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How was Amazon going to put money into the pocket of NYC/NYS? The city and state were providing more than $3 billion in tax subsidies.
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Originally Posted by Rastafellow
The taxpayers won this time. Handing out obscene corporate welfare to the richest man was ludicrous. Pricing people out of their neighborhood would have been wrongheaded.
It's really not complicated, the $3B in subsides were due if Amazon hit all its projections.
Three billion is a fart in a hurricane to Amazon. They are one of the largest companies in the world. They would contribute more in associated business...restaurants, hotels, air travel, suppliers, buildings and reputation which brought other businesses... than any small amount the municipalities would have paid out.
Really dumb move by the politicians. Good on Amazon for telling them to take a hike. NYC is a VERY difficult place in which to do business. They can go elsewhere, save a LOT of money, and be a LOT Happier. The people were right: we want Amazon. The politicians blew it on this one. Now they are blaming it on a "Union" issue. Dumb.\
Ok, specifically for mathematically challenged:
25k jobs averaging $150k each is $3.75 billion in income per year
Suppose the city and state taxes 10% of that just for simplicity sake that is $375 million in taxes per year that NYS/NYC gets.
$3 billion/$375mil per year = 8 years for NYS/NYC to totally recoup the incentives just from income taxes alone.
I am not even factoring in property taxes for the HQ, sales taxes, and all the other bells and whistles that these workers are going to spend on. The real figure was that after incentive, NYS/NYC would generate $27 billion in tax revenue from this, over the period that these tax incentives would be in duration.
Let's be serious here. New York State collected $2,326,215,900 in Art. 9A and 13 corporation taxes in FY2018.
Do you seriously think that Amazon is going to make up 11.2% of the state's entire tax revenue?
I doubt the reality would have played out anything like your back of the napkin calculations.
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The costs are high, both in absolute terms and on a per-job basis, contrary to Amazon’s artful spin. In a classic example of cost-benefit apples and oranges, citing only one New York State incentive, Amazon said the sum “equates to $48,000 per job for 25,000 jobs with an average wage of over $150,000…” Of course, wages cannot be compared to tax breaks since employees pay only a small percentage of their salaries as taxes to offset the tax breaks. And the cost per job in New York is actually at least $112,000–and that is not a full accounting.
Oddly, Amazon’s own press release includes information about its economic development incentives. Such information normally comes only from governors or mayors. It suggests Amazon is trying hard to control the narrative about the cost-benefit numerator, i.e., to minimize the perceived subsidy costs while maximizing the benefits.
There are already improvements to infrastructure. The signal upgrade to the 7 train was just completed which will add 2 trains per hour capacity. But you conveniently ignore my point that most of the workers will live within walking distance or come from Manhattan where reverse commute trains are empty and can EASILY ABSORB the extra people
We can't just shut down NYC to new business because some trains are packed, are you crazy?
No, just logical unlike some people. How about we INVEST in infrastructure AND let Amazon come here? Isn't that a novel idea...
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Originally Posted by Gantz
The majority of them are. Just as an example I am familiar with, please ride the F, B, Q, R, N, A, C trains in the morning Brooklyn-bound in Brooklyn and then look at the opposite side at Manhattan bound trains.
This is pretty common knowledge. Where do you live that you don't know this?
I live on planet earth. Perhaps they are empty when you use the subway, but not when I do.
Three billion is a fart in a hurricane to Amazon. They are one of the largest companies in the world. They would contribute more in associated business...restaurants, hotels, air travel, suppliers, buildings and reputation which brought other businesses... than any small amount the municipalities would have paid out.
Really dumb move by the politicians. Good on Amazon for telling them to take a hike. NYC is a VERY difficult place in which to do business. They can go elsewhere, save a LOT of money, and be a LOT Happier. The people were right: we want Amazon. The politicians blew it on this one. Now they are blaming it on a "Union" issue. Dumb.\
Right! That's why many companies are choosing to take a hike out west and south and leave NY, on to lower cost, booming cities like Atlanta, Nashville, Charlotte, Denver, Dallas, etc...
Companies realize they ain't "gotta be" in New York anymore to do legit business. Costs are sky high and tons of hurdles to clear to open up shop.
If New York keeps this up though, they'll see businesses bail and offices will end up like the shuttered retail storefronts on 5th Ave, the West Village and Soho.
Do you seriously think that Amazon is going to make up 11.2% of the state's entire tax revenue?
I doubt the reality would have played out anything like your back of the napkin calculations.
My calculations didn't even include any corp taxes, just income taxes that these Amazon employees would've paid to the state and city.
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