Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Uhh, excuse me, but paying hundreds of workers a decent salary is putting money into the economy, which is the very point that BarLatGo has been trying to explain to you.
You can't explain what you apparently don't know. Try doing some research on "opportunity cost" vs "due diligence". You might then understand the point then.
If you won't do that homework, then maybe you might understand this. Government has no money of its own. Every $ spent was first taken from someone who did earn it or borrowed from the future earners and has to be paid back w/interest.
You can't explain what you apparently don't know. Try doing some research on "opportunity cost" vs "due diligence". You might then understand the point then.
If you won't do that homework, then maybe you might understand this. Government has no money of its own. Every $ spent was first taken from someone who did earn it or borrowed from the future earners and has to be paid back w/interest.
I understand opportunity cost and due diligence quite well, and much better than you do I'm sure--I majored in accounting and during my career I've worked for state government and for Fortune 500 companies. But that's beside the point. The bottom line (pardon the CPA pun) is that making North Carolina a hub for the film industry has many benefits for the state. It provides jobs, it provides valuable national and international exposure, it attracts related services and industries, it promotes tourism, all of which translate into money pumped into our economy and additional tax revenue for the state. Providing film industry incentives is money well spent.
No need to take my word for it. Read this. And this.
I understand opportunity cost and due diligence quite well, and much better than you do I'm sure--I majored in accounting and during my career I've worked for state government and for Fortune 500 companies. But that's beside the point. The bottom line (pardon the CPA pun) is that making North Carolina a hub for the film industry has many benefits for the state. It provides jobs, it provides valuable national and international exposure, it attracts related services and industries, it promotes tourism, all of which translate into money pumped into our economy and additional tax revenue for the state. Providing film industry incentives is money well spent.
No need to take my word for it. Read this. And this.
What is even more laughable (or tragic) is these tax hawks are going to waste millions of dollars in attempts to attract or expand new business that will never materialize while destroying or dismantling a proven bread winner. Analogy: tear down a functioning home, re-build a smaller house on the same lot with less value and then claim it an economic success...so they can say we built it.
They'll also blame the Hollywood libs for bailing on NC once the tax incentives (gravy train) runs out. While states like Louisiana (good ole Bobbi J) is cursing wasteful spending while luring the film industry via huge tax incentives (oh...the hypocrisy). Politics is local after all.
Here's a thought...how in the hell do small farmers or the majority of rural small businesses even survive without huge gubment support or subsidizations? It's impossible yet they despise wasteful lib spending. Not the case at all, the money doesn't disappear into the ether it just changes hands. Not that I despise small farmers or many of these rural area businesses that depend on incentives and gubment support to survive but when do we pull the plug on them? That money could be used for other "economic" purposes to incentivize companies to expand and relocate to more urban areas in the state.
So the strategy is to pull the plug on a proven competitive economic entity and take a shot in the dark on the unknown.....got it!...helluva plan.
What is even more laughable (or tragic) is these tax hawks are going to waste millions of dollars in attempts to attract or expand new business that will never materialize while destroying or dismantling a proven bread winner. Analogy: tear down a functioning home, re-build a smaller house on the same lot with less value and then claim it an economic success...so they can say we built it.
One other point that no one ever mentions - even if these new industries do materialize, how long will it take to get from deciding to do the project to actually handing out the first pay check? Offices and retail space are one thing, but the construction of a manufacturing facility is a different animal altogether.
It's not unusual for these places to take years to get from site selection to hiring it's first employee.
Films, on the other hand, start handing out pay checks in just a few weeks.
What is even more laughable (or tragic) is these tax hawks are going to waste millions of dollars in attempts to attract or expand new business that will never materialize while destroying or dismantling a proven bread winner. Analogy: tear down a functioning home, re-build a smaller house on the same lot with less value and then claim it an economic success...so they can say we built it.
They'll also blame the Hollywood libs for bailing on NC once the tax incentives (gravy train) runs out. While states like Louisiana (good ole Bobbi J) is cursing wasteful spending while luring the film industry via huge tax incentives (oh...the hypocrisy). Politics is local after all.
Here's a thought...how in the hell do small farmers or the majority of rural small businesses even survive without huge gubment support or subsidizations? It's impossible yet they despise wasteful lib spending. Not the case at all, the money doesn't disappear into the ether it just changes hands. Not that I despise small farmers or many of these rural area businesses that depend on incentives and gubment support to survive but when do we pull the plug on them? That money could be used for other "economic" purposes to incentivize companies to expand and relocate to more urban areas in the state.
