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Old 01-30-2009, 09:34 AM
 
3,225 posts, read 8,272,498 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justfarr1030 View Post
(Long Post)
Lol, I'm glad you said that (the bold parts). Well, of course there will ALWAYS be some black market quite honestly. As I said in my other post there are other problems with legalizing drugs but I didn't really want to get into in this thread. But I will tell you how I feel:

First, let's talk about Here is a FACT: Studies have found that marijuana usage in the USA is higher than AT LEAST 16 other countries. It's related to affluence rather than the laws imposed. Strictly speaking, those countries with less stringent laws (like the Netherlands for example) have less users. Since our country has the highest percentage of users anyway, legalizing the substance is not going to cause more people to become addicted. Analysts for legalizing marijuana say that the benefits of doing so could be of tremendous help to the economy and the citizens. Their data and research comes from looking at statistics from other countries, but the ideas are much the same. Some of the numbers have been adjusted from the analysts initial findings to include inflation and things of that nature. It has been stated that:

1.) Legalizing marijuana would inject roughly $10 Billion in tax revenue into the economy. That money could be used in other areas like improving education or working on a new energy policy to rid us of our dependence on foreign oil.
2.) By legalizing the substance, the government could save a substantial amount on the war on drugs. So far this year, the government has spent $34,433,700,162 on the war on drugs, so legalizing at least marijuana would cut back a good portion of that, which is more money that can be funneled elsewhere, including towards the deficit.
3.) Some analysts believe that legalizing marijuana will cut back on police corruption, drug-related crimes, and will open up new jobs as marijuana farms will crop up throughout the U.S.
4.) If the substance is legalized, the government will have more control over the content of the product and the regulations. For example, the product could be required to go through rigorous testing before being delivered to consumers hands to ensure safety. In addition, strict regulations could be imposed such as they are for alcohol and cigarettes (ie: users must be at least 18 (or 21)), they could set a standard legal limit like they do with alcohol, impose higher taxes on the purchase of the substance, and limit the advertising that marijuana companies would be able to put out there.

*sighs*...Now, legalizing Crack/Cocaine (And The HARD drugs)

I have a hard time suspending my moral judgments with this argument because the fact is, the hard drugs have been proven to be very harmful to people. And that alone is enough for me to say I don’t think its a good idea to legalize them. It’s also the reason I think the government wouldn’t even entertain the notion of legalizing them.
Beyond the harmful affects, drugs like cocaine and ecstasy are really seductive at first. The high they promise lure people in, especially kids. So the concern is that by legalizing these drugs, more kids would become addicted and more would lose their lives. Given the harmful affects these kinds of substances have, it’s hard to argue against that.
However, the benefits of legalizing them would be to inject (I swear, no pun intended) roughly $40 billion in tax revenue to the economy, a total savings on the war on drugs, a decrease in drug-related crimes and murders, and still another increase in jobs. Really, the benefits for legalizing all street drugs is much the same as legalizing weed, it’s just on a larger scale. What has to be decided is whether the benefits far outweigh the consequences.

Personally, I don’t see a problem with legalizing weed based on the evidence. To me, it seems very much like alcohol and cigarettes. I don’t smoke and I drink on rare occasions, so for me, if marijuana were legalized it really wouldn’t matter. I have no desire to try it. But, since there is no evidence to suggest it is harmful beyond what both alcohol and cigarettes do, then I see no reason we should waste money on trying to keep it off the streets when that CLEARLY isn't working and they’ve made an exception to legalize it for medicinal purposes. Just legalize it and use the gained income to get us out of debt and work towards other important projects like education and an energy policy. I also think it’s silly that companies fire perfectly good employees who went to a party and smoked a little weed for fun. Since it's currently illegal, I understand the reason behind having to do so; however, it’s a waste when good employees have to be fired.

