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It's tough to compare Vermont and Upstate NY, which is much bigger and has an economy and population on par with NC, if I'm not mistaken. It's not as bad as people think it is, if people did some research. It could be better, but I think people need to put some things into proper perspective.
BTW-Take the Thruway to Oneida from Syracuse or Utica. I'm not sure about the home price thing either, as you can get a nice home for around 100k in the immediate Syracuse area and in a good SD too.
Location: Appalachian New York, Formerly Louisiana
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ckhthankgod
It's tough to compare Vermont and Upstate NY, which is much bigger and has an economy and population on par with NC, if I'm not mistaken. It's not as bad as people think it is, if people did some research. It could be better, but I think people need to put some things into proper perspective.
BTW-Take the Thruway to Oneida from Syracuse or Utica. I'm not sure about the home price thing either, as you can get a nice home for around 100k in the immediate Syracuse area and in a good SD too.
I find that map kind of odd. Aren't many of the counties marked as western actually part of central?
This is the other day, just up the street from me. I knew they was selling dope but not that they were making it. Not sure why they hit this place because at least a dozen spots seem much worse.
That is at least the 4th raid this Spring. They hit in the early AM when I go to work and I've seen most of them go down.
Thats my NY. My Daughter lives near that last place and I park in front of that house all the time. The place across the street was raided last week.
Thats my NY. Inbred rednecks smoking meth.
Then MOVE.
My husband's family settled in the area of Oneida & Madison counties prior to 1795 [some near Waterville, some Paris ]. They moved to this end of the state 30 years later. It was a better move even then just for the type of land [ and yes, his family stayed on the same farms here in the Southern Tier until the early 1900s and relatives have them now; the rest moved all the way north to Erie County]
And stuff like you discuss = ghetto violence. Buffalo has it all the time. That's why we live over 20 miles from the city.
Being new here, I would personally consider this area (the Finger Lakes) mostly western NY. It's kind of hard to delineate because of the shape of the state.
So...Sean...why don't you move outside of Syracuse? My own opinion is that an hour commute is acceptable...though with gas prices rising as they have...yeesh. Seems to me that there would be other places within an hour of where you work that are meth-lab free.
Bee...I spent a fair amount of time in VT before my husband and I started our family. I use to go up with my best friend and stay at her dad's house and then we'd ski. Those were some good times. It gets COLD there though. Like...really really cold.
Sure...there are certainly some impoverished folk out there (though I suspect they'd be much better off in a more affordable location). Every state has impoverished areas. Even Hawaii. But by and large, VTers are much more financially stable than your average upstate NYer.
Your experience was primarily within a ski area(s)? I live up there part time. The educational tax is hurting a number of homeowners. Full time residents who live in the ski towns pay more in taxes because the value of the 2nd homes skews the value of property in town. I am up and down man of the backroads -- there are people who can't afford to get rid of their garbage and allow it to build up. (There's one such house right on route 11 between Andover and Londonderry which is a disaster.) State environmental regulations prevent many businesses from opening there, inhibiting job growth. One can not make a decent living in a hospitality/tourism driven market. I know a number of local people who work 2, 3 jobs to keep afloat. They look good on paper as it keeps them treading above the poverty line, but what's on paper isn't telling the true story.
A problem in VT I would safely guess would be the same problem upstate -- the cheaper housing is further from where the jobs are. Moving further away to afford housing means that the individual most likely has no or little mass transit, will need a car, will pay insurance (certainly higher in NY than VT) fuel, maintenance. The trade off will still cost the working poor, or the person who is not poor by the state's definition, but who is certainly struggling to get by.
If they poor in VT would 'be much better off in an affordable location' why not suggest the same to the average upstate NYers, and where would they go?
Well the walls are closing in on Vermont working people same as NY. I can tranfer my job to Vermont so spent alot of time there planning a move.
What I saw in Vermont is the ground work for NY style oppression not far in the future. Considering the number of NYers fleeing to Vermont its not hard to guess whats causing it.
The problem we in the trenches face are the fixed costs. We can wiggle alot of things around to make ends meet but many we can't. The worst by far is taxes. Thats a big nut. My NY income tax alone is 3 grand. I can't get 3 extra grand in the budget anyway. Move to a tax free, or at least low, and that frees up thousands. Just for example on a 5 year note thats a 15k car. Now throw in the at least 2 grand a year savings on property taxes and your talking real money.
Another is more the real World then NY's fault but heat is a real bear. I can move South and sweat for free but those Winter bills here are a big slug.
NY, and slowly Vermont, are becoming states of the very rich and very poor. The reason many are poor though is because of taxes. They want you down signing up for Foodies and HEAP and everything else. That way you make the same amount but Albany controls how you spend it. "But, but we have programs to help the poor". Hey, hows about you just let me keep the money I EARNED in the first place!!!!!!
Well the walls are closing in on Vermont working people same as NY. I can tranfer my job to Vermont so spent alot of time there planning a move.
What I saw in Vermont is the ground work for NY style oppression not far in the future. Considering the number of NYers fleeing to Vermont its not hard to guess whats causing it.
The problem we in the trenches face are the fixed costs. We can wiggle alot of things around to make ends meet but many we can't. The worst by far is taxes. Thats a big nut. My NY income tax alone is 3 grand. I can't get 3 extra grand in the budget anyway. Move to a tax free, or at least low, and that frees up thousands. Just for example on a 5 year note thats a 15k car. Now throw in the at least 2 grand a year savings on property taxes and your talking real money.
Another is more the real World then NY's fault but heat is a real bear. I can move South and sweat for free but those Winter bills here are a big slug.
NY, and slowly Vermont, are becoming states of the very rich and very poor. The reason many are poor though is because of taxes. They want you down signing up for Foodies and HEAP and everything else. That way you make the same amount but Albany controls how you spend it. "But, but we have programs to help the poor". Hey, hows about you just let me keep the money I EARNED in the first place!!!!!!
I agree, especially with the section in bold. The problems we have here are being brought there -- it's only a matter of time before the school taxes there are on parr with the excessive taxes we pay -- in addition to every other 'surcharge' and 'fee'.
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