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What is fair? Flat percent? Progressive tax? Tax based on impact those taxes will have. Oh.. and corporations aren't humans.
it is not up to me to re-write the countries tax laws or solve the worlds issues . i am not smart enough to do that .
but i am smart enough to learn to play the hand they dealt me the best i can , rather than complain to no avail about the dealer ...
i am 65 and as for as long as i worked , no political party or political leader ever changed my daily life , with one exception back in the 1970's when i got drafted .
everyday , for more than 45 years i got dressed , got in the car and went to work . in the end it was me that made everything happen , good or bad in my life , not some political party .
Last edited by mathjak107; 09-05-2017 at 02:35 PM..
The Liberal Washington Post has acknowledged that our workforce is making a major comeback under President Trump. America’s middle class making a major comeback under Donald Trump Robert Samuelson Washington Post
On this Labor Day, the American middle class survives. Indeed, it’s expanding. That’s not the conclusion of some arcane scholarly study. It’s the judgment of Americans themselves, though it hasn’t received much attention from politicians or the media. Most Americans have moved beyond the fears bred by the Great Recession.
The middle-class comeback may be the year’s most under reported story.
Public opinion polls depict the change. In its surveys, Gallup regularly asks people to report their social class. They are given five choices: upper class; upper middle; middle; working; and lower class.
In 2006, before the recession, 60 percent of Americans identified themselves as either middle or upper middle class, while 38 percent chose working class and lower class. Only 1 percent put themselves in the upper class.
The 2008-09 financial crisis and the Great Recession demolished these long-standing class patterns. The middle class shrunk dramatically amid high unemployment, home foreclosures and heavy debts. As late as 2015, the country was almost evenly split between those in the middle and upper middle classes (51 percent) and those in the working and lower classes (48 percent), according to Gallup.
No more. In its latest poll on class identity, done in June, Gallup found that 62 percent put themselves in the broadly defined middle class, while only 36 percent classified themselves as working class or lower class.
The shifts, said Gallup, began in 2016 and demonstrated “that subjective social class identification has stabilized close to the prevailing pattern observed before 2009.”
This is no fluke.
The temptation is to dismiss the Gallup results as an outlier. Don’t. Karlyn Bowman, the polling expert at the American Enterprise Institute, spends her time searching for opinion trends. She finds that countless polls tell a similar story.
People are more optimistic. Many polls have, like the survey on class, returned to pre-crisis patterns. “We’re back economically” is how she puts it.
Consider trends from three polls:
■ Jobs are more plentiful. A Gallup poll in August found that 59 percent of respondents thought it was a “good time to find a quality job.” In 2009 and 2010, this rating hovered around a meager 10 percent.
■ More people feel they’re getting ahead. In July, 42 percent of respondents to a poll reported personal gains, up from only 23 percent in 2008 and beating the previous peak of 41 percent.
■ Most workers do not believe their jobs will be outsourced abroad, contrary to much commentary. A Gallup poll this year reported that nine of 10 workers feel un-threatened by outsourcing.
It is not that U.S. workers have no worries. But job growth, up by 17 million since the recession-low point, and wage gains have reduced anxieties.
Indeed, wages for many middle-class workers may be understated. Median weekly earnings grew almost 2 percent annually from 2012 to 2016. But these numbers are depressed by the retirement of well-paid baby boomers and their replacement by lower-paid, younger workers. When economists at the San Francisco Federal Reserve eliminated these effects, median wages grew nearly 4 percent annually for continuously employed full-time workers.
All this is reassuring. Middle-class values of order, predictability and personal responsibility have not entirely vanished. People could repay debts or add to savings. The University of Michigan Survey of Consumers reports that half of households say their “finances had recently improved, the best reading since 2000,” notes director Richard Curtin.
Just how this new middle-class confidence fares in the next (inevitable) recession is unknowable.
Favorable views of the U.S. economy continue to soar to heights not seen in more than 15 years. … Americans say they’re evaluating him more on culture and values than on how they’re faring financially.”
