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Old 01-28-2020, 12:17 PM
 
Location: Coastal Georgia
50,175 posts, read 63,623,198 times
Reputation: 92923

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The comments were clueless and cringeworthy, but you already know that they are out of sync with you. We met some friends of friends at a gathering who were black, and my husband started asking the kids about basketball. Cringeworthy, but harmless.

Either stop socializing with them, or learn to let it go.
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Old 01-28-2020, 08:22 PM
 
Location: Suburb of Chicago
31,848 posts, read 17,543,036 times
Reputation: 29384
So they like him well enough and feel comfortable enough to poke him the way people poke me by saying they put pasta out for me or saying, 'You're Irish. Surely you like to bend the elbow.'

I figure when people stop ribbing me then I have something to complain about.

And no, it's not racism. They're ribbing him based on stereotypes.
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Old 01-28-2020, 08:50 PM
 
15,546 posts, read 11,968,959 times
Reputation: 32595
Quote:
Originally Posted by MPowering1 View Post
So they like him well enough and feel comfortable enough to poke him the way people poke me by saying they put pasta out for me or saying, 'You're Irish. Surely you like to bend the elbow.'
What does pasta or elbows have to do with being Irish? Those aren't known stereotypes that are commonly used by society... 3 of my 4 grandparents were Irish, I've never heard of such things.
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Old 01-28-2020, 08:58 PM
 
Location: Suburb of Chicago
31,848 posts, read 17,543,036 times
Reputation: 29384
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sundaydrive00 View Post
What does pasta or elbows have to do with being Irish? Those aren't known stereotypes that are commonly used by society... 3 of my 4 grandparents were Irish, I've never heard of such things.
Pasta - Italian
Bending the elbow - Irish

You've NEVER heard the Irish are drinkers?
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Old 01-28-2020, 09:18 PM
 
Location: Various
9,049 posts, read 3,505,448 times
Reputation: 5470
Not racist and he wasn't offended. Cringeworthy of course but mostly because of the risk that someone will get offended on someone else's behalf and make a big deal over nothing.
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Old 01-29-2020, 08:54 AM
 
Location: DFW
1,074 posts, read 637,065 times
Reputation: 1947
Quote:
Originally Posted by Parnassia View Post
I don't think the answer is going to be any different than it was before. You just added more examples to the same complaint. Adding "racism" to the pile. That's not the point. Not that you are wrong to dislike poor behavior. You are just not willing to step out of the known, cut ties with these people, step into the unknown, and cultivate new friends who have more in common with your values. Why would the disappearance have to be sudden or even complete? Why would you end up with no friends? If you really want what you say you do you'll have to make the effort, hard as that is. They don't see a problem so they're not changing. You are the one who wants something different, so you are the one who has to act. Or not. And keep complaining.
That brings us to a related, but different, subject, pertaining to another thread in this forum folder:
I have tried.
I have 3 jobs. Main job, I have had some friendships from over the years. Ran into one of them the other day, and have tried twice to get together
Other two jobs are in the fitness and health field, where one would think I would find "my people". Same thing. I try to make plans- specific plans, not like "hey, let's get together", but like "the Aspen yoga festival is June 25-27, and we are going. You ready for a road trip?"
No one ever commits to plans. For years, I took this personally, until I started realizing that everyone has this very same complaint.
Sometimes I will meet someone I am just drawn to, and will say silly kidding/not kidding things like "do you have an application I can fill out to be your friend?"
Everyone seems to have their little group all set, and as busy as I am (see "3 jobs" above), I have like 3 seconds to ask once, then move on, so yes, that part is my fault. The part about not committing to anything is exponentially NOT my fault.
One friend I have had since high school is very much "my people" but lives far away, so that makes it hard.

What's up with people and friends these days????
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Old 01-29-2020, 09:06 AM
 
Location: DFW
1,074 posts, read 637,065 times
Reputation: 1947
Quote:
Originally Posted by wasel View Post
You have to decide if your principles outweigh the possibility of having no friends. Only you can answer that.

I think you should have a heart to heart with them about your feelings. Not in an accusatory way (don't say "racist" because that will only make them defensive.) Something like this:

"We've been friends a long time and I believe you are good people at heart, but something really bothers me and I need to talk about it. At the party, there were several references to the fact that (John) is black. Music, dancing stereotypes, etc. I assume you were only trying make him feel included, but it telegraphs that you simply see him as "a black guy" rather than the person he is. In fact, knowing John as a person, you should know by now that he doesn't even dance so that reference doesn't make sense anyway! These remarks comes off as prejudicial and are hurtful to me even though I know you didn't mean any harm. I don't want you to put this on John because he did not make any complaint about this -- this is coming from me. I don't like it."

