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Old 05-27-2010, 01:31 PM
 
28 posts, read 97,650 times
Reputation: 40

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See, I disagree. If you want to move here for just a year or two... Don't bother... It's that transient attitude that ruined the East Village. It sounds like you want a vacation. By all means, come on in and explore the city.

Now on the other hand, if you want to live here for a long time, put down some roots, rehabilitate a neighborhood that you'll have a long-term interest in, and maybe someday raise a family here... COME ON DOWN!!! (Or up?) At least then you're not just jacking up the rents across the board for everyone.
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Old 05-27-2010, 01:59 PM
 
Location: Katonah, NY
21,192 posts, read 25,104,895 times
Reputation: 22274
When I moved here at 22, I was terrified! I had no job, a few friends, and no apartment! I found an apartment the first day, found a job a few weeks later, and I've been here ever since! Before people jump down my throat about not having a job when I moved here - I'm a performer. It's pretty impossible to line up a job before you move here when you're a performer. I started work at a gym shortly after moving here and worked there on and off between show jobs for 5 years. Moving to New York can be pretty daunting - but you don't want to live the rest of your life thinking what your life could have been like if only you had moved here. If you don't like it - you can always move again! Nothing is permanant! You only have one life - make the most of it!
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Old 05-27-2010, 02:28 PM
 
28 posts, read 97,650 times
Reputation: 40
Maybe I missed something, but when did moving to New York become a rite of passage? I always heard of people moving to Los Angeles to "make it in Hollywood," but when did moving to NY become the next logical step after graduation?

I get the wanting to be "in the middle of things," but couldn't you find that closer to home (for example, Chicago, or wherever?) The kind of dramatic shifts we see now were not de rigueur just 25 years ago. Maybe the kids of today have more money, less responsibility, marry older and start families later? Watch too many movies/televisions that tell them "if they make it here, they can make it anywhere?" It's just kind of curious.

I remember being at Bonwit Teller (that's showing my age) as a kid and wanting to leave New York because everyone on the West Coast was living the life of surfing and girls. Of course, it was just a fantasy, and it stayed a fantasy. Today's culture seems to place more emphasis on saving some money, packing it up, and heading east... and if you don't, you're somehow "wrong" for not even trying. Trying what, may I ask? And I'm not being cute... I'm genuinely curious? If you don't have employment lined up, or come specifically to work a NY-specific job (i.e. Broadway)... What are you "trying?" I hope I'm not being antagonistic... I'm just genuinely curious.
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Old 05-27-2010, 04:47 PM
 
28 posts, read 97,650 times
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Becoming a "somebody" and living in a city other than NY are not mutually exclusive. You bring up a point that seems to be the common thinking with the youth of today, but NY doesn't hold the copyright on "making money." Plus, it's not really based in any fact. If you even just look at the Forbes 100:

1) Carlos Slim (Mexico)
2) Bill Gates (Washington state)
3) Warren Buffett (Nebraska)
4) Mukesh Ambani (India)
5) Lakshmi Mittal (England)
6) Larry Ellison (California)
7) Bernard Arnault (France)
8) Eike Batista (Brazil)
9) Amancio Ortega (Spain)
10) Karl Albrecht (Germany)

Not a single New Yorker... As a matter of fact, a NY resident doesn't show up on the list until #23, Bloomberg (and he made his fortune in Boston!)

I think sometimes people hear they can make $50k and in certain parts of the country, that's a lot of money. In reality, the cost is so much higher to live here that $50k isn't as impressive if you're trying to live comfortably in the city.

But we're getting off topic... That's the common groupthink of people WITH jobs lined up. The people without jobs lined up???? Those who feel they would be "wrong for not trying?"

I think you do a disservice to "family-friendly towns" by assuming that people who live there are just content with a life of mediocrity. I respectfully take the opposite view of that argument... The kids who come in with the mindset "I'm gonna be better than those losers at home" and have a sense of entitlement, those are the ones who I think will be in for a surprise. But regardless, thanks for your insight. I'm sure you're many years younger than me, so it's definitely a different perspective.
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Old 05-27-2010, 05:17 PM
 
Location: Katonah, NY
21,192 posts, read 25,104,895 times
Reputation: 22274
I think people just want to come to New York City because it is New York City! It's exciting, it's vibrant, it's thriving. It's something different than what they're used to. I came here because I had to - I'm a musical theatre performer. But I have friends that came here just because they always wanted to live here. And most of them have loved it and are still here - 12 years later. I don't know why anyone would have a hard time understanding why people would want to come to New York City. If we were talking about some small town somewhere that all of a sudden people were flocking to - that would be confusing. But what is so confusing about people wanting to come to one of the most incredible cities in the world? That's sort of like wondering why people would want to move to London, or Paris, or Los Angeles. I don't really understand why you are confused. I'm not trying to be mean - but come on, it's NEW YORK!
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Old 05-27-2010, 05:46 PM
 
28 posts, read 97,650 times
Reputation: 40
No, I think you missed my point. I'm not confused about why people would want to live here. I said up top, "I get the wanting to be in the middle of things."

My point was how it's now almost become a rite of passage... Almost like a cliche. Kids think it's "where they belong," but in reality: a) no family here ; b) no job lined up ; c) don't know the difference between peter cooper and peter luger.

