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Old 02-13-2008, 03:39 PM
 
274 posts, read 1,108,710 times
Reputation: 119

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[quote=meganw;2738739]
I'm currently staying at my firm's corporate apartment at Sutton Place. I like the safety and serenity of the Sutton but it seems like a predominantly mature (read: retirees/empty-nesters) affluent White neighbourhood where people can be quite stuck-up. And I sometimes wonder if they are stuck-up to me particularly because I'm Asian (happens alot in racist Britain)?

No, Manhattanites (and East Coasters) aren't all that friendly to anyone compared to West Coasters and Midwesterners.




So my firm gave me another option, which is this high-rise rental building at West 27th n Sixth Ave. According to my housing agent, this would put me technically in Chelsea, which is supposed to be young and pleasant? I absolutely LOVE the building n apartment itself but I checked out the area several times, did some research and felt rather uncomfortable because:

1) towards broadway, from 24th to 31st st, there is a whole congregation of dodgy-looking rug n handbag wholesalers - merchants standing on the streets haggling really loudly.

They're a bit of an eyesore, but they're not dangerous.




2) i heard there are A LOT of nightclubs on west 27th st n perhaps even some prostitution-type activity in the area

Yes, the nightclubs are a problem on 27th. Noise, crowds and drunks Thursday to Saturday.

Usually, clubs in Manhattan start out nice, but as they get less popular and less selective, they start attracting lots of rowdies and thugs. But the hookers won't bother you.

Murders, kidnappings, and rapes have occurred in that club area. It's nowhere as bad as Brooklyn, but it's not as safe as Sutton Place.




3) from 27th st northward towards herald square along 6th n 7th ave looks rather rough n run-down.

Yes, it's sort of run down and commercial. Shops close at night. Therefore not as residential or safe as Sutton Place.




4) someone told me there are quite a few dodgy Asian massage parlors in the outlying areas (towards 8th ave/30's sts)

Hookers won't bother you.



5) maybe as a result of all of the above (or not), i notice people staring at me quite often (even though i dress extremely conservative).

Welcome to the big city. Guys here have to be more aggressive because women here are not as friendly. Vicious cycle.



Can you guys pls help me shed some light on the above - maybe I m being too paranoid?

The housing agent said all of Manhattan is somewhat like this - with 1 block being completely contrasting to the next.

Yes, some places are full of wealthy people but walk one block and you are in the ghetto projects. Like in Chelsea. There's a couple of projects there.



As long as the neighbourhood is actually not as bad as I imagine, I would love to take the new apartment.....................

Any neighborhood in any big city, especially NYC, can be either good or bad depending on the time of day and the people there at that particular time. That's the nature of a big city.

Why not stay where you are? You have safety and quietness, but you can still take a cab over to Chelsea to hang out on nights and weekends. You get the best of both worlds.
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Old 02-13-2008, 08:25 PM
 
Location: NYC
172 posts, read 475,962 times
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Take the new joint! Sutton Place is for cheap, old blue-blooded farts. Deadly dull over there. Just realize when you go out the door at 26th and 6th at night, you'll be heading downtown toward 23rd. Chelsea to the right and Flatiron, Gramercy, Union Square and East Village to the left, not so bad! Avoid empty sidestreets at night around there, at least till you get below 23rd, and you're fine.
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Old 02-14-2008, 06:17 AM
 
Location: Philadelphia,New Jersey, NYC!
6,963 posts, read 20,530,843 times
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as a south asian who lived in chelsea (16th & 6th) for 5 yrs, i'm still lmao at the racism comment. this aint england.
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Old 02-14-2008, 07:22 AM
 
Location: Bronx, NY
2,806 posts, read 16,366,719 times
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Interesting commments. I tend to agree as someone who has lived in Asia. Americans are a hell of a lot less racist than Asian people.

The productivity is just a matter of working styles. In Asia they like to pull long hours (12+ per day) for no reason. If the boss stays till 9-10pm then everyone else better stay that late, or else! They do this even though all of the workers on the floor might have nothing to do.

Its all about acting like you're doing the right thing in Asia. Go visit a University library in Asia. Asians love spending tons of time in their Uni libraries, however they rarely read any books or get any work accomplished. Most of the time they'll chat with friends, take naps, or SMS each other on their phones.


Quote:
Originally Posted by FDB View Post
Higher IQ's? please, give it a break. Race, biologically speaking, doesn't exist. Working harder? give me a break. As a former expat who has worked in Tokyo, Beijing, Singapore and London that just makes me laugh.... the productivity of workers in the IB derivatives desks in Asia was laughable.

