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there is undoubtedly overhyped and overpriced food in the fine dining space, but within fast casual dining, i don't really see many examples of it. do you? some of you think ramen is overpriced, at $10-$13 a bowl, but that's because your context of ramen is 50 cent top ramen from the supermarket, or ramen made in some random town at a strip mall. that's really what it is. context. a man from fukuoka japan will consider a $10 bowl of ramen in the city as normal.
another example is lobster roll. like 7-8 years ago, lobster rolls got introduced and popularized in the city at around $13-$16. alot of people complained about prices, but that's the real price to charge for the labor and cost of domestic maine lobster. but if some entrepreneur was able to procure cheap frozen lobsters from vietnam and sell them for $6, i bet you most young people in nyc would order the cheaper product which dilutes and cheapens the industry. as i said before, this is a function of low standards, and most young people in the city come from a demographic that grew up on top ramen and pizza hut but try to reject that so they're pulled in two different directions. it's this perverse insecurity. they want something distinguished like di fara but priced like dominos and in the end, they don't really know what the differences are except that one has won awards.
if someone made a $4.50 bowl of ramen it'd probably sell alot. someone who knows ramen will immediately know it is inferior, but the avg guy in nyc probably won't. and that's how entire cuisines get destroyed in nyc. but you never really see the japanese undercutting each other with cheaper ingredients and lower quality. and that's why people often say japanese food like ramen and sushi are overpriced, because they won't sell out their food culture as others have.
Actually, there are many people from Japan turned off by the price of ramen in NYC/U.S. I know quite a few Japanese people and they scoff at the idea of paying $10-15 for a bowl of ramen. Americans seem to think of ramen as a higher quality food, but ramen is budget fast food in Japan. My boyfriend is from Osaka and said the average price of ramen at restaurants in Osaka and in other cities in Japan is closer to $6-8, he doesn't eat at Japanese restaurants unless it's work-related (meaning the boss is buying) or someone invited him for someone's birthday/going away party. I don't know any of my friends who eat at ramen places because it IS overpriced. You'll be amazed at how many Japanese people do buy those cheaper little packs of ramen (including Maruchan) or instant ramen bowls simply because they can make their own soup base themselves with the toppings they want for a fraction of the price because ramen was NEVER considered fine dining (unless you're eating ramen with fugu or otoro in it which...would probably be just a huge waste heh) in Japan.
Actually, there are many people from Japan turned off by the price of ramen in NYC/U.S. I know quite a few Japanese people and they scoff at the idea of paying $10-15 for a bowl of ramen.
Flip side if I scoff at eating at McDonads in a foreign country...I seen a Big Mac meal for about $20 USD.
Actually, there are many people from Japan turned off by the price of ramen in NYC/U.S. I know quite a few Japanese people and they scoff at the idea of paying $10-15 for a bowl of ramen. Americans seem to think of ramen as a higher quality food, but ramen is budget fast food in Japan. My boyfriend is from Osaka and said the average price of ramen at restaurants in Osaka and in other cities in Japan is closer to $6-8, he doesn't eat at Japanese restaurants unless it's work-related (meaning the boss is buying) or someone invited him for someone's birthday/going away party. I don't know any of my friends who eat at ramen places because it IS overpriced. You'll be amazed at how many Japanese people do buy those cheaper little packs of ramen or instant ramen bowls simply because they can make their own soup base themselves with the toppings they want for a fraction of the price because ramen was NEVER considered fine dining (unless you're eating ramen with fugu or otoro in it which would probably be just a waste heh) in Japan.
actually, that all depends on the conversion rate of usd/jpy. from our financial crisis to around 2013, nyc ramen was cheap for japanese transplants a $12 bowl was the equivalent of $7 via yen conversion. since then up to late last year, everything was expensive for them. this year, yen is climbing back up, so stuff is cheap for them again.
this is incorrect. there are 21,000 ramen bars in greater tokyo and close to 100,000 ramen bars in all of japan. there are 474,000 restaurants in general in japan. one restaurant for each 266 people. in america, it's one for each 547. japanese eat out way more than americans. most japanese apts in tokyo don't even have stoves or kitchens. the young generation don't cook! many live off high tech food delivery. for most, they may have a single canned fuel burner and a small microwave.
you can definitely get a $6-8 bowl of ramen in dallas, atlanta, suburb strip mall outside los angeles, or hawaii. it's $10-$15 in nyc, because EVERYTHING is expensive here.
i don't consider ramen high end fine dining. it is in fact a fast food. if you've visited some of the better ramen bars in nyc, they look like izakaya style bar type establishment. no nonsense, narrow halls, narrow eating areas, utilitarian rustic japanese style. they're not out to impress anyone and the ethic remains, get in, order, slurp ur ramen, get out.
the japanese don't consider ramen upscale fine dining, but the japanese have higher standards in it's preparation. they have higher standards on everything. ramen competition is way higher there, and the best ramen joint in nyc would just be mediocre there. yes, there is a distinction between instant ramen, which japanese also eat as a snack or emergency meal, but they differentiate that from bar ramen.
