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But, I've known women in high-level, very high paying jobs make really stupid decisions based on threats or bad advice or pressure from husbands. My belief is their husbands were insecure about their relationships and their motives were based on trying to keep their wife from being able to leave them.
I'm talking about situations that were obvious to the majority of reasonable people - where the majority of reasonable people would think that was happening was wrong.
I have many girlfriends in high power, high profile positions. Not one has made a stupid move that their husband told them to make. For one, we would all call them out.
I have never witnessed a woman taking advice from her husband about her career before, and then losing the career. I’d talk to my friend if I were you. She must see it if it’s gone all the way over to her job, and maybe she is confiding in you for a reason.
Well, it's unclear. On the one hand, he really sees himself as a brilliant strategist and likes to think of himself as good material as a potential lawyer. He's said he would like to go to law school next. This from a guy who just got his PhD, while his wife took care of the kids he said he wanted that she didn't want.....
I did study law and stopped before getting my JD because of a car accident and other things, but he's made comments to her about how he wants to go to law school and drag me along with him.
I just laugh and ignore it but think, yeah, if you think you can drag me along to do your homework for you, or be your secretary, you're out of your ever-lovin' mind.
This from the guy who asked me to edit his thesis, and then got angry with me when I said I thought I should re-write the whole thing - in a nice way. But, it was impossible to understand! His mentor who decided whether or not he got his PhD kept telling him to re-write it. He finally got approved, but I can tell you that just because someone gets their PhD, doesn't mean they can string a sentence together.
And his subject wasn't anything he was passionate about. All he had to do was find some angle on pre-existing studies that hadn't been pursued. He's lazy and can't write to save his life. But, welcome to the academic world. he now has a PhD and the ego to go with it, and the missing years he could have been spending with his young daughters and new wife - but - had to one-up her on the academic sphere.
So, I'm not sure he's sabotaging her on a conscious level, but, I would not put it past him. You'd have to completely disregard any intellect on his behalf, to not consider that he's completely aware that if he can destroy their equity and her career, that she would have a difficult time leaving him.
He does, also, though, want to get revenge on their employer - but - he is not willing to lose his job over it. He is, however, willing to let her lose her job over his anonymous whistleblower complaint (letting them think she made it, while pretending he knows nothing), and then say that they should sell the house to sue them, and that even if his wife goes down, at least she'll take their employer down with her.
Without the rational observation that that means his wife's career "goes down."
It's kind of like trying to rationalize that Trump really didn't know what was happening in Ukraine, or Giuliano, etc. Is it possible? Maybe by some nano fraction. Is that likely? Not on your life.
Ugh; he sounds impossible.
I left work to care for our disabled child 12 years ago. His dad is 12 years older than I & his skill is highly valued in his industry. I recognize that he has been the sole-income provider for all these years & that age 63; he'd prefer to start winding it down but instead ... there is no end in sight.
I have to actively remind myself that no-one is at fault in my situation because SOMETIMES I feel very invalidated & forgotten. It would be very easy for me to be bitter & sometimes I'll say things like 'Yes, I know, you are the one who gets to work' or something similarly snarky.
When he acts clueless about the reality of my situation, I guess I am giving him the benefit of the doubt but I assume he IS just kinda clueless.
Like the other day he said something like 'I oughta just give up & retire. I could just stay home with Luke (nooo...that went horribly the first time we tried that!), because you can make more money than me anyway'.
And I just looked at him for a minute but finally said 'I am a 51 year old WOMAN who has been out of the workforce now since I was 39 years old. It is hard enough for women my age to get the good positions out there, even after continuous employment ... Do you even realize what the impact of these last 12 years would mean for me out there?'
And I saw it in his face. I saw his face change because no; I don't think that had EVER occurred to him before & he knew that what I was saying was the truth. My fast track to success has been permanently mitigated & I would not start over where I left off.
He should have known this already. I'm not sure why he didn't but I do think it was unintentional. He doesn't carry himself in the self-absorbed manner as the guy you have described, though; so I kinda think that your feelings about that guy are correct.
I left work to care for our disabled child 12 years ago. His dad is 12 years older than I & his skill is highly valued in his industry. I recognize that he has been the sole-income provider for all these years & that age 63; he'd prefer to start winding it down but instead ... there is no end in sight.
I have to actively remind myself that no-one is at fault in my situation because SOMETIMES I feel very invalidated & forgotten. It would be very easy for me to be bitter & sometimes I'll say things like 'Yes, I know, you are the one who gets to work' or something similarly snarky.
When he acts clueless about the reality of my situation, I guess I am giving him the benefit of the doubt but I assume he IS just kinda clueless.
Like the other day he said something like 'I oughta just give up & retire. I could just stay home with Luke (nooo...that went horribly the first time we tried that!), because you can make more money than me anyway'.
