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Old 01-09-2020, 10:50 AM
 
Location: New York
3,570 posts, read 3,234,490 times
Reputation: 1319

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Quote:
Originally Posted by BOORGONG View Post
Where did you get your degrees from?
Chump U?

Another one of your presidents failed businesses, and "drumroll"; he has his finger on the button.

That's what you get for voting in corporate welfare kings.
She confuses a medical degree with superior education to everyone. The fact that she has cash to travel also proves to her, that her knowledge is superior to everyone else. She obviously never studied any of the rules of Fallacies. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fallacies
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Old 01-09-2020, 11:12 AM
 
4,225 posts, read 1,542,551 times
Reputation: 5337
Quote:
Originally Posted by roseba View Post
She confuses a medical degree with superior education to everyone. The fact that she has cash to travel also proves to her, that her knowledge is superior to everyone else. She obviously never studied any of the rules of Fallacies. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fallacies

First, let's keep an eye on the fact that this thread is about cost of procreation, specifically in NYC.


Second, I do not confuse a medical degree with superior education to everyone. I very readily say that I am not an expert for certain things, and lack any knowledge about certain things. Incidentally, I went to a high school (in a land far away :-), which developed from a former seminary (the school was older than the United States or Canada), so classic education was emphasized, and I actually had one semester of a school subject called Logic, which included memorizing that list (so I don't need to go to Wikipedia to look it up :-). I rarely slip into any of the fallacies listed, while ad hominem is essentially your only mode of having a "discussion" (ad hominem, and cutting/pasting stuff).



One thing about medical education, though, is that it includes endless multiple-choice testing, which presents you constantly with very very very close choices of decisions which may have major impact on other people (and on yourself). Real practice constantly presents you with that as well, with the impact of your decisions being tremendously real rather than theoretical. In that way, medical education does select for people who can make the right judgments and decisions, often even with incomplete information. After 38 years of living in that universe, one can easily spot people who can make the best judgments vs people who can only regurgitate received opinions.


Okay, I have had quite enough of this detour into military spending and personal insults. This thread, and the OP's question, was about feasibility of a family with one low-medium earner supporting self, spouse and 3 kids in NYC. I vote NO. I vote for 1 kid and a working spouse in NYC, or 2 kids and living/working in Pittsburgh. Three or 4 kids should be reserved for people with substantial family assets, more than 4 for nobody.

Last edited by elnrgby; 01-09-2020 at 11:21 AM..
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Old 01-09-2020, 11:33 AM
 
Location: Gilbert, AZ
876 posts, read 428,324 times
Reputation: 1545
Quote:
Originally Posted by elnrgby View Post
Yeah, I am arguing that you can't be a quality parent OF THREE KIDS on $75k, which funds also have to support two adults - not in most US cities, not remotely in NYC. I don't have to have kids (and will not ever have them - at the age of almost 60 I can say that with certainty :-) to be aware of what kids need, since I had been a kid for the whole first 18 years of my life.
Quality parenting has way more to do with love than money. But it's always nice to get advice on parenting from a Boomer with zero kids.
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Old 01-09-2020, 11:58 AM
 
4,225 posts, read 1,542,551 times
Reputation: 5337
Quote:
Originally Posted by roseba View Post
My assertion is amateur but yours is not? Are you serious? LOL. Yours lacks any sophistication at all while you parrot tired tripe. Do you even pay attention? You're political saavy is very, very unsophisticated and truly biased by your upbringing and preconceived biases including your PREJUDICE against poor and lower working people that you only see malcontents when the vast majority are not. Let's leave it at that.



It would be highly unusual if I were prejudiced against the poor, considering how poor I grew up. I have seen a lot of people (not talking here of myself) being very poor, but very sane and resourceful, and lifting themselves from poverty in ways which I admire to no end. But they weren't welfare queens with 5 kids.


It is peculiar that you ascribe to ME something that is exactly YOUR own behavior!? Just read what you wrote: your opinion of me is entirely based on your prejudice against what you think my upbringing was (btw, it wasn't what you think :-). While I never even indirectly cite other people's ideas that I haven't digested in my own mind, you are the one who constantly cuts and pastes something she considers "sophisticated" - so which obe of us is "parroting"? :-). Building a life and fitting in a society for the duration of that life (and, for people with kids, leaving a positive impact on the life of your offspring) is not dressing up for an evening on the town - the point is not to be "sophisticated", but to be realistic and constructive.

