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All I have is anectodal evidence but I grew up (Bergen Beach) across from Canarsie (from Seaview Ave to Flatlands). That area is (very) solid middle class with median household incomes 80K+. That area is ~90% West Indian/Carribean. It's well know that major employment bases are NYCT, city jobs, nursing, and (increasingly) construction unions that all pay well with good benefits. The same is happening in old Mill Basin. They are mostly 1st and 2nd generation.
Can you point to Puerto Rican neighborhood with similar characteristics? I'm trying to think of one and I can't.
I think Puerto Ricans just move into all types of neighborhoods. Puerto Ricans have houses and apartments living among white or black neighbors. Im from the Bronx and here we live in neighborhoods along with Italians, Jamaicans, Irish what have you spread throughout the borough. There may be other factors if your looking for us Puerto Ricans to have a Puerto Rican section that is the equivalent of a white area or Jamaican area. Well where I live the homes have a large percentage of PR homeowners in Castle Hill, Unionport, Soundview, and in Throggs neck we own as well. What I see is that many PR have left the city, sold homes to the newly arrived Bangladeshi and Guyanese and moved to Florida or to Jersey and PA.
All I have is anectodal evidence but I grew up (Bergen Beach) across from Canarsie (from Seaview Ave to Flatlands). That area is (very) solid middle class with median household incomes 80K+. That area is ~90% West Indian/Carribean. It's well know that major employment bases are NYCT, city jobs, nursing, and (increasingly) construction unions that all pay well with good benefits. The same is happening in old Mill Basin. They are mostly 1st and 2nd generation.
Can you point to Puerto Rican neighborhood with similar characteristics? I'm trying to think of one and I can't.
Well idk about New York, I'm sure there's some areas in the eastern part of the Bronx that are middle class with large Puerto Rican populations, maybe even Westchester County and suburban North Jersey.
But I believe this is far more common in the Philadelphia area and throughout the whole state of Florida. Where you can find areas that atleast 70% Puerto Rican and middle class.
It's not evidence that recent immigrants from the Caribbean are any better off than the Puerto Ricans. With Haitians and Dominicans there are major language barriers one must overcome (and these immigrants are often not high school graduates in their home nations), and I seriously doubt they can get better jobs than a NYC Puerto Rican who already speaks English. I have lived in many neighborhoods that have large percentages of Latinos and Asians. Growing up in Queens we had neighbors living 20 people to a two bedroom apartment, and NYC Puerto Ricans generally don't live like that.
And I do not have antipathy towards West Indians.
It is evident you'd like to believe yourself better than NYC Puerto Ricans, but things can't be so great for you if you have to put so much energy into putting them down.
Yes you do have antipathy towards West Indians.
And I have showed you several times statistics that indicate that immigrants from Jamaica, Trinidad, Guyana and EVEN Haiti aren't the failures that you imagine us to be. Our median incomes and levels of household ownership put is squarely where the AVERAGE NYC resident is. So yes we are better off than are Puerto Ricans because Puerto Ricans are among the poorer groups in the city with lower median household incomes, college attainment and home ownership.
And rather than citing stats you cite your experience. Well maybe you just happened to live in crummy neighborhoods.
Puerto Rican speaking here, what's the hostility for PRs, as evidenced by the " White wannabe Puerto Ricans try to deny the fact ? " .
The wannabe Puerto Rican who was talking about them being the "new Italians" and boasting about how they are all marrying white Catholics. If you agree with him than you can also be described as such.
And I have showed you several times statistics that indicate that immigrants from Jamaica, Trinidad, Guyana and EVEN Haiti aren't the failures that you imagine us to be. Our median incomes and levels of household ownership put is squarely where the AVERAGE NYC resident is. So yes we are better off than are Puerto Ricans because Puerto Ricans are among the poorer groups in the city with lower median household incomes, college attainment and home ownership.
And rather than citing stats you cite your experience. Well maybe you just happened to live in crummy neighborhoods.
I have never claimed that anyone from the Caribbean was FAILURES. Not at all.
However I called you to task for statements like the last statement.
Jamaicans have more homeownership than Puerto Ricans. Even if this is true, WHO GIVES A DAMN.
So I dismissed your comments like that because they were absolutely foolish.
