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Old 03-24-2016, 10:23 AM
 
3,210 posts, read 4,613,160 times
Reputation: 4314

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Quote:
Originally Posted by BugsyPal View Post
First of all no one is using the homeless to "bash" gentrification.


Second if you are unable to understand the forces economic and otherwise that huge shifts in income demographics brings; then this entire conversation is just not up your street.


Land, real estate and other prices in this city are rising because quite frankly there are persons willing to pay what the market is demanding. Aside from the landfills along the East and North/Hudson rivers no one is making any more of it in NYC. Thus what there is and the property upon which it rests fluctuates in value. Right now land is at historic costs and that is causing all sort of problems.


However since we are on Greenwich Village let us use a recent famous example from that area; the closing of Saint Vincent's Hospital.


There was and is more still today plenty of money in GV that could have "saved" SVH. Yes, the place had management and a few other problems, but the main thing was the changing demographics of the GV/West Side area. New wealthy arrivals (and even some long time residents) viewed the place as a dirty charity hospital that served a population they know nothing of nor care to learn about. These people go to places like NYP or NYU, but certainly not a "pauper's hospital. When Saint Vincent's finally went belly up the Rudin family circled their wagons to protect their initial investment (loans to SVH which in turn gave them rights to develop part of the campus), and thus making sure any efforts to get another hospital on that property failed. The SVH campus real estate was simply worth more than the hospital. This is basically how things played out with LICH.


Look what has happened to Bleecker Street....
It's unfortunate that St Vins closed, but people aren't obligated to donate to something they don't want to.

As far as the rest of your post, you've explained and detailed exactly zero. Places and demographics change all the time and people get by.
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Old 03-24-2016, 10:30 AM
 
31,907 posts, read 26,970,741 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shizzles View Post
It's unfortunate that St Vins closed, but people aren't obligated to donate to something they don't want to.

As far as the rest of your post, you've explained and detailed exactly zero. Places and demographics change all the time and people get by.
I'll give you "zero"...


The changes in West/Greenwich Village since about 2011 until 2015 have far surpassed those of the previous decades going back forty or even fifty years (if not further). If you recall it was the "working and middle" class of GV that defeated Robert Moses. Through the 1980's and much of the 1990's both commercial and residential could find something down there "affordable", though it varied by area.
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Old 03-24-2016, 10:59 AM
 
3,210 posts, read 4,613,160 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BugsyPal View Post
I'll give you "zero"...


The changes in West/Greenwich Village since about 2011 until 2015 have far surpassed those of the previous decades going back forty or even fifty years (if not further). If you recall it was the "working and middle" class of GV that defeated Robert Moses. Through the 1980's and much of the 1990's both commercial and residential could find something down there "affordable", though it varied by area.
While I deeply admire the grit and determination of those who thankfully killed the LoMex expressway, the people in the way of the Cross-Bronx fought just as hard and we're steamrolled. The sad truth is the movers and shakers in NY politics had changed views on the matter and they would not go to bat for Ole Mo anymore.

As far as the afford ability angle, it's unfortunate, but it's how things work. Maybe there should be a program for creating affordable housing for those who derive their income from the arts?
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Old 03-24-2016, 11:28 AM
 
31,907 posts, read 26,970,741 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shizzles View Post
While I deeply admire the grit and determination of those who thankfully killed the LoMex expressway, the people in the way of the Cross-Bronx fought just as hard and we're steamrolled. The sad truth is the movers and shakers in NY politics had changed views on the matter and they would not go to bat for Ole Mo anymore.

As far as the afford ability angle, it's unfortunate, but it's how things work. Maybe there should be a program for creating affordable housing for those who derive their income from the arts?

There is one down there; Westbeth: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westbe...ists_Community


Westbeth comes of age: A unique artists’complex tries to stay afloat




Westbeth and how the West was won
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Old 03-24-2016, 12:26 PM
 
3,210 posts, read 4,613,160 times
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I wouldn't mind there being a program to enable artists/artisans to be able to have affordable housing on a more widespread scale. This would mitigate some of the cultural impacts of gentrification.
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Old 03-24-2016, 01:32 PM
 
2,440 posts, read 6,258,595 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shizzles View Post
While I deeply admire the grit and determination of those who thankfully killed the LoMex expressway, the people in the way of the Cross-Bronx fought just as hard and we're steamrolled. The sad truth is the movers and shakers in NY politics had changed views on the matter and they would not go to bat for Ole Mo anymore.

As far as the afford ability angle, it's unfortunate, but it's how things work. Maybe there should be a program for creating affordable housing for those who derive their income from the arts?
The Cross Bronx Expressway was going to built no matter what because a direct interstate route between New England and the mid-Atlantic and south was necessary. The question was why did they build it where they built it, when a slight jog to the south would have saved thousand of apartments.
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Old 03-24-2016, 01:57 PM
 
3,210 posts, read 4,613,160 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rubygreta View Post
The Cross Bronx Expressway was going to built no matter what because a direct interstate route between New England and the mid-Atlantic and south was necessary. The question was why did they build it where they built it, when a slight jog to the south would have saved thousand of apartments.
We'll never know, but my main contention is that while both opposition groups put up a heroic fight, the reality is the sewer of NY politics is what get's the final say. In the early 50s when the Cross Bronx was being born, cars were king and cities were places to dump the poor and forget about them. By 1960, the seeds of urban revival were being planted and Jane Jacobs was on the scene, which went in favor of killing the LoMex. Politicans are just as susceptible to trends as the rest of us. Same reason why Penn Station got demoed but GCT is still with us. Timing and shifts in public opinion.
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Old 03-25-2016, 07:13 AM
 
Location: Manhattan
25,368 posts, read 37,073,996 times
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We might also remember how residents and community boards stopped the building of the mammoth Westway highway/development project which would have further sterilized the West Village. It would have been Battery Park City all the way up to Times Square.
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