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I have a question for you New Yorkers. I know that SUNY is an excellent university system, providing quality higher education to your state.
And I also realize that New York's route to higher education took a different route than what you see in virtually any other state with the consolidation that built the SUNY system coming only around the middle of the 20th century.
But even not knowing all that much about SUNY, I am aware that the system doesn't provide New York with what every other state seems to have:
one, or perhaps two, identifiable flagship university with state-wide recognition and representation
If there is a bit of comparison, it may be in California. But even as Cal evolved from a single university to a member of a UC system that does not recognize a flagship, it and UCLA have so much prestige, name recognition, and vaunted academics that it doesn't matter that neither represents the whole state any more than UCSD or UCSB do.
I do realize that four or so SUNY campuses have been identified as flagships but nobody is going to look at a school like Buffalo or Stony Brook and see them as a stand in for NYS.
There is no place in New York where you can find the like of Berkeley, Madison, Chapel Hill, Austin, Charlottesville, Ann Arbor, or, closer to home, State College.
No one school, or two (like Cal and UCLA or U-M and MSU), that combines that extra strong research component, strong name recognition, heavy draw from well beyond the state).
First of all, I'm wondering: am I right or wrong in this assessment. And second, if I am right, has the state ever considering identifying perhaps one school for a truly special status or, at this juncture, would even trying be a political nightmere.
Well, one problem is that with 64 campuses in the SUNY system, creating a flagship without extra funding would have to come from some form of consolidation. Yet, many of the larger towns and small cities home to SUNYs (ex. Brockport, Cortland, Fredonia, Plattsburgh) would be devastated if consolidation were to take place. I'm not going to lie, the idea of setting up a flagship SUNY is appealing, but it wouldn't happen without significant re-appropriation and bickering in the legislature.
Another item of note is that many of the big state schools (UW-Madison, UCLA, Michigan State, Penn State) are land-grant, funded by the Morrill Act of 1862. For New York, that money was used to establish a new school, the ivy-league Cornell University. Cornell maintains a private identity, but four of its seven undergraduate schools are state endowed, so Cornell is rather like a cousin to the SUNYs.
Well, one problem is that with 64 campuses in the SUNY system, creating a flagship without extra funding would have to come from some form of consolidation. Yet, many of the larger towns and small cities home to SUNYs (ex. Brockport, Cortland, Fredonia, Plattsburgh) would be devastated if consolidation were to take place. I'm not going to lie, the idea of setting up a flagship SUNY is appealing, but it wouldn't happen without significant re-appropriation and bickering in the legislature.
Another item of note is that many of the big state schools (UW-Madison, UCLA, Michigan State, Penn State) are land-grant, funded by the Morrill Act of 1862. For New York, that money was used to establish a new school, the ivy-league Cornell University. Cornell maintains a private identity, but four of its seven undergraduate schools are state endowed, so Cornell is rather like a cousin to the SUNYs.
i know about Cornell's rather unique status of having both private and public components, but I was under the impression that it wasn't established by the Morrill Act but that the state came to an agreement with the existing (although not very old) private university to take on the landgrant responsibilities for it.
There is one modern version of Cornell's split organization, although on a far more minor scale. Michigan State University was one of the few Big Ten schools without a law school. It arranged for a new partnership with the Detroit College of Law to change that status. The law school moved from Detroit to East Lansing, became a full part of the university, but retained its private, non-state funded status. It was renamed as the MSU Law School.
i know about Cornell's rather unique status of having both private and public components, but I was under the impression that it wasn't established by the Morrill Act but that the state came to an agreement with the existing (although not very old) private university to take on the landgrant responsibilities for it.
There is one modern version of Cornell's split organization, although on a far more minor scale. Michigan State University was one of the few Big Ten schools without a law school. It arranged for a new partnership with the Detroit College of Law to change that status. The law school moved from Detroit to East Lansing, became a full part of the university, but retained its private, non-state funded status. It was renamed as the MSU Law School.
I went to MSU for 3 years and I thought the law school was Cooley Law School or is that a separate entity that just happens to be in Lansing?
As for the flagship schools, I would say that the closest one is the University of Buffalo, which joined the SUNY system later. They also have upgraded their sports programs to D1A in everything. So, I guess they would be the closest thing. Binghamton University is probably the one with the best reputation and is growing as well. University at Albany and stony Brook have grown some as well and have some very good programs. Those are the 4 major SUNY schools that I believe are considered to be the "flagship" schools.
I went to MSU for 3 years and I thought the law school was Cooley Law School or is that a separate entity that just happens to be in Lansing?
As for the flagship schools, I would say that the closest one is the University of Buffalo, which joined the SUNY system later. They also have upgraded their sports programs to D1A in everything. So, I guess they would be the closest thing. Binghamton University is probably the one with the best reputation and is growing as well. University at Albany and stony Brook have grown some as well and have some very good programs. Those are the 4 major SUNY schools that I believe are considered to be the "flagship" schools.
