Family of 4 looking for doable housing on ~60k in/around NYC (Rockland: appointed, apartment)

[nanobug]

After browsing here for what seems like all night (much to my wife's chagrin), I decided to post because I don't think I'm getting the straightforward answer I want. I know there is another thread here about 60k a year but I feel my situation is a little different so what's the harm in posting?

Anyhow, my situation is as follows. I'm 26 years old, live in a little town somewhere in the void between Harrisburg and Philadelphia. Right now I'm a stay-at-home dad while I attend school full time in pursuit of a Computer Science degree. My wife makes ~24k a year, I've got some help from student loans, and really we're doing okay. We live frugally, some months (especially these winter ones) are tighter than others, but we're not struggling or starving. Rent is $460/mo for a 2 bedroom apartment with a large yard and one off street parking spot. We pay gas heat and electric (about $200/mo right now), $70 cell phone bill, $100 on some medical bills. We typically eat about $100 a week in groceries. After car expenses and other miscellaneous things, we've got enough to tuck $50 away in a rainy day fund and maybe go out to dinner. It ain't glamorous but its temporary and we're happy.

I recently spoke to a good friend and old roommate who is living on Long Island and commuting 2 hrs into NYC for work. He is an IT manager and he offered me a position at his company as a system administrator making ~60k a year.

I know that ~60k a year isn't as much there as it is here, but it -should- provide a better standard of living and even if things are the same, provided we're not living in a roach motel and getting mugged on the way to the train station, I can deal because it will be good for my career for a few years. I can go to school part time, work my way up in the company a bit, and finish school with a couple years of practical work experience under my belt with a company that is doing exciting work with big players in the industry.

Talked it over with the wife, and she's uneasy about it (and rightfully so). So I'm on a mission to figure out what's best for my family in this situation. Let me stress that I have a GED and am only on my first semester of college towards this degree. I have a lot of practical experience, but not enough that I would get an opportunity like this on my own. This is a great chance for me to get my foot in the door in a large company that does a lot of cool work in the field I am interested in. I would like some honest opinions with consideration to this.

Now, the limitations. I need to live closer to work than 2 hrs away. I don't know how bad being double taxed is, but if it's bad, I'd like to avoid it. So NJ could be out unless the lower cost of living will offset the double taxation. This sucks because the company is about 5 blocks east of the Holland Tunnel, so geographically NJ is the better option. I can deal with an hour commute, maybe even an hour and a half on a bad day, but the idea of 2 hrs of public transportation each way makes this idea a non-starter for me. I was looking at spots in Long Island and it looks more like the type of area we currently live in but I don't know where my friend is at exactly, so it's hard to gauge if all of Long Island amounts to a 2 hr commmute.

The other thing is, My wife has a car and she doesn't want to give it up. We would like to live somewhere that is close enough for me to commute, but far out enough that owning a car isn't a luxury. We like shopping for food once a week and loading the car with groceries, and we would like to be able to visit family and friends over the weekend so we need a way to get back here.

And finally, we're looking for something like where we live now, just close enough for me to commute in. I don't want to live in the city. I want to work there and maybe catch a Broadway show once in a while. We live in an area similar to NYC in that its mostly townhouses, but different in that you can actually find parking, buildings are 3 floors or less, less noise, less crime, and most places have yards. So I can deal with city somewhat, but not the whole 'rat race'.

Oh, and my wife will not be working, at least for the first year or so. This needs to be on my income alone, which after taxes should be about $3500 a month.

What's the verdict?

Edit: One more thing, our children are both girls so they can share a bedroom. 2br is fine, 3br is preferable.

[Colokev]

Hmm..this will be very hard. I'm not the expert on commuting into the city but, keep in mind-it will cost a lot of money per month to commute in. The train in from LI is about $300 a month and I'm sure NJ transit is just about the same. Living far out on LI or NJ would keep your rental cost down (you would not be able to live in Manhattan) but it will cost you a lot in transit costs. Maybe look into Dutchess or Rockland County in NY. They are both north of the city and cheaper.

Also, everything in the NYC area is more expensive than where you're coming from in PA. Gas, milk, groceries, restaurants, etc are all more expensive and should be factored in to your budget here.

Good luck!

[Ace Rock]

Jesus Christ! Man, for the sake of your family, do NOT do it.

1. Your commute will be hell. The hours on a train add up. You'll wake up early and come home late. Add in commute time for classes. You won't have any quality time with your girls or your family.

2. On a $3500/mo. budget, it'll he a HUGE strain on your family. Factor in $350-500 per person for train passes and subway cards. Add insane auto insurance premiums for the tri-state area. Plus student loan payments. Plus housing costs. A 1 bedroom in a semi-decent family area in the tri-state are will cost at least $1000/mo. Plus stuff for your kids, babysitters, etc. Plus everything else is more expensive.

