. These three neighborhoods can come close to challenging most Brooklyn neighborhoods in terms of transplant populations.
Kind of hard to gentrify Forest Hills considering its never seen a bad day in its history. So a gentrifier would need to have some sort of wealth or funding, whereas in the ghetto parts of Brooklyn, all a gentrifier would need is a liberal arts degree of some sort.
Excellent point re Forest Hills.
The way I see it there are three waves that need to occur for what most would consider a Big Bang gentrification:
1st Wave are underemployed hipsters/artists supported by their families and retail jobs. This group has minimal income from their jobs and looks for cheap places to live in order to travel to their retail jobs in Manhattan and look cool. This is also the group that took former $500 2 bedroom apartments and subdivided them so that there is now four people paying $300 each causing rents to sky rocket within a few short years.
2nd Wave are those with actual jobs that look and act like hipsters, but actually hold decent jobs in creative fields. This group might have household income in the range of 80k-200k.
3rd wave are not hipsters, but rich non-natives attracted to the first two groups. This is the rich group whom are paying 2mil for row houses lined with pit-bull crap in inter-ghetto Brooklyn. Natives find this group to be highly pretentious.
So the way I see it if the 1st step doesn't happen, which can't happen in an upper middle class area like Forest Hills, then most wouldn't notice that it's gentrification. But step 2 and sometimes step 3 has been happening continuously at a place like Forest Hills for decades albeit not by people who look like hipsters, but regular white collar workers. Know plenty of non-natives making moderate six figures that have been moving in and out of that place the past few decades.
Last edited by bumblebyz; 12-16-2015 at 08:45 PM..
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