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Yes, I prefer staying cooped up in winter and enjoying time outside durring summer as opposed to being cooped up in the AC durring summer and having it be "warm" (if you really consider the 40's and 50's warm) durring winter. Unless you are talking about South Florida (wich is another area that people are actually fleeing now for the Carolinas), it's not like it's sunny and 70 degrees durring winter. Shoveling snow isn't something done nearly as much as it is in the north...... but when it does snow here, the effect is 10x worse.
I'm from SYRACUSE and now live in Orlando...I can't wait to head North on 95 to 81 North, back home to SYRACUSE. Florida is NOT what people think it is. I'm here now visiting family and I've made my mind up. I'll take the snow anyday...I'l rather put a piece of wood in my fireplace than put a piece of wood on my window anyday!
I have to agree with you. I love the cold. I sleep so much better when it's cold. In the winter, I open my windows and let all that yummy cold air in. Nice, cool, clear, winter air, is so much better than buggy muggy damp humid air.
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Originally Posted by cuse
I'm from SYRACUSE and now live in Orlando...I can't wait to head North on 95 to 81 North, back home to SYRACUSE. Florida is NOT what people think it is. I'm here now visiting family and I've made my mind up. I'll take the snow anyday...I'l rather put a piece of wood in my fireplace than put a piece of wood on my window anyday!
I will pick you up at the airport. Nothing better than the sounds, sights, and smells of a fireplace. Certainly not to be used when it's hot and humid.
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Originally Posted by Griffis
God you people are making me want to pack my bags right now! My daughters have hardly ever SEEN snow. I feel like they are being robbed.
I know snow can be a pain to deal with, but summers in this part of the country aren't fit for any living creature except maybe ticks and cockroaches.
I agree that in many ways moving north can be better, as Phish said Vermont is a beautiful place and it wins in my book as the nicest, cleanest and most friendly place, the autumns are amazing and the people are incredible. That said, there are now more and more cookie cutter malls and big box stores/condos in the cities and Vermont is looking more like New Hampshire and Maine. Upstate New York is similar in feel and getting popular with those getting out of Vermont (who moved from NYC). Seems that Upstate NY is a good bet for most, and it's easy to get to Vermont for a long weekend. After that why not Canada? Parts of Quebec and Ontario are pretty friendly and beautiful too. Okay I am going too far, but you see in Canada what living up North could be if there were better quality homes for half the price. The snow is not a problem because the homes are well insulated, solid, and the cities keep the streets plowed and clean. Northern cities do not have to be dirty, hard pressed, or freezing.
I've lived down South and southerners can be hard to take especially since the women tend to stick to their husbands, and not congregate and socialize the same way as up North. Everytime I go South, I start thinking about those beautiful brick homes in Quebec with great insulation, skylights, greenhouses, and heated floor tiles, or homes in Vermont or NY with woodburning stoves, floor to ceiling fireplaces, hot tubs. The cold is a great reason to have cider, chicken pot pie, roast duck, apple, blueberry pie, maple butter.
Nat
I was interested in what you had to say about Canada. I read an article in an old Kiplinger's financial magazine about Americans who have retired overseas. One of the areas mentioned was Nova Scotia. I did some research on it and was quite amazed what your $$ will buy up there still. Maybe not on the oceanfront so much anymore but reasonable sized houses with land seem to be available for approx $150K or less. And it seems lakefront areas are abundant as well. Another possibility is Prince Edward Island. And I understand that the people up there are as nice as can be. I am going up there in a couple of weeks for a look-see. My heart is still in NY. I would like nothing better than to find a small place with a couple of acres in the eastern part of upstate NY, preferably in the lower Adirondack region. However, I am looking forward to what is up in Canada as well. I do know that it is too d#$% hot here in O-town.
This is an interesting thread. Well, I am a Vermont native born and raised, whose spent 4 years in the NYC area (Oyster Bay, Westchester County, and Harriman), a couple back in Vermont as a homeowner, and now live in Granville, NY, which is what you could say is in the Glens Falls/Lake George area.
Here are my thoughts on moving North for those interested. First, Vermont is fast becoming for the very rich. Real Estate prices are high for anything with land, though taxes are low unless it’s your second home. And high, in my mind, is for someone who would also work in this area. You can probably buy a decent place with 10 acres for about $250 to $300k. Considering job salaries of 25-50k which is normal for this area, it’s become expensive to live in Vermont. Upstate NY on the other hand, has more reasonable real estate prices, but high taxes compared with Vermont, New Hampshire and Maine. Actually, as one stat put it, upstate New Yorkers pay the highest property taxes in the country, 18% higher than the second highest state Connecticut. That was a shock to us, but what it more shocking is how poor the most school systems are in upstate NY. I believe most larger cities Upstate probably have adequate schools but beware if you moving to a rural area, as most likely your school will be in the bottom 25% of NYS schools on the Regent exams. In contrast, Vermont and NH schools are far superior to NY's and they do that with substantially lower budgets.