I am in Texas and we have 2 flagships UT Austin and Texas A&M. Both of these are kind of like SUNY because they have a number of other campuses across the state of Texas
In NY, I think SUNY is set up fine with Universities spread out nicely and differnet schools having their "niche" like college of environmental forestry near Syracuse I believe or Fredonia being known for computer science
If I had to pick one as a flagship, maybe Binghamton?
I am in Texas and we have 2 flagships UT Austin and Texas A&M. Both of these are kind of like SUNY because they have a number of other campuses across the state of Texas
In NY, I think SUNY is set up fine with Universities spread out nicely and differnet schools having their "niche" like college of environmental forestry near Syracuse I believe or Fredonia being known for computer science
If I had to pick one as a flagship, maybe Binghamton?
Yeah, I like that too. For instance, if you want to major in mass communications, Oswego State is actually a very good choice. Same if you want to major in education or business. Cortland State is good for those that want to major in say sports related things like Physical Therapy or Phys. Ed. teacher. Geneseo is good for those majoring in things related to Math and Science and so on.
I have a question for you New Yorkers. I know that SUNY is an excellent university system, providing quality higher education to your state.
And I also realize that New York's route to higher education took a different route than what you see in virtually any other state with the consolidation that built the SUNY system coming only around the middle of the 20th century.
But even not knowing all that much about SUNY, I am aware that the system doesn't provide New York with what every other state seems to have:
one, or perhaps two, identifiable flagship university with state-wide recognition and representation
If there is a bit of comparison, it may be in California. But even as Cal evolved from a single university to a member of a UC system that does not recognize a flagship, it and UCLA have so much prestige, name recognition, and vaunted academics that it doesn't matter that neither represents the whole state any more than UCSD or UCSB do.
I do realize that four or so SUNY campuses have been identified as flagships but nobody is going to look at a school like Buffalo or Stony Brook and see them as a stand in for NYS.
There is no place in New York where you can find the like of Berkeley, Madison, Chapel Hill, Austin, Charlottesville, Ann Arbor, or, closer to home, State College.
No one school, or two (like Cal and UCLA or U-M and MSU), that combines that extra strong research component, strong name recognition, heavy draw from well beyond the state).
First of all, I'm wondering: am I right or wrong in this assessment. And second, if I am right, has the state ever considering identifying perhaps one school for a truly special status or, at this juncture, would even trying be a political nightmere.
It will never happen. Here is why:
All the bright kids (top 10% of class) in California that want to stay close to home will go to UCB, UCLA, or Stanford.
All the bright kids (top 10% of class) in Texas that want to stay close to home will go to UT-Austin or Rice.
All the bright kids (top 10% of class) in North Carolina that want to stay close to home will go to UNC or Duke.
All the bright kids (top 10% of class) in Michigan that want to stay close to home will go to U-Mich.
All the bright kids (top 10% of class) in Virginia that want to stay close to home will go to UVA or Johns Hopkins.
All the bright kids (top 10% of class) in New York State that want to stay close to home will go to Columbia, NYU, Cooper Union, Cornell, Princeton, Harvard, MIT, etc. Not a SUNY. The SUNYs get the "leftovers"
All the bright kids (top 10% of class) in California that want to stay close to home will go to UCB, UCLA, or Stanford.
All the bright kids (top 10% of class) in Texas that want to stay close to home will go to UT-Austin or Rice.
All the bright kids (top 10% of class) in North Carolina that want to stay close to home will go to UNC or Duke.
All the bright kids (top 10% of class) in Michigan that want to stay close to home will go to U-Mich.
All the bright kids (top 10% of class) in Virginia that want to stay close to home will go to UVA or Johns Hopkins.
All the bright kids (top 10% of class) in New York State that want to stay close to home will go to Columbia, NYU, Cooper Union, Cornell, Princeton, Harvard, MIT, etc. Not a SUNY. The SUNYs get the "leftovers"
That's not necessarily true. I know many smart kids that go to Geneseo, Binghamton or even some of the other SUNY's. This was the case with some kids at my old high school, which was highly ranked at the time and is still very good.
That's not necessarily true. I know many smart kids that go to Geneseo, Binghamton or even some of the other SUNY's. This was the case with some kids at my old high school, which was highly ranked at the time and is still very good.
I don't wanna be like rude/cocky but IMO it is true. There were smart kids in my high school who went to public colleges but the true creme de la creme all went to private schools. NOT that I didn't take a serious look at SUNYs but the private institutions in the Northeast are just too good for public colleges to compete IMO. I agree with NYCAnalyst (except for the part where University of Rochester wasn't included on his list...)
Of course if I ever had kids they would go to public school unless they wanted to pay for its themselves. I still can't believe I got away with that....
I went to MSU for 3 years and I thought the law school was Cooley Law School or is that a separate entity that just happens to be in Lansing?
DCL moved from Detroit to East Lansing, merging with MSU, and became DCL/MSU until it changed its name to MSU College of Law.
As noted, it remains a privately funded and run division of a public university.
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