As for an uplifting effect on other American institutions, there isn’t much yet. Gallup asks respondents whether they have “quite a lot” or “a great deal” of confidence in 14 institutions. The average level was 35 in June; Congress was 12, internet news 16 and big business 21. The highest rated institution was the military at 72, followed by small business at 70.
A successful America requires a large — and largely successful — middle class. The middle-class revival is evidence of optimism. The lingering question on this Labor Day is whether the revival has staying power. Or will memories of the Great Recession come back to haunt us?
Robert Samuelson is a columnist for The Washington Post. End
The Washington Post is showing gross ignorance, if not willful dishonesty of what it means to be middle class. The key missing ingredients are job and inflation security, neither of which the data supports.
middle class lifestyle and middle class income are two very different things .middle class lifestyle has no actual definition.
the ny times did a very nice article on what it means to be middle class by some definitions .
.as the ny times said in their study :
There is no single, formal definition of class status in this country.
Statisticians and demographers all use slightly different methods to divvy up the great American whole
into quintiles and median ranges. Complicating things, most people like to think of themselves as middle
class. It feels good, after all, and more egalitarian than proclaiming yourself to be rich or poor. A $70,000
annual income is middle class for a family of four, according to the median response in a recent Pew
Research Center survey, and yet people at a wide range of income levels, including those making less than $30,000 and more than $100,000 a year, said they, too, belonged to the middle.
By one measure, in cities like Houston or Phoenix — places considered by statisticians to be more typical of average United States incomes than New York — a solidly middle-class life can be had for wages that fall between $33,000 and $100,000 a year.
By the same formula — measuring by who sits in the middle of the income spectrum — Manhattan’s middle class exists somewhere between $45,000 and $134,000.
But if you are defining middle class by lifestyle, to accommodate the cost of living in Manhattan, that salary would have to fall between $80,000 and $235,000. This means someone making $70,000 a year in other parts of the country would need to make $166,000 in Manhattan to enjoy the same purchasing power.
Using the rule of thumb that buyers should expect to spend two and a half times their annual salary on a home purchase, the properties in Manhattan that could be said to be middle class would run between $200,000 and $588,000.
On the low end, the pickings are slim. The least expensive properties are mostly uptown, in neighborhoods like Yorkville, Washington Heights and Inwood. The most pleasing options in this range, however, are one-bedroom apartments not designed for children or families.
It is not surprising, then, that a family of four with an annual income of $68,700 or less qualifies to apply for the New York City Housing Authority’s public housing.
I had four of them over the years. Lost one so had to be replaced, but yes, am in agreement. Was painful to switch over to Android but had to be done as Blackberry was just behind with the times. Have been using HTC for years now and always the flagship phones, as those are built well and always from Taiwan. Have heard that there's a noticeable difference in quality from those that are *Made in China*.
Yeah, I did Android for a few years after Blackberry for personal, but then I got an iPhone for work and I did not want to have 2 phones with different operating systems, so then I got an iPhone for personal as well
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"The man who sleeps on the floor, can never fall out of bed." -Martin Lawrence
Do you have data to support that. I'm not sure if that is it. I also don't believe people will pay 3-4x more money for said good, especially if they are not making 3-4x more money. In the past, I don't recall c-level jobs paying more than 300% more than the average employee which is the case today. Those salaries, if distributed to those who actually do the work, would give consumers a LOT more buying power. They might actually be willing to pay 2x and maybe 3x, if they had it. (But unlikely 4x) The problem is, productivity went up, but salaries did not... except on the c-level.
Listen, have been studying this issue for *years*, even when I lived in Europe and saw first hand how the Chinese dump their goods into Western countries (the EU talked endlessly about penalizing the Chinese for such actions), and know what I'm talking about. Have read numerous articles on it, and watch a plethora of financial shows daily about the markets.