Last edited by elnrgby; 01-09-2020 at 12:15 PM..
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Old 01-09-2020, 12:13 PM
 
4,225 posts, read 1,542,551 times
Reputation: 5337
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sno0909 View Post
Quality parenting has way more to do with love than money. But it's always nice to get advice on parenting from a Boomer with zero kids.

Right, child-free boomers were never kids themselves, and had no parents, so they cannot have any idea about the role of love and money in the process of raising kids :-).
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Old 01-09-2020, 12:20 PM
 
Location: Montreal
849 posts, read 318,486 times
Reputation: 826
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sno0909 View Post
Quality parenting has way more to do with love than money. But it's always nice to get advice on parenting from a Boomer with zero kids.

Yes, but that disqualifies you and roseba and myself, because said boomer feels insulted by lowest common denominators like us. Lol

And she has decided on how many children people should have, typing frantically from her studio in the Bronx.

The next step is to feel maligned by us because of her superior status, like poor Dr Herta Oberheuser at the Nuremberg doctors trial.

What could a smart MD or any PhD wearing her degrees on her sleeve ever do wrong?

All doctors ever do is for the good of humanity. But, they can peg losers like you and I, in order to tell us we are not up to the task, and when that is not enough, they dispose of them, in spite of that superior classical "European" education which they wear on their "virtual" sleeve, and on the other; a swastika.

You also notice how some good "virtual" doctors have such scientifically dedicated minds that they can peg all people on welfare as "Welfare Queens with 5 worthless offspring, systematically.

There.
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Old 01-09-2020, 12:40 PM
 
4,225 posts, read 1,542,551 times
Reputation: 5337
Quote:
Originally Posted by BOORGONG View Post
Yes, but that disqualifies you and roseba and myself, because said boomer feels insulted by lowest common denominators like us. Lol

And she has decided on how many children people should have, typing frantically from her studio in the Bronx.

The next step is to feel maligned by us because of her superior status, like poor Dr Herta Oberheuser at the Nuremberg doctors trial.

What could a smart MD or any PhD wearing her degrees on her sleeve ever do wrong?

All doctors ever do is for the good of humanity. But, they can peg losers like you and I, in order to tell us we are not up to the task, and when that is not enough, they dispose of them, in spite of that superior classical "European" education which they wear on their "virtual" sleeve, and on the other; a swastika.

You also notice how some good "virtual" doctors have such scientifically dedicated minds that they can peg all people on welfare as "Welfare Queens with 5 worthless offspring, systematically.

There.

My name is not Herta Oberhauser, and I am semi-retired so I can type from wherever I want when I'm not working (which at the moment happens to be from sunny but cold Boston, not the Bronx). I earned my retirement, and can spend it however I want, including on debating with clueless people on a pointless forum :-). I also do not wear a swastika - that, again, is exclusively your own exaggeration and name-calling (and a bit tasteless, considering my aunt who died in a Nazi concentration camp, and my mom's entire family that escaped the same by running and hiding for 4.5 years). I have worked with Medicaid population, I have seen all the stupid, careless, loud, inane, and most of all royally ENTITLED welfare queens I ever needed to see in order to become thoroughly familiar with the issue. Didn't you read that I was poor myself (classical education was not a result of privilege, but of scholastic effort), and that I admired a lot of poor people who ultimately made a decent life for themselves (and no, I don't mean in terms of money, but in terms of content of their lives - but the first prerequisite for an adult life to have a content is to be able to support yourself according to an adult social contract), so no, I absolutely do not see all poor people as welfare queens. But I do not have any respect for able-bodied people on extended-term welfare, particularly if they intentionally bring kids into that situation. There is nothing Nazi about that. You could equally bizarrely say that Canada is a Nazi country because it never allowed a welfare class to blossom and multiply to an absurd size.
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Old 01-09-2020, 12:48 PM
 