So the strategy is to pull the plug on a proven competitive economic entity and take a shot in the dark on the unknown.....got it!...helluva plan.
Location: The place where the road & the sky collide
23,814 posts, read 34,688,469 times
Reputation: 10256
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Aristotle
What is even more laughable (or tragic) is these tax hawks are going to waste millions of dollars in attempts to attract or expand new business that will never materialize while destroying or dismantling a proven bread winner. Analogy: tear down a functioning home, re-build a smaller house on the same lot with less value and then claim it an economic success...so they can say we built it.
They'll also blame the Hollywood libs for bailing on NC once the tax incentives (gravy train) runs out. While states like Louisiana (good ole Bobbi J) is cursing wasteful spending while luring the film industry via huge tax incentives (oh...the hypocrisy). Politics is local after all.
Here's a thought...how in the hell do small farmers or the majority of rural small businesses even survive without huge gubment support or subsidizations? It's impossible yet they despise wasteful lib spending. Not the case at all, the money doesn't disappear into the ether it just changes hands. Not that I despise small farmers or many of these rural area businesses that depend on incentives and gubment support to survive but when do we pull the plug on them? That money could be used for other "economic" purposes to incentivize companies to expand and relocate to more urban areas in the state.
So the strategy is to pull the plug on a proven competitive economic entity and take a shot in the dark on the unknown.....got it!...helluva plan.
Can't rep you again.
This is so true. Keep in mind that these are the same fine folks who said that they opposed the Kings Mountain casino on moral grounds & sent their letter to the Department of the Interior asking them to kill it. They've been mysteriously quiet since it came out that most of them took money to kill potential competition for the Cherokee casinos. They are willing to kill millions of dollars to the state coffers, annually, to get a campaign contribution. They don't give a crap about regular people.
If anyone didn't get it because they don't like casinos the film incentives situation should cement it for them. Killing something that's pumping millions into the state economy with nothing in place to take its place is total disregard for the citizens. This on top of passing a bill to allow Duke to pass on the cost of cleaning up coal ash to the citizens of NC.
....
So the strategy is to pull the plug on a proven competitive economic entity and take a shot in the dark on the unknown.....got it!...helluva plan.
But there is no proof. There has been absolutely no due diligence performed on Beverly Perdue's film tax credit that shows a net benefit to the state of North Carolina. The only thing ever cited is a largely discredited "study" produced by the MPAA. This is the same organization that has sued individuals for hundreds of thousands of $s because they downloaded a video from a file sharing site.
Every $ spent on the film industry was a $ taken out of the economy that could not be spent elsewhere. Film tax rebate supporters avoid this discussion as proven here. In fact the Beverly Perdue tax credit does not even have a mechanism to verify what is claimed by those getting the credit even happened. It's about irresponsible as it gets.
NC had a film industry before Perdue was elected. It will have one afterwards. People can believe what they want but the state isn't going to suffer because this tax rebate was eliminated.
Location: The place where the road & the sky collide
23,814 posts, read 34,688,469 times
Reputation: 10256
Quote:
Originally Posted by BarLatGo
One other point that no one ever mentions - even if these new industries do materialize, how long will it take to get from deciding to do the project to actually handing out the first pay check? Offices and retail space are one thing, but the construction of a manufacturing facility is a different animal altogether.
It's not unusual for these places to take years to get from site selection to hiring it's first employee.
Films, on the other hand, start handing out pay checks in just a few weeks.
This is quite true.
Also, the film industry has historically worked on the incentive system. The industry started in NY & North Jersey & was lured to California.
It's as close as you can get to instant gratification for handing out checks after setting up shop to do a shoot.
The film incentive is a rebate not a grant or gift. In a perfect world there would be no incentives but this isn't a perfect world. I think that towns & counties should try to work things out with film companies if the state won't.
Last edited by southbound_295; 08-30-2014 at 12:33 PM..
Editorializing for a moment, I spend a thirty year career in production and while it's always nice to ply your trade close to home, fact of the matter is if you're dead serious about making a sustaining career in major film and television production you need to accept the fact that there are four cities in North America where that will happen: LA, NYC, Vancouver and Toronto. That's not to say there isn't great work being done in NC, but in the same way that if your heart is absolutely set on designing aircraft, you'd better come to terms that you're going to be living in Seattle or SoCal, if your calling is to be a major league financier you best stake your claim in Manhattan or London or if oil & gas are your thing you're probably going to end up in Houston or Denver. Don't be so arrogant to believe the place you choose to live owes you any favors pursuing your particular ambition.
I think we're all aware that this horse we're beating has long since died. Mostly we're just venting.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