Haven't faced racism? there is a whole blog about asian racism at Asian Racism

Take a look, New York is much less racist towards Asians than most asian cities are towards non-asians.

Peace out.
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Old 02-14-2008, 11:27 AM
 
59 posts, read 253,890 times
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What?! Chelsea is nothing but safe. There is no racism towards Asians in NYC as far as I know. My live-in girlfriend is Japanese and she's never experience it once while she's lived here.
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Old 02-14-2008, 11:44 AM
 
487 posts, read 1,363,868 times
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what is a live-in girlfriend?
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Old 02-14-2008, 12:20 PM
 
59 posts, read 253,890 times
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a girlfriend I live with?
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Old 02-14-2008, 02:45 PM
 
1,542 posts, read 6,039,368 times
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um, are most of you people asian? i love how you say "there's no racism toward asians in nyc." PLEASE. that's the farthest thing from the truth.

i'm asian, and while no one's burning crosses on my lawn, i've dealt with a lot of racism over the years growing up in the city and the inner ring suburbs. it was very overt when i was growing up in the late 70s, 80s, and early 90s, and much more subtle these days, even though i'm a big guy living in manhattan. i'm not even gonna debate you guys on this b/c if you're not asian, i'm not sure that you can understand.

to say that asians don't face racism just feeds into the popular misconception that asians are a "model minority" or that we don't need help, don't run into problems, or that we all excel in school. fact is, there are a lot of asians who are struggling to make ends meet in this city and elsewhere in this country, but are overlooked b/c we supposedly all work hard and do well in school and thus don't need any assistance. perhaps you aren't aware that many asian ethnic groups in this city have actually gotten poorer over the past decade than in the past after you adjust for inflation - part of that has to do with the type of immigrant coming into the city these days (i.e. in earlier years, certain groups had a greater percentage of well-educated professionals from abroad, whereas the newer influx might consist of poorer, less educated types), but still, it's not something that i think is apparent to outsiders or that many outside of the community really seem to care about.

did you know that violence against asian students in nyc public schools has spiked in the past decade? you don't hear about this stuff in the news b/c it doesn't involve black and white kids, but i know about it because i'm involved with some community organizations that keep track of this stuff. did you hear about a rash of chinese deliverymen getting robbed and killed in the city a few years back? asian women getting targeted by a rapist solely because of their race? a car full of chinese american kids getting racial slurs shouted at them by a bunch of white kids in douglaston, then getting beaten down with pipes and bats? sikhs getting beaten and having their turbans ripped off their heads by non-asians in ozone park? i could go on and on, but you get the idea. mind you, all of these things have happened in the past 7-8 years in the city. but most of this stuff doesn't make the news so you probably aren't aware of it.

don't even get me started on the subtlely racist stuff, from the glass ceiling that exists for asians and other minorities in the corporate world (many of us asians, esp. asian men, feel we have to work twice as hard to make it to the higher levels) to the snide remarks from longtime residents of neighborhoods that have seen an asian influx over the past 20 years. i once did a research paper in grad school about a neighborhood that had become heavily korean, but wanted to focus on non-race issues in the area, such as flooding, conversion of older homes to new 2 family homes, small businesses, day laborers hanging out on the streets, schools, etc. so i went out on foot and talked with random people in the neighborhood about these issues so that i could get direct input from the people who live there and know the neighborhood best. and you wouldn't believe how much bigoted feedback i received - they would say things to my face such as, "god, i hate koreans" and "i feel like a minority in my own neighborhood; you guys are ruining everything" and "you guys aren't even grateful for what we did for you in the korean war." despite the fact that i wanted to talk about non-racial issues, all they talked about was race. and i didn't even tell them whether i was korean or not, but got lumped in with "them" anyway.

did you know that about 8 years ago in one heavily korean neighborhood, a video surveillance camera caught a non-asian middle aged man spray painting graffiti on the business' storefront? the words read "go home g**ks".

did you know that i still get called a ch*nk from time to time in the city - yes, sometimes even in manhattan - while minding my own business? example: one time i was driving through the west village and was in the process of turning from one one-way side street onto another. a bicyclist came flying down in the wrong direction, almost collided with my car, and then flipped me off and yelled, "watch it, you f**ing ch*nk." i was pi$$ed, but didn't do anything b/c some battles aren't worth fighting. but this is a typical example of the "subtle" stuff that we have to deal with (many of my friends who are asian agree with me on this - as an example, some chinese friends of mine dread taking the LIRR from penn station to eastern queens late at night on weekends b/c there is often a group of young guys who yell racial slurs at them and racially/sexually charged comments to the female members of the group.)

look, i'm not saying that the majority of non-asians are racist or anything like that. far from it - i know better than to make sweeping generalizations about other races. and i'm certainly not accusing anyone here of being bigoted. but i really couldn't sit here and say nothing while some of you guys dismiss the notion of asians encountering racism in this city/region, b/c the fact is that we do. it's nowhere near as bad as what black people have historically had to deal with, but i can assure you that it's a reality - people's individual experiences may vary, but for the community as a whole it's definitely there. racial slurs, targeted violence solely b/c of appearance, vandalism against personal property and/or businesses, racially/sexually charged language and actions toward asian women - these are all things that are still very real in this city today.