If moving upstate, I would recommend at least a 5 acre property purchase, as NYS has generally poor zoning laws in the more rural towns. That means that if you move to your dream house on one acre, there’s nothing to stop someone from putting a double-wide on the land next door, or a pig pen, cow barn, mechanic shop etc. Vermont generally has much better, and some say restrictive zoning. Many towns now require a 10 acre or more purchase for new homes.
In my opinion Vermont has lost much of its charm in the last 10 years. Much of state is now dominated by second homes, farms that have been renovated to mansions, busy ski towns, and poor cities. And, there’s really not a lot of sense of community with so many part timers these days. The one thing I enjoy about many parts of rural upstate NY is that it doesn't enjoy the tourist popularity of VT or NH, so most communities are more tightly knit. I like the fact that when I drive home from traveling all week, I pass real dairy farms, beef cattle, and corn. People still work the land here, and that’s something you don't see in Vermont anymore.
The Adirondacks are nice, but its tough to buy sizeable land, and most larger towns are tourist traps. It is also quite restrictive for building purposes. I would recommend the outskirts of Plattsburgh to the Southeast, or Western Adirondacks where it’s very quiet.
A few people mentioned Canada and I chuckled, Quebec is quite spectacular, but unless your French is perfect, chances are the natives will know you are an American right away, and many French Canadians aren't big on us. Many rural areas of Quebec don't speak English, and we have definitely felt discriminated against from time to time while visiting Quebec. But overall, I like their arrogance, and Quebec offers a different rural perspective, farms and industry intertwined, with a large middle class and small upper class. I don't know much about Real estate there, but I know they don't like to give good Canadian jobs to Americans so you would have to retire there or be wealthy. I have vacationed in the Maritimes for many years so I know a little about Nova Scotia. My feeling is that if you don't come from a strong rural background, Nova Scotia, NB or PEI, are probably not for full time living, as while beautiful, its not an easy adjustment for those who have some sort of hectic lifestyle to go to one that can be very quiet with few choices for activities. If you buy a place near the ocean up there, many Canadians congregate to the larger cities in the winter to work, so it could be a long desolate winter with no neighbors, or services for many miles.
As for Florida, cut the state in two lengthwise, and stay away from eastern half. If you stay on the upper gulf, or central to south central Florida, you will still find many charming, rural places. Its just such a shame that Developers are allowed to go in and ruin good land with those fake palm tree housing developments along with fake lakes, grass and probably fake alligators too!
When I moved to AZ I thought I was getting away from the ratrace. Same ratrace here, except the rats out here have tatoos and pick-up trucks. An uneducated lowlife ratrace. You are better off in NY. At least people behave within certain guidelines even though they may be aggressive and snotty. I see things on a daily basis out here that I never saw in NY in 45 yrs, things that shock your sensibilities.
LOWLIFE!!!! My husband has a tattoo and a pick-up and a Masters degree!!!! So dont lump all of us into your little group there! Having a tattoo and a truck does not mean you are uneducated, just not a pretensious Scottsdale Snob.
Great post, mrsure. But I do think you're off-base about NY state's schools in the rural areas. Given the state's overall very high standards, even being in the bottom 25% of state rankings, as you claim many rural schools are, is pretty darn good. As I've noted elsewhere on this site, during my 20 years teaching college, I can spot a NY state student pretty quickly--and many of them are indeed from rural NY state. Just this semester I've got a brother and sister who are from Wellsville, a small town in Allegany County, one of the state's most rural and poorest counties. These two students think (and talk!) better and faster, and have better habits of mind, than most of my other students. They've very clearly had an exceptional education to prepare them for college. Of course, most of this comes from good genes and, above all, good parenting, an enriching family environment. But they'd be the first to credit their schooling in Wellsville, too. Again, a lot of this quality stems from state standards and pretty exceptional (esp. compared to the South!) state funding. This makes the state a nosy and demanding partner in the education process, but one with ultimately good effects, too. A lot of students coming from NY state schools are still being skipped ahead in Southern schools, as was routine among kids who moved out of state when I was younger. You also scant the Finger Lakes region--an area of many exceptionally healthy towns, villages, small cities, and school districts. A large portion of those painfully high real estate taxes, after all, go to pay for generally first-rate schools. Even accounting for gov't. waste and overly powerful teachers' unions, you do get what you pay for when it comes to education, like everything else. You should see the school systems in the counties just outside our college-town county in Virginia--they're cheating the kids exactly because Virginia is so mindlessly determined to underfund education generally, and here teahers can't unionize for good pay, so many of our teachers move elsewhere. You also might want to acknowledge NY state's exceptional state university and college system. Even with perpetual budget struggles, it's an amazing deal, offering terrific quality and variety. I got an Ivy League-quality education at a fraction of the price from SUNY-Buffalo. But in any case, here's to hoping you enjoy a vivid New England fall. Our dogwoods are just now turning a handsome purple here in southwest Virginia--and it's only making me long for pike fishing in bronzing waters beneath the overhanging flame-yellow maples back in New York state!
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Re: Moving up North