Location: Gilbert, AZ
876 posts, read 428,324 times
Reputation: 1545
Quote:
Originally Posted by elnrgby View Post
Right, child-free boomers were never kids themselves, and had no parents, so they cannot have any idea about the role of love and money in the process of raising kids :-).
Being a clueless kid and being a parent are two completely different things. Please just stop. You have no clue what you are talking about. I assure you of that.
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Old 01-09-2020, 12:53 PM
 
Location: New York
3,570 posts, read 3,234,490 times
Reputation: 1319
Quote:
Originally Posted by elnrgby View Post
First, let's keep an eye on the fact that this thread is about cost of procreation, specifically in NYC.
No it isn't. It is the cost of living in NYC with a family. That is not the same thing.


Quote:
Second, I do not confuse a medical degree with superior education to everyone. I very readily say that I am not an expert for certain things, and lack any knowledge about certain things. Incidentally, I went to a high school (in a land far away :-), which developed from a former seminary (the school was older than the United States or Canada), so classic education was emphasized, and I actually had one semester of a school subject called Logic, which included memorizing that list (so I don't need to go to Wikipedia to look it up :-). I rarely slip into any of the fallacies listed, while ad hominem is essentially your only mode of having a "discussion" (ad hominem, and cutting/pasting stuff).
WITH YOU, because you don't read and good and logical arguments get ignored.


Quote:
One thing about medical education, though, is that it includes endless multiple-choice testing, which presents you constantly with very very very close choices of decisions which may have major impact on other people (and on yourself). Real practice constantly presents you with that as well, with the impact of your decisions being tremendously real rather than theoretical. In that way, medical education does select for people who can make the right judgments and decisions, often even with incomplete information. After 38 years of living in that universe, one can easily spot people who can make the best judgments vs people who can only regurgitate received opinions.
As if the only way someone can make choices beyond binary ones are medical. There is a certain arrogance to that assumptions. Your political views are extremely binary. There is no grey. And that is a blind spot.


Quote:
Okay, I have had quite enough of this detour into military spending and personal insults.
You're constantly insulting others. Tone matters. You don't even see it.
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Old 01-09-2020, 12:59 PM
 
Location: New York
3,570 posts, read 3,234,490 times
Reputation: 1319
Quote:
Originally Posted by elnrgby View Post
It would be highly unusual if I were prejudiced against the poor, considering how poor I grew up. I have seen a lot of people (not talking here of myself) being very poor, but very sane and resourceful, and lifting themselves from poverty in ways which I admire to no end. But they weren't welfare queens with 5 kids.
The fact that you used something that has been debunked, proves your lack of knowledge in this subject. The fact that you bring it into almost every discussion also proves your lack of knowledge in this subject. Welfare Queen was always a specific thing.... a person who was a serial grifter used as an example by Ronald Reagan to suggest this was widespread when it wasn't. You will be called out until you finally, if ever, decide to actually do your homework on your really really, really misinformed beliefs. You assume A LOT about people based on very superficial information; how they look, their class etc. Many do, but many don't profess to be highly educated and worldly while still spitting out frankly, lower-educated beliefs about others. You can excuse those who haven't had the education. it's inexcusable coming from the mouths who do.


Quote:
It is peculiar that you ascribe to ME something that is exactly YOUR own behavior!? Just read what you wrote: your opinion of me is entirely based on your prejudice against what you think my upbringing was (btw, it wasn't what you think :-).
You have left enough material on this forum that it isn't an assumption. You grew up in the eastern block and it has colored your views. It isn't a prejudice when you have proved it in 1000's of posts.
Quote:
While I never even indirectly cite other people's ideas that I haven't digested in my own mind, you are the one who constantly cuts and pastes something she considers "sophisticated" - so which obe of us is "parroting"? :-).
Nope. My own words. Hence the number of typos since I don't spend any time proofreading. I use quotes when they aren't.

Quote:
Building a life and fitting in a society for the duration of that life (and, for people with kids, leaving a positive impact on the life of your offspring) is not dressing up for an evening on the town - the point is not to be "sophisticated", but to be realistic and constructive.
HA. you're realistic and constructive while hiding like a mouse in Parkchester worried about gangs hurting a little ole white lady? Seriously. That's really out of touch.
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