Last edited by pbergen; 02-14-2008 at 03:29 PM..
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Old 02-14-2008, 02:57 PM
 
1,542 posts, read 6,039,368 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheRisingSon View Post
What?! Chelsea is nothing but safe. There is no racism towards Asians in NYC as far as I know. My live-in girlfriend is Japanese and she's never experience it once while she's lived here.
one person's experience doesn't mean that an entire race (with a variety of diverse subgroups, i should add) hasn't experienced racism. come on, man.
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Old 02-14-2008, 03:20 PM
 
1,542 posts, read 6,039,368 times
Reputation: 1705
Quote:
Originally Posted by meganw View Post
I'm British Asian and have recently relocated from London to New York. I am still extremely new to the city (been here only 4 weeks) and would like some advice on a potential property.

I'm currently staying at my firm's corporate apartment at Sutton Place. I like the safety and serenity of the Sutton but it seems like a predominantly mature (read: retirees/empty-nesters) affluent White neighbourhood where people can be quite stuck-up. And I sometimes wonder if they are stuck-up to me particularly because I'm Asian (happens alot in racist Britain)?

So my firm gave me another option, which is this high-rise rental building at West 27th n Sixth Ave. According to my housing agent, this would put me technically in Chelsea, which is supposed to be young and pleasant? I absolutely LOVE the building n apartment itself but I checked out the area several times, did some research and felt rather uncomfortable because:

1) towards broadway, from 24th to 31st st, there is a whole congregation of dodgy-looking rug n handbag wholesalers - merchants standing on the streets haggling really loudly.

2) i heard there are A LOT of nightclubs on west 27th st n perhaps even some prostitution-type activity in the area

3) from 27th st northward towards herald square along 6th n 7th ave looks rather rough n run-down.

4) someone told me there are quite a few dodgy Asian massage parlors in the outlying areas (towards 8th ave/30's sts)

5) maybe as a result of all of the above (or not), i notice people staring at me quite often (even though i dress extremely conservative).

Can you guys pls help me shed some light on the above - maybe I m being too paranoid?

The housing agent said all of Manhattan is somewhat like this - with 1 block being completely contrasting to the next.

As long as the neighbourhood is actually not as bad as I imagine, I would love to take the new apartment.....................
6th and 27th is a perfectly fine neighborhood. it's very busy during the day, but i would definitely recommend it if you want to be closer to the subway and within a short walking distance of chelsea, flatiron district, madison square park, herald square/koreatown, etc.

to discuss each of your concerns, one-by-one:
1) the wholesale guys around w. 27th/w. 28th/w. 29th/w. 30th sts are harmless. just a bunch of immigrants trying to make an honest living.

my mom is small asian woman in her late 50s, and she's been buying wholesale merchandise in that area for the past 25 years. granted, she buys specifically from the korean merchants in that area, but she still has to walk by all those west african, latino, indian, and other men all the time and has no problems. seriously, don't worry about this aspect of the neighborhood. just think of it as one of the last ungentrified slices left in midtown manhattan.

2) there are nightclubs all over manhattan these days. the biggest cluster are in the far west 20s near 10th and 11th aves, nowhere near 6th/27th. there are also a bunch of places on 19th and 21st sts near 6th ave, but again, those places are a few blocks from you. your specific street isn't bad at all, save for the constant line of taxis going up 6th ave.

prostitution isn't a huge problem in the area, either. there are a lot of cops around on 6th ave. and while side streets can be shady late at night, 6th ave is super busy and bright almost the entire day.

3) again, don't worry about it. you're not living in the 'hood by any means. you'll be living in a nice building on a very busy main avenue and close to several subway stations, penn station, and other neighborhoods that have plenty to do. IMO it's a great location.

4) asian massage parlors are scattered all over the city - even in neighborhoods you'd never expect. no need to worry, as this won't be an issue for you at all.

5) you're being paranoid. then again, many new yorkers can be described as such, so welcome to nyc.

most of your concerns really aren't that big of a deal. i'd make the move if i were you.
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