Maybe this kind to talk will educate them about "innocent" stereotyping is received. BTW were the latina/Jewish friends saying these comments? If so you might include something like "If someone said 'we made enchiladas just for you' and you never said liked enchiladas in the past, how would you feel?"
Actually, I called the Latina girl, and asked her something very similar to what you said above (I think I said tamales-LOL). She said , yes, those same people make comments similarly to her. She, like me, does not feel that they have a hatred form of racism, but more an ignorant form of racism.
We went on to talk about how she and I would never live in a neighborhood/school district, etc, that has only one race of people, regardless of what that race was, whereas the others always have.
Because of how deep-seated this "blank space" is when it comes to the subject of other races than themselves, they would never understand. I have in fact approached this subject on many occasions- we've known each other 40 years for crying out loud! They don't get it....like at all. And since it is typically me by myself trying to "get them woke", versus them all believing the same thing in groups of 3 or 4 at a time, I usually give up in order to keep the peace.
The Jewish girl, who was hosting the party, told me that they were going to play the game later "Crimes Against Humanity", but that she took out all the holocaust cards (there were several Jewish people there). Obviously crimes against Jewish humanity not ok, but crimes against Latin, Asian, Black, etc humanity are. However, that is a GAME....that would not have bothered me at all (we had left, I get sleepy- LOL). But just flippantly saying "oh you're black, you must be able to dance/play basketball/have a large unit" as if they are saying the sky is blue, is very, well, shocking and scary in 2020. I just thought we, especially my friends, were more intelligent than that.
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Old 01-29-2020, 09:18 AM
 
Location: DFW
1,074 posts, read 637,065 times
Reputation: 1947
Quote:
Originally Posted by BirdieBelle View Post
What you described is a stereotype. It's not racism.

If they had said, "Sorry, black boyfriend, but you aren't allowed to dance..." then THAT would be an example of racism - the majority group discriminating against someone based on skin color.

But I know you didn't come here to argue semantics.

They behaved boorishly. You were offended. Being friends with them is already a stretch for you. So what do you WANT to do?
I want to be very clear: I was emphatically NOT offended.
I was shocked that my friends, in 2020, having grown up in a majority minority state, all of whom have college degrees (one doctor, 3 teachers, a couple of business owners), would have this in them
I was kind of (eye roll) thinking: well, there's another way in which I am totally different from this group

Offended would be the time that my husband was screamed the N word while we were on vacation, which made my youngest (9 yo at that time)cry because she had never seen that kind of racism. Or when someone called him an Uncle Tom because I am white. Or someone assuming I must be some sort of sex fiend because my hubby is black. All things that have happened, all offensive.

I am mostly venting to y'all (lucky ones- LOL) because I cannot vent to my friends ABOUT my friends.
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Old 01-29-2020, 10:30 AM
 
7,910 posts, read 9,115,157 times
Reputation: 9277
Guess your idea that college educated folks are better people than the average ******* on the street is wrong OR you are just overanalyzing things.
Life is tough, grow a pair or you will forever be traumatized by the actions of others. You seem to be more hung up on the actions of others towards your husband than he is. Maybe that is what you should try to figure out...what are you getting out of being offended perpetually?
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Old 01-29-2020, 10:36 AM
 
Location: DFW
1,074 posts, read 637,065 times
Reputation: 1947
Quote:
Originally Posted by NSHL10 View Post
Guess your idea that college educated folks are better people than the average ******* on the street is wrong OR you are just overanalyzing things.
Life is tough, grow a pair or you will forever be traumatized by the actions of others. You seem to be more hung up on the actions of others towards your husband than he is. Maybe that is what you should try to figure out...what are you getting out of being offended perpetually?
Again not offended. Certainly not traumatized- LOL
I just do not think my friends are enhancing my spiritual growth, per they do not seem to be trying to enhance their own.
Let's put it in a different context: Let's say you were pretty spiritual and religious. In finding Jesus/Mohammed/ etc etc, you had chosen to live your life by that type of standard, and due to that felt overwhelming contentment (maybe an oxymoron, but bear with me)
Your friends were constantly partying, sleeping around, and then would complain about not being happy, not having fulfillment.
Though you had a) set the example; and b) attempted on multiple occasions to inspire a similar consciousness in them, they continued to do things which breed unhappiness, and would then complain that they were unhappy
At what point would you be DONE?
And what if being done meant putting your own past in the grave, and not really having anyone to hang out with?
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