And I just looked at him for a minute but finally said 'I am a 51 year old WOMAN who has been out of the workforce now since I was 39 years old. It is hard enough for women my age to get the good positions out there, even after continuous employment ... Do you even realize what the impact of these last 12 years would mean for me out there?'
And I saw it in his face. I saw his face change because no; I don't think that had EVER occurred to him before & he knew that what I was saying was the truth. My fast track to success has been permanently mitigated & I would not start over where I left off.
He should have known this already. I'm not sure why he didn't but I do think it was unintentional. He doesn't carry himself in the self-absorbed manner as the guy you have described, though; so I kinda think that your feelings about that guy are correct.
Thanks for sharing this. Really impactful. That was a huge sacrifice on your part.
Religious indoctrination and upbringing are hard to overcome. I was raised in a christian fundamentalist church by a traditional, miserable mother. I was told over and over that my role was to care for my future husband and future kids. I was taught that caring for my husband = showing God how much I loved Him and that it was an honor to do so. I was taught to use my virginity as currency: you know, to buy a husband and to give up ownership of my own sexuality to my husband. In other words, when he wanted sex, I was to do it. I should pursue a husband and not an education or independence. Until then, I should listen to my father or brother (!).
Not listening to a man just wasn't an option offered in my raising.
Fortunately for me, I saw my mother's misery and inaction and left home at 18 and never went back. I am now happily married and have 3 grown kids. I got my degree and am a professional and I love my life. But it took a lot of work on my part to overcome that. It basically cost me relationships with family. I was willing to pay that price. And it was a huge price. But I can understand why some women wouldn't.
To the poster who told the sad story about the woman he worked with: I think she was brave in taking the steps she did take. For her, those steps were probably huge.
To those who want to help women (who want to be helped), it is hard, if not impossible. I do hope that you'll give her the attention and care and patience that she's probably not giving herself.
This is so powerful. Thank you for sharing this story.
People have to want to change or make a stand on their OWN.
It's a conscious decision-often not easy.
As her friend, you can be there to support her and perhaps with more insight, she will take steps to change her life.
Well said. When she told me her husband was bent on selling their house and it was a done deal as far as the decision to do so, I just responded with "That sounds drastic." Then, I told her if she's sure about selling the house, I know a great realtor.
When she told me he wanted her to start day trading futures after she lost her job, I told her that made me really nervous, that I think the stock market is a casino for rich people. It's just a form of gambling. Especially futures. So, I let her know I thought it was a bad idea, then left it alone.
Fortunately, when they spoke to a friend of hers who is a real estate broker about selling the house just this weekend, and he told her she'd be great at selling houses and he's give her a job and get her started, if she was interested - now her husband is on board with that idea.
I also think she'd be really good at that, and at least that would be safer than gambling in futures trading. I guess we'll see if that gets sabotaged, too.
Anyway, I do let her know my opinion. I try to do it in as kind and logical a manner as possible, and then I let it go.
If it just keeps getting worse and worse, though, it will be hard to witness.
I have never witnessed a woman taking advice from her husband about her career before, and then losing the career. I’d talk to my friend if I were you. She must see it if it’s gone all the way over to her job, and maybe she is confiding in you for a reason.
I agree. But, I've learned not to criticize him with her. She will just say something like "Well, that's what being married is about" or something like that. Occasionally, she will share with me that they have been fighting and she's threatened to divorce him, but not many details. And if I start to say anything negative about him, she will then defend him or change the subject.
I've learned it's tricky to disparage someone's spouse, even if they're venting about him/her. It just seems like, inevitably they will get back together, and then they see you as the enemy. So, it's just safer to listen and just respond with, "Oh wow." "Sheesh." Or some "hmmmmms". Or maybe ask if she wants to come stay over.
I agree. But, I've learned not to criticize him with her. She will just say something like "Well, that's what being married is about" or something like that. Occasionally, she will share with me that they have been fighting and she's threatened to divorce him, but not many details. And if I start to say anything negative about him, she will then defend him or change the subject.
I've learned it's tricky to disparage someone's spouse, even if they're venting about him/her. It just seems like, inevitably they will get back together, and then they see you as the enemy. So, it's just safer to listen and just respond with, "Oh wow." "Sheesh." Or some "hmmmmms". Or maybe ask if she wants to come stay over.
Did she tell you specifically what he did? Did she get angry? No one can think losing your job is what marriage is about.
That situation doesn't sound good. I would rather be divorced.
Yeah, he could be someone else's problem. long ago. There's not much excuse for not thinking for your self or getting a second opinion when something sounds a tad dangerous
Yeah, he could be someone else's problem. long ago. There's not much excuse for not thinking for your self or getting a second opinion when something sounds a tad dangerous
The attitude that most people expect is for spouses to support each other's position. Where do you draw the line?
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