With a young family, your priority should be finish your education. Most single people making $60,000 have a hard enough time meeting the financial strain in NYC. On top of that you have school, work, spouse, and kids.

Once you get your computer science degree, you'll have plenty of doors open to you. Don't get sidetracked by NYC. NYC will suck your finances dry and put your family in a worse position.

[newtoli]

Don't do this to your family. You won't have a better quality of life here. You will be worse off than what you are describing now, and will pay AT A MINIMUM, $1500 to rent a 2br within any type of reasonable commute, and you'll have to add on $300 to that for commuting costs.

Also, with just a GED and a semester of college under your belt, you are going to hit some HARD competition for those IT jobs. There are a lot of super talented, educated people gunning for those jobs (my husband is in the industry)

How far are you from Philly? There are some good paying IT jobs in Philly as well. I used to live in Central NJ an hour from Philly, an hour from Manhattan, so when job searching would always check Philly and Manhattan both.

[BK2Westchester]

It ain't glamorous but its temporary and we're happy.

The above says it all. Continue your studies, accelerate the classes if you can.

Stay in contact with people who can help you. Send them birthday cards, christmas cards, new years cards- send THEIR kids birthday cards, etc.. stay in contact.

In a year or so your wife will join the workforce and you will have two incomes.

By then you should find yourself with more options.

[nanobug]

Originally Posted by newtoli

Don't do this to your family. You won't have a better quality of life here. You will be worse off than what you are describing now, and will pay AT A MINIMUM, $1500 to rent a 2br within any type of reasonable commute, and you'll have to add on $300 to that for commuting costs.

Also, with just a GED and a semester of college under your belt, you are going to hit some HARD competition for those IT jobs. There are a lot of super talented, educated people gunning for those jobs (my husband is in the industry)

How far are you from Philly? There are some good paying IT jobs in Philly as well. I used to live in Central NJ an hour from Philly, an hour from Manhattan, so when job searching would always check Philly and Manhattan both.

Ok here's the thing. ~60k is the base figure. He has said that if I ask for 70k and state my reasons for asking for it, I'll probably get it, but he doesn't want to offer it and then have me disappointed.

The other thing is, if it goes through, I'll be getting relocation expenses so transitioning to the city will be a lot easier.

The final thing is, I am in dire need of something like this. This company is doing what I want to do after I finish school. You see the long commute as a problem but I see it as free time to study. You see this salary as not very much but I'm seeing it as a good starting salary and a basis to make more.

I'm willing to deal with the commute. I'm willing to deal with living frugal.

This is what I'm seeing in costs:

Monthly:
1500 rent
300 train/subway
800 groceries
200 gas+electric
120 car insurance
50 internet
70 cell phone
130 health insurance

~3170 a month

Now I'm estimating taxes on $5000 a month income to 30%, but it could be lower with me being the sole breadwinner. I'm also assuming that I will make ONLY 60k, no higher. If I make 70k, at 30% taxes, I should bring home ~4k a month. That's very doable for a couple years, even if I don't get a raise. Maybe it's not for those of you who need to always be in the city doing something, but I've been there and done that.

[LookingtoLeave]

I think the opportunity is good considering you haven't finished school yet. Hey I would've loved to had a $60k job offer with only a GED. For that reason, I would say go for it because if you let it pass you by, it may not be there when you finish school and then you will have to face the competition unless you can ensure a job will still be there when you're done at the same company-although realize there are no guarantees.

The issue I would say is the commute. The only way you guys could make it is to live pretty far out, but like the other posters said, you will have to sacrifice time with your family.

IMO, what you need to do is assess if NY is really where you want to be regardless of this particular job offer. Do you really want to raise your kids around NYC? That's a huge deal! If you do, you may want to consider it b/c I think the opportunity you've been given may not come again. Then see if your wife could get a p-t job perhaps. If you are truly indifferent about where you live, don't do that to your wife and kids.

[newtoli]

I'm editing this because I may have misread.

Do you have a SOLID job offer with relo?

To estimate take home pay - PaycheckCity.com - Employee Self-Service Tools To Better Manage Your Paycheck

[BK2Westchester]

The final thing is, I am in dire need of something like this. This company is doing what I want to do after I finish school. You see the long commute as a problem but I see it as free time to study. You see this salary as not very much but I'm seeing it as a good starting salary and a basis to make more.

I'm willing to deal with the commute. I'm willing to deal with living frugal.

You seem to have all the answers already. I'm confused as to why you need this board to help justfy the move.

don't follow a bad decision with a worse one.

[LookingtoLeave]

The original post said his friends from LI offered him a job making $60k per year, so I took that to mean it's his if he wants it. The only thing I saw up for debate was the salary increase to $70k.