Last edited by HarryHaller73; 07-14-2016 at 07:48 PM..
pretentiousness is sometimes a code word made by socialists for people who strive for excellence.
i respect a man who spent his whole life perfecting ramen noodles than some lice ridden dali moustache wearing bed head sanders voting commie fingerpainting abstractions of his horrific upbringing.
actually, that all depends on the conversion rate of usd/jpy. from our financial crisis to around 2013, nyc ramen was cheap for japanese transplants a $12 bowl was the equivalent of $7 via yen conversion. since then up to late last year, everything was expensive for them. this year, yen is climbing back up, so stuff is cheap for them again.
this is incorrect. there are 21,000 ramen bars in greater tokyo and close to 100,000 ramen bars in all of japan. there are 474,000 restaurants in general in japan. one restaurant for each 266 people. in america, it's one for each 547. japanese eat out way more than americans. most japanese apts in tokyo don't even have stoves or kitchens. the young generation don't cook! many live off high tech food delivery. for most, they may have a single canned fuel burner and a small microwave.
you can definitely get a $6-8 bowl of ramen in dallas, atlanta, suburb strip mall outside los angeles, or hawaii. it's $10-$15 in nyc, because EVERYTHING is expensive here.
i don't consider ramen high end fine dining. it is in fact a fast food. if you've visited some of the better ramen bars in nyc, they look like izakaya style bar type establishment. no nonsense, narrow halls, narrow eating areas, utilitarian rustic japanese style. they're not out to impress anyone and the ethic remains, get in, order, slurp ur ramen, get out.
the japanese don't consider ramen upscale fine dining, but the japanese have higher standards in it's preparation. they have higher standards on everything. ramen competition is way higher there, and the best ramen joint in nyc would just be mediocre there. yes, there is a distinction between instant ramen, which japanese also eat as a snack or emergency meal, but they differentiate that from bar ramen.
This was around 2011 and they had no interest in ramen restaurants in NYC then, I'm sure some Japanese people did, but none of my friends. When we ate out it was places like Woorijip - cheap Korean buffet style restaurant in K-town.
Incorrect? No, when I first moved here I roomed with Japanese people and that's where I learned to make ramen (using instant ramen with a homemade basic dashi) so I'm wrong how???? You seem to have some misconceptions about Japanese people if you truly believe that no one within a certain age group cooks...ever, unless you equate cooking with making everything from scratch which most Japanese people, like most people, are too busy to cook like that every day and that's why conbini foods *like instant ramen* are extremely popular. Also, not every Japanese person is from Tokyo, my friends came from all over Japan - from Hokkaido to Kyushu, my bf is from Osaka and he's never been to Tokyo and has no interest in Tokyo heh. Also that kitchen bit is false, I had this convo with my friends and roommates about Japanese apartments and that's not true, that most Japanese apartments don't have kitchens. Most of them do, including Tokyo, they're just smaller since Japan overall has limited space and Tokyo has a larger population than NYC - over 13 million. My bf too grew up in an apartment WITH a kitchen. Many old, pre-war (WW2) buildings didn't have private bathrooms due to public baths being common, so maybe they had more of a communal kitchen area in the building then, but this was 60+ years ago and most of those apartment buildings were either destroyed in the bombings or torn down/renovated. There are some apartments that don't have kitchens and/or bathrooms still around usually in the old pre-war apartment buildings, not super popular, but rent is cheaper than normal.
Huh?? Not everything is expensive in NYC, I used to get $6 curry rice dishes from Yagura before they closed. I'm guessing you don't go to Chinatown much if you think everything is expensive.
I'm not completely clueless about Japanese food, my boyfriend is a chef at a Japanese restaurant which I won't name. I don't eat much of the popular foods like ramen or sushi, I do like one of the more notorious foods: natto. I eat it about three times a week, plain or seasoned with rice *sometimes with black rice which is not common in Japanese dishes outside of desserts* or natto pasta - I love it! My bf likes it, but being from Kansai (natto is not popular in Kansai) he didn't like it growing up and he's the only one in his family that will touch the stuff haha! And with noodles I prefer udon - kitsune udon with charred maitake - perfect dish for when the weather gets cooler, although I'll eat it in hot weather too with the a/c blasting
You are right about that, sometimes fans of Japanese food try to come off as experts of the entire Japanese culture (excuse me, CULTURES). I can't think of any other cuisine where people try to read the people based off of their food alone, not even Italian or French cuisine goes through this odd process and it gets ODD at times, like reading Yelp reviews where people will rate the "authenticity" of Japanese food based on the staff speaking FLUENT (none of that broken bs here haha) Japanese...??????????????????????????????????????? ??????????????? And not just that, ASSUMING THEY DON'T KNOW ENGLISH...???????????????????????????????????????? ??????????????????
I know a pizza joint in Flushing where the guy speaks Italian, yet none of the reviews state his authenticity based on speaking Italian. Real strange indeed.
Last edited by lightningfro; 07-14-2016 at 10:14 PM..
You are right about that, sometimes fans of Japanese food try to come off as experts of the entire Japanese culture. I can't think of any other cuisine where people try to read the people based off of their food alone, not even Italian or French cuisine goes through this odd process and it gets ODD at times, like reading Yelp reviews where people will equate the "authenticity" of Japanese food based on the staff speaking Japanese...??????????????????????????????????????? ??????????????? I know a pizza joint in Flushing where the guy speaks Italian, yet none of the reviews state his authenticity based on speaking Italian. Real strange
That's bizarre, and they have to be oblivious to not realize that most restaurants in NYC have Mexicans or Ecuadorians working in the kitchen regardless of what kind of cuisine it is. But yeah, I don't see the need to be condescending over a bowl of ramen, it's not a big deal.
Why not pay $56 and get one TWICE as good?<yes, that's sarcasm>
toss some truffles on them, it will be $56 easily
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