NC Filial Responsibility Statute (apartment, insurance, house)

[silverwing]

Oh wow

Ran into a discussion about this article
Monica Yant Kinney: If mom can't pay, adult child must | Philadelphia Inquirer | 07/12/2009 (http://www.philly.com/inquirer/columnists/monica_yant_kinney/20090712_Monica_Yant_Kinney__If_mom_can_t_pay__adu lt_child_must.html - broken link)

Which lead to a link on filial laws in all states
http://www.dsl.psu.edu/faculty/pearson/FilialResponsibilityStatutes.pdf (broken link)

NC's is a doozy:

§ 14-326.1. Parents; failure to support. If any person being of full age, and having sufficient income after reasonably providing for his or her own immediate family shall, without reasonable cause, neglect to maintain and support his or her parent or parents, if such parent or parents be sick or not able to work and have not sufficient means or ability to maintain or support themselves, such person shall be deemed guilty of a Class 2 misdemeanor; upon conviction of a second or subsequent offense such person shall be guilty of a Class 1 misdemeanor. If there be more than one person bound under the provisions of the next preceding paragraph to support the same parent or parents, they shall share equitably in the discharge of such duty. (1955, c. 1099; 1969, c. 1045, s. 3; 1993, c. 539, s. 227; 1994, Ex. Sess., c. 24, s. 14(c).)

[brokensky]

Originally Posted by Mattman704

Great, take care of your parents or else. Nevermind that there are multitudes upon multitudes of parents that deserve to rot in senility and their own filth, such as my Father, the abusive SOB that he is. My response to the State attempting to force me to do things I should not have to with the threat of criminal conviction has a lot to do with F**** and you.

Now, now, Mattman . . . think about it this way. If the state makes you responsible for your scumbag father . . . you can get guardianship over him, and have him declared mentally incompetent . . . seize his assets . . . and lock him up in the basement.

Okay, not serious, of course . . . but the chances of your being put in the position to have to take care of your father - slim and none. Of course, you may find when you are older that caring for your no-good father is an act of charity that feels good to you - b/c you have come to the place that you are not angry with him but rather just feel sorry for his being such a waste as a human being.

[gizmobizmo]

This is fascinating to me since I have never heard of this till today.

I wonder how the courts decide who is responsible if there are several adult children. Are they all equally responsible? Is it dependant upon whether one has a better ability to pay than another? What about adult children who have no relationship with the parent?

[Mattman704]

lol I thought I deleted this post. Pisses me off to no end that it still showed up. Don't want to be looked upon as an angsty anger psycho lol.

[Catrick]

Don't worry Matt, everyone knows where you are coming from. But boy that law would worry me.

My Dad passed away last year at 86. Five years ago he fell and broke his hip and was never able to walk again because of some other health issues. When I still lived in Ft. Lauderdale, my sister and I would be there a lot to help him and my Mom. They also had an aide that would come in. The money went pretty fast. My parents had manged to save some money for their "old age" and that is what kept them going. I won't go into my family dynamics but I have two sisters, one who is nasty the other a good person. Unfortunately for us the nasty one convinced my parents to move by her in Tampa so she could "take care of them". Well, it proved to be more than she could handle and she hired an aide to help them out. (My parents paid of course.) After my Mom passed four years ago the aide became full time. And in actuality my sister moved from Tampa to North Carolina but held a firm grip on the money situation of my Dad. My other sister and I were kept out of the loop until she realized that the money was running out and we both got emails saying that one of us needed to be prepared to take Dad. To make a long story short my sister and I spent a lot of time on the phone trying to figure out what to do and how to do it. She lives in an apartment outside Chicago and we have a small house here. But we would have done something to prevent him from going into the nursing home my other sister was threatening to do. My Dad passed before anything had to be firmly decided. But my whole point I guess is that we were willing to do something but it would have been different if we were forced by law. Then it would seem we would not have as much control over what we decided to do. I don't envy anyone that would be faced with that. There are way too many questions like other posters said on who would pay and who would do this and that. In my case I was just glad I could help my parents out and did the best I could. I had a good relationship with my parents but if I didn't I would be very bitter about being forced to take care of them.