Even today was looking for *Made in USA* products online at the more *high-end* places like Williams-Sonoma and Crate and Barrel and so on to do a little experiment. For some items, like dish drainers, could not find a *Made in USA* product. Currently have a *Made in France* dish drainer that I started using last weekend from Williams & Sonoma that I purchased years ago. In some cases, it's improving and it's others it is worsening in terms of what American products can be bought, and in most cases they are considered *luxury items*. Will be purchasing a few items this month. Saw a John Boos *Made in USA* cutting board that I want. Will cost easily over $60.00. Meanwhile the Chinese ones can be had for mere pennies. Seriously problem on our hands.
it is not up to me to re-write the countries tax laws or solve the worlds issues . i am not smart enough to do that .
but i am smart enough to learn to play the hand they dealt me the best i can , rather than complain to no avail about the dealer ...
i am 65 and as for as long as i worked , no political party or political leader ever changed my daily life , with one exception back in the 1970's when i got drafted .
everyday , for more than 45 years i got dressed , got in the car and went to work . in the end it was me that made everything happen , good or bad in my life , not some political party .
Change doesn't happen by accepting status quote, kicking ones heels up and saying va bene. Change starts with dialog and continues with action. Things can change and do change. This nation has a history of that.
Listen, have been studying this issue for *years*, even when I lived in Europe and saw first hand how the Chinese dump their goods into Western countries (the EU talked endlessly about penalizing the Chinese for such actions), and know what I'm talking about. Have read numerous articles on it, and watch a plethora of financial shows daily about the markets.
Even today was looking for *Made in USA* products online at the more *high-end* places like Williams-Sonoma and Crate and Barrel and so on to do a little experiment. For some items, like dish drainers, could not find a *Made in USA* product. Currently have a *Made in France* dish drainer that I started using last weekend from Williams & Sonoma that I purchased years ago. In some cases, it's improving and it's others it is worsening in terms of what American products can be bought, and in most cases they are considered *luxury items*. Will be purchasing a few items this month. Saw a John Boos *Made in USA* cutting board that I want. Will cost easily over $60.00. Meanwhile the Chinese ones can be had for mere pennies. Seriously problem on our hands.
It's not sensible in any reality to spend $60 on a cutting board. There's buying quality and there is over paying. Also, you may have studied the issue but drew your own conclusions. Everyone has an agenda with a bias and they're conclusions are often based on it.
It's not sensible in any reality to spend $60 on a cutting board. There's buying quality and there is over paying. Also, you may have studied the issue but drew your own conclusions. Everyone has an agenda with a bias and they're conclusions are often based on it.
Sure it is. If the cutting board lasts, then got my money's worth. Have dishware from Jars that is over 10 years old in *pristine* condition, things you can pass down to your kids or whatever.
Change doesn't happen by accepting status quote, kicking ones heels up and saying va bene. Change starts with dialog and continues with action. Things can change and do change. This nation has a history of that.
how many things in your personal life changed via some political party to the point you do not do what you did daily ? like i said ,except for the draft , nothing ever changed . i do what i do day in and day out and ultimately i made everything happen in my life . all i do is learn to play the cards because despite what you think you HAVE NO CONTROL OVER THE DEALER .
further more ,no one ever found a way to repeal the business cycle and recessions and inflation have always been part of it regardless of who is in power as well the recovery so you can't even say it is this party or that party .
Last edited by mathjak107; 09-06-2017 at 03:51 AM..
Sure it is. If the cutting board lasts, then got my money's worth. Have dishware from Jars that is over 10 years old in *pristine* condition, things you can pass down to your kids or whatever.
You might want to think about the bacteria part of that....... hmmm.... unless you don't cook much.
10 years isn't particularly long. I have dishes in my cupboard that are older than that. Not many left, but that is because my daughter drops them on the stone floor on a regular basis.
The tenure of much of your threads equates value with cost. My ex is like that and have found that he often spends more money on things that afford him less longevity than things I purchase for less. I would like to challenge the notion. Top price doesn't necessarily mean top quality.
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