Now, the argument on legalizing all street drugs is absolutely ridiculous in MY opinion. I don't know why people think that would be a brilliant idea and a wonderful solution to our problems, but it would not. While legalizing them would put an end to the black market and give us more money in tax revenue and savings on the war on drugs, the problem is that it alters chemicals in your brain thus enabling and encouraging users to act violently and irrationally. We would then be in hostile relationships with those countries smuggling drugs in. It's a big business for them and IF by some twisted, unforeseeable reason the government would do this they would certainly insist on it being U.S. made so they could control the purity of the substance. There are so many things wrong with this on so many levels, I can’t even adequately put them into words. But then, I'm making a moral judgment. Someone else may be able to look at this objectively and see it differently.
Wow justfarr, please excuse me, as I'm light years behind keeping up with yur posts. As soon as I finish the previous ones and this one I'll try to respond. I know you look forward to my reponse. Hahaha. LOL. Oh pardon me, I'm just feeling high so high listening to Rita Marley singing a song called "One Draw." I only like the beat of the song not the lyrics. If the lyrics and lovely beat are getting me intoxicated, I can well imagine what the reefers do. I see so many spaced out , listless people around not contribiting a lot to society who take the lyrics too seriously. Oh, let me read your whole thread and get back to you later. Thanks.
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Old 01-30-2009, 09:40 AM
 
Location: Bergen County, NJ
9,855 posts, read 24,380,773 times
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The moral dilemma that occurs with hard drugs is a hard obstacle to overcome and its the main reason across the board legalization won't occur. But there are those that make the argument, and it's a valid one, that it's not the government's role to be a moral arbiter on an individual basis. It's a very libertarian way of looking at things. It is basically the concept that if an individual wants to ruin his life, he should have the right, as long as he doesn't interfere with the life of others. Now I don't agree with this because I think if enough people eventually harm themselves, they in turn start affecting society negatively as a whole, and you just can't have government supporting that type of thing in any way.
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Old 01-30-2009, 10:06 AM
 
Location: NJ/NY
10,649 posts, read 18,078,077 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stac2007 View Post
Well we can purchase firearms, learn to shoot like pros and take courses on the use of deadly force. I know I'm going to catch a lot of flack for my views but when I was in central Florida I went to a gun range with a family member to do some target shooting. I was met by a large group of soccer moms who shot and cleaned their pistols as well as score their targets. I was seeing another part of America which I thought never existed. Can it work here in New York? Why not?
Except Florida has a higher crime rate, so it's not working there...

Last edited by newtoli; 01-30-2009 at 10:19 AM..
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Old 01-30-2009, 10:07 AM
 
Location: NJ/NY
10,649 posts, read 18,078,077 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A_Better_Bronx_2morrow View Post
Are you kidding me? Now I know you have a screw loose. You are way too liberal for my taste.
Republicans want less government in their lives, correct?

Legalizing drugs has worked in other countries...

The pioneering heroin program in Norway is already working to decrease crime and addicts on the street.
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Old 01-30-2009, 10:36 AM
 
294 posts, read 813,584 times
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To a certain extent yes, the lack of money is what drives people to do crimes and sell drugs as well as a lack of ecducation contributes as well. HOWEVER how do you explain these MILLIONAIRE football and basketball players who are no longer struggling doing stupid ghetto s*** that normal people like us look at and shake our heads in disbelief that someone with millions of dollars, a huge mansion, 10 luxury cars and a super model for a girlfriend would resort to ignorant stupid behavior that you see in the ghetto?

You would think that once they started making money that their outlook on life and their negative mentality would be behind them and go away but NO...these fools decide to carry guns, shoot people up, have pitbull fights on their property, get caught with crack cocaine, etc. These crimes are ALL ghetto related. All these crimes are what you see in the ghetto or in the "hood".

Perfect examples: Michael Vick, PacMan Jones, Plaxico Bures, Ricky Williams, Ron Artest, and the list goes on. All these people are LOADED with money!!! Explain their behavior other than they grew up in the hood because if that was the case, every single athlete that came from the "hood" would be doing simular things.

This is why I strongly believe in this saying: "You can take a person OUT the ghetto, but CAN'T take the ghetto out the person"

I believe it goes deeper than JUST money. Education and the lack of is a BIGGIE on my list. You have these people that have poor interviewing skills that can't hold down a conversation without saying something that clues in the interviewer that they're from the ghetto. I believe that its a combination of things that happens during the coarse of life that shapes a person to what they are now.
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Old 01-30-2009, 10:37 AM
DAS
 
2,532 posts, read 6,615,032 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miles View Post
Darned! It's a cold day outside and both Henna and I are trying to rush in out of the cold. Enough already with that long interrogation list! Go ahead and ask me if I live there, Henna, don't give me a whole laundry list of questions like justfarr is suggesting.