Maybe I'm just a grumpy old man, but I've seen many neighborhoods deteriorate over the years due to young kids who refuse to respect the places they choose to inhabit. A lot of them seem to have the attitude that since they'll only be there a couple years while they "find themselves," it doesn't really matter what happens afterwards. I'm not accusing you of this, but I've seen drunken fights, urinating in stairwells, screaming at all hours... Stuff that people who respect the community and care about its future, would never think of doing. My point is... New York isn't a stepping stone. My problem is with people who treat it that way.
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Old 05-27-2010, 06:02 PM
TT1
 
Location: Gotham
148 posts, read 438,922 times
Reputation: 73
Default //www.city-data.com/forum/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=14367357

Quote:
Originally Posted by bransonUptown View Post
Becoming a "somebody" and living in a city other than NY are not mutually exclusive. You bring up a point that seems to be the common thinking with the youth of today, but NY doesn't hold the copyright on "making money." Plus, it's not really based in any fact. If you even just look at the Forbes 100:

1) Carlos Slim (Mexico)
2) Bill Gates (Washington state)
3) Warren Buffett (Nebraska)
4) Mukesh Ambani (India)
5) Lakshmi Mittal (England)
6) Larry Ellison (California)
7) Bernard Arnault (France)
8) Eike Batista (Brazil)
9) Amancio Ortega (Spain)
10) Karl Albrecht (Germany)
.
I don't think you know what you're talking about. Those European and South American countries produce very little wealth. What you posted is useless if put into context, yes the dude from Mexico is the richest man in the world but there are only 9 billionaires in the entire Mexico. NYC alone has more billionaires than the the entire UK + Germany (the only wealth producing countries in Europe) combined. France, Italy, Spain etc are all laughable with about 10-12 each.

According to Forbes, the billionaire capitals are:

1. NY (60 in Manhattan) (91 total including its suburbs)
2. Moscow (50) And ALL of Russia's billioniares live in this one city....pretty much same as the other Euro/Asia cities on this list. All live in their country's capital.
3. London (32)
4. Istanbul (28)
5. LA (27)
6. HK (25)
7. Mumbai (20)
8. Dallas (17)
9. SF (14) (40 including its suburbs)
10.Tokyo (14)

http://www.forbes.com/2010/03/09/top..._slide_12.html

But very little people will ever reach billionaire status (but it does say how powerful each regions economy is).

So then we get to millionaires, and according to the IRS (millionaire population count under "HNWI" column):



A complete blowout. Notice the "hot spots" for affordability are completely absent from the list. (besides Houston, which as the 4th largest city in the US yet is all the way at #10) which ironically coincides with everything the previous poster said.

And then we get to the highest earning counties in America...

Wealthiest by top 5% Household Income (according to the IRS):

1. New York, NY: $857,643
2. Fairfield, CT: $822,708
3. Westchester, NY: $793,134
4. Somerset, NJ: $625,869
5. Marin, CA: $624,762
6. Montgomery, MD: $567,190
7. Hunterdon, NJ: $554,015
8. Morris, NJ: $546,982
9. Nassau, NY: $538,307
10. San Francisco, CA: $523,744

Notice anything?

NY is very much dreamers city with a massive economy where many people come to to make it (or party, lol).

Last edited by TT1; 05-27-2010 at 06:32 PM..
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Old 05-27-2010, 06:20 PM
 
Location: Katonah, NY
21,192 posts, read 25,104,895 times
Reputation: 22274
No offense, but I've also seen grumpy old men urinating on the street. And this was in my old neighborhood on the upper east side. I don't necessarily think that all the things that you are griping about are caused by people coming here as a rite of passage. There are a lot of colleges in NYC - and where there are college students, there is going to be vomit, urine, drunkeness, etc.
I would never discourage anyone from coming to this city. I think it's the best city in the world and I'm not going to be so selfish to say that you have to pass some sort of test if you want to be allowed to live here. The poster didn't say that she wanted to come here and party and destroy NYC - she wants to come here to live her life to the fullest. Maybe she'll stay a year, maybe she'll stay forever - but that she be her decision based upon what makes her happy.
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Old 05-27-2010, 07:00 PM
 
28 posts, read 97,650 times
Reputation: 40
TT1 - Interesting approach, but those are just skewed statistics... apparently as were mine. Those NY billionaires (more than the UK and Germany combined) are not kids from the midwest moving to NY to "find themselves" and those 60 Manhattan millionaires have not "moved to NY from across the US and made their fortunes here." You're taking a small minority and then just applying it for the majority? My first example of Mayor Bloomberg is a perfect example... He would be included in your chart, but he didn't move to NY to "strike it rich." Of course this area will be the wealthiest by household income... It costs a lot more to live here than _______ (Insert small town) Not to mention, those numbers are 07-08, when the DOW was over 14,000!!! Could you imagine if your numbers were current?

Dewdrop- Your "old neighborhood?" No offense, but you were born in 1993. I have subway tokens older than you. I know the difference between NYU kids hanging out in Washington Square Park and a transient over-entitled midwesterner relieving himself in my stairwell because it's "funny." The original post OF COURSE didn't say, "What's the best neighborhood to move to wreck the place?" But anyone who encourages people to move here because "they're a loser, just settling for mediocrity if they don't" is doing everyone a disservice.
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Old 05-27-2010, 07:08 PM
 
Location: Katonah, NY
21,192 posts, read 25,104,895 times
Reputation: 22274
Um... I was is no way shape or form born in 1993. I think it's very funny that you just automatically assumed that. Talk about jumping to conclusions! For your information, I was born in the 70's. And by old neighborhood - I simply meant the neighborhood that I lived in for the past 7 years that I just left because my husband and I bought a house in the burbs. What else do you suggest I call it?

I'm impressed that you can tell the difference between college kids in the early 20's and others in the 20's - because I can't. They all look the same to me. And I had my share of people puking in the courtyard of our building or partying until all hours of the night. It drove my husband and I crazy. And yet I would still NEVER discourage anyone who dreams of moving to New York from moving here. I encourage all people to follow their dreams. It sounds like you just need to move.

To the poster - if you want to make the move - just do it! You won't regret it if you do - but you might if you don't!
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