Ayn Rand said racism is a DUMB for a COLLECTIVISM, and clearly she is right.
When someone goes to buy a home (assuming no discrimination is taking place) it does not matter whether one is Haitian, Dominican, Puerto Ricans, etc. Either you have the income to buy the home and the credit or you don't.
Clearly you have no concept of people as people.
And you're selective too where you play the they have more game.
I pointed out to you that the equity that Caribbeans have in NYC is nothing compared to what WHITE people have, because most property in NYC is owned by white people, or controlled by institutions whose management is heavily white.
That is when you ACCUSED me of being anti Caribbean, because I pointed out a fact.
And also be to completely honest, all professional jobs in NYC (well paying ones) one will find Blacks/people of color in FAR smaller numbers than white people.
The wannabe Puerto Rican who was talking about them being the "new Italians" and boasting about how they are all marrying white Catholics. If you agree with him than you can also be described as such.
Many Puerto Ricans do marry white Catholics. I've met a number of people who were Puerto Rican/Italian in particularly, or Puerto Rican and Irish. Other Latinos marry white Catholic in large numbers of well. Of course Latinos have a high rate of interrmarriage with non Latinos (not just whites).
So while not ALL Puerto Ricans marry white Catholics, a statistically significant NUMBER of them do.
Latinos marrying non Latinos are 45% of all interracial marriages.
The wannabe Puerto Rican who was talking about them being the "new Italians" and boasting about how they are all marrying white Catholics. If you agree with him than you can also be described as such.
And I have showed you several times statistics that indicate that immigrants from Jamaica, Trinidad, Guyana and EVEN Haiti aren't the failures that you imagine us to be. Our median incomes and levels of household ownership put is squarely where the AVERAGE NYC resident is. So yes we are better off than are Puerto Ricans because Puerto Ricans are among the poorer groups in the city with lower median household incomes, college attainment and home ownership.
And rather than citing stats you cite your experience. Well maybe you just happened to live in crummy neighborhoods.
You are delusional. Call me when West Indians reach the level of white people in actually economic importance. You know, controlling major institutions, graduating from NYC's top colleges, etc. Asians have much higher graduation rates from top universities than West Indians, so compared to Asians and Asian Americans, West Indians are doing pretty poorly.
Asians test into the city's top public schools in much larger numbers than West Indians, and this has long term consequences for their admission into top universities.
I'm currently in Manhattan in a rapidly gentrifying neighborhood and there are few West Indians, and if they weren't already here few of them could afford to live here. Come to think of it I see few West Indians in Manhattan or in Western Brooklyn or Western Queens.
I am not putting down West Indians, but there is not a vast difference in wealth between them and other minority groups, and in fact Asian Americans undeniably are doing much better.
Last edited by NyWriterdude; 11-07-2016 at 07:23 AM..
All I have is anectodal evidence but I grew up (Bergen Beach) across from Canarsie (from Seaview Ave to Flatlands). That area is (very) solid middle class with median household incomes 80K+. That area is ~90% West Indian/Carribean. It's well know that major employment bases are NYCT, city jobs, nursing, and (increasingly) construction unions that all pay well with good benefits. The same is happening in old Mill Basin. They are mostly 1st and 2nd generation.
Can you point to Puerto Rican neighborhood with similar characteristics? I'm trying to think of one and I can't.
There are Latino neighborhoods with large numbers of Latino middle class people and property owners. Central Queens (Jackson Heights, Corona) has large numbers of Latino (Colombian, Mexican, Dominican, Puerto Rican) business owners and civil servants and many of these people own property such as houses, co-co-ops, or condos). West Harlem has a number of co-ops, and a number of Latinos (Dominican and Puerto Rican) who are small business owners and who own co-ops. Many of the Latinos have union jobs at City College and Columbia, at area hospitals such as New York Presbyterian (Washington Heights), St. Lukes (Morningside Heights), Harlem Hospital, Mt. Sinai Hospital, etc.
Do keep in mind not everyone in the Bronx is poor and you definitely have middle class people and homeowners there as well.
The other thing is I cannot think of any exclusively Puerto Rican neighborhood these days. Any neighborhood with Puerto Ricans will have lots of other Latinos, and Dominicans are now the biggest Latino group in the city. Puerto Ricans are second, and Mexicans are third.
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