Too bad if anyone is carrying a chip. If they live in the building, they'll see you ask anyone you don't know the same simple question, "Hi, do you live here?" If answer is yes, you'll both commiserate on the unfortunate need in these days to ask these questions, you'll share a laugh , and enjoy the elevator ride.

If the asked party grumbles, none of the above will happen, but at least if they live there, you'll feel safe for finding out!
I know the discussion is on legalizing drugs now, but I wanted to go back to this important and easy to implement suggestion that Henna started.

I too live in a coop building with all owners, we all turned a real dump into a beautiful coop building. All the original owners still live there. We decided back then, never to let anyone in behind us unless we knew they lived there. We don't even let regular visitors that we know in, they have to be let in by the resident.

We are really polite NYer's, we don't ask if you live here. We stand at the door and say "you have to wait until you are buzzed in" and we go on in. We don't care what you look like, or how well you are dressed. The resident that you are visiting can soothe your feelings when you arrive at their apt.
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Old 01-30-2009, 10:47 AM
 
3,225 posts, read 8,272,498 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DAS View Post
I know the discussion is on legalizing drugs now, but I wanted to go back to this important and easy to implement suggestion that Henna started.

I too live in a coop building with all owners, we all turned a real dump into a beautiful coop building. All the original owners still live there. We decided back then, never to let anyone in behind us unless we knew they lived there. We don't even let regular visitors that we know in, they have to be let in by the resident.

We are really polite NYer's, we don't ask if you live here. We stand at the door and say "you have to wait until you are buzzed in" and we go on in. We don't care what you look like, or how well you are dressed. The resident that you are visiting can soothe your feelings when you arrive at their apt.
Great Technique/Yet Courteous!
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Old 01-30-2009, 10:50 AM
 
Location: NJ/NY
10,649 posts, read 18,078,077 times
Reputation: 2821
Quote:
Originally Posted by DAS View Post
I know the discussion is on legalizing drugs now, but I wanted to go back to this important and easy to implement suggestion that Henna started.

I too live in a coop building with all owners, we all turned a real dump into a beautiful coop building. All the original owners still live there. We decided back then, never to let anyone in behind us unless we knew they lived there. We don't even let regular visitors that we know in, they have to be let in by the resident.

We are really polite NYer's, we don't ask if you live here. We stand at the door and say "you have to wait until you are buzzed in" and we go on in. We don't care what you look like, or how well you are dressed. The resident that you are visiting can soothe your feelings when you arrive at their apt.
That's the way it should be! I was always amazed, when I used to visit my friend in Brooklyn, I almost NEVER had to buzz in because people would just let me walk in behind them. I grew up in a large apartment building and was taught from practically birth that you never let anyone in behind you!
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Old 01-30-2009, 11:00 AM
 
3,225 posts, read 8,272,498 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by newtoli View Post
That's the way it should be! I was always amazed, when I used to visit my friend in Brooklyn, I almost NEVER had to buzz in because people would just let me walk in behind them. I grew up in a large apartment building and was taught from practically birth that you never let anyone in behind you!
I may not agree with your take on legalization of drugs, but with this, I surely do. We both agree with DAS here, but then again, her posts on improving the crime situation and on other threads are easy to accept!
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Old 01-30-2009, 11:32 AM
DAS
 
2,532 posts, read 6,615,032 times
Reputation: 1113
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miles View Post
I may not agree with your take on legalization of drugs, but with this, I surely do. We both agree with DAS here, but then again, her posts on improving the crime situation and on other threads are easy to accept!
Thanks Miles but it was really Henna that gave the suggestion first. I was also responding to the criticism of her suggestion, that some may feel that they are being singled out because of appearance. Criminals come in all forms, that is why in my building we carry out the policy all the time we don't discriminate.
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