Anyway, just giving my two cents and venting a bit. It will be a year in September since he passed and I guess I still have issues with my sister. So sorry for the rant.

[brokensky]

Originally Posted by Mattman704

lol I thought I deleted this post. Pisses me off to no end that it still showed up. Don't want to be looked upon as an angsty anger psycho lol.

Matt . . . I assure you that there are probably more people who feel the way you do than you could ever imagine.

And it brings up a very good issue that someone else mentioned - what about adult children who are estranged from their parents? And what about adult children who left home as soon as they could and their parent/s have never done a thing for them (education, housing, etc) for 50 or 60 years? I do wonder about these things.

[silverwing]

Originally Posted by anifani821

And it brings up a very good issue that someone else mentioned - what about adult children who are estranged from their parents? And what about adult children who left home as soon as they could and their parent/s have never done a thing for them (education, housing, etc) for 50 or 60 years? I do wonder about these things.

According to a poster from the state originally discussed: PA, filial statutes were largely dismissed once social programs like Medicaid and SSI came along. However, budget shortfalls have caused nursing homes and care facilities that depend on those funds to say "heyyy, look what archaic law is still on the books!" and exploit it with a vengeance.

I go along with Mattman's eloquent - if deleted - reply. Usually, by the time a parent needs care, their offspring have kids and responsibilities of their own. (Making a general statement. I don't have kids) I'd be damned if I, having grown up under a POS parent and now doing the right thing by my own kids, would be willing to support that parent in their old age. NC words the statute by saying "reasonable" in an offspring providing for their current generation family. I'd hate to put that term to the test. "Reasonable" might be defined as saying that your kid can got to UNCC when you had your heart (and saved funds) on sending him/her to Harvard.

And extend that policy. I'd further be damned if I would be willing to give up the savings I've responsibly accumulated toward providing for myself in old age, all to go toward the care of a POS parent. According to the NC statute, the whole thing becomes a domino effect. Having depleted your own funds to care for an undeserving parent, your own kids are now expected to care for you. What if you don't want that burden on them?

I think if these laws become enforced in a more nationwide manner, you'll see offspring who will look for the means to divorce themselves from that onerous burden. OR, you may see an increase in elder abuse as those offspring simply pull their parents from care facilities and put them in their own homes. That "lock them in the basement" scenario wouldn't be far off.

[OMGosh Josh]

I need to bring this to the attention of Matt Mittan, haha.

[chickenista]

Wow!! I had no idea.
Kinda bums my plans for dumping POS dad at some point. Bummer indeed.
And Matt.. no worries. You are not way off center at all.
Wait till I tell DH... snickergigglesnort...
I doubt that they would enforce it.... I mean, really...c'mon...It would be a massive deal if they busted someone for it.

[brokensky]

Originally Posted by silverwing

According to a poster from the state originally discussed: PA, filial statutes were largely dismissed once social programs like Medicaid and SSI came along. However, budget shortfalls have caused nursing homes and care facilities that depend on those funds to say "heyyy, look what archaic law is still on the books!" and exploit it with a vengeance.

I go along with Mattman's eloquent - if deleted - reply. Usually, by the time a parent needs care, their offspring have kids and responsibilities of their own. (Making a general statement. I don't have kids) I'd be damned if I, having grown up under a POS parent and now doing the right thing by my own kids, would be willing to support that parent in their old age. NC words the statute by saying "reasonable" in an offspring providing for their current generation family. I'd hate to put that term to the test. "Reasonable" might be defined as saying that your kid can got to UNCC when you had your heart (and saved funds) on sending him/her to Harvard.

And extend that policy. I'd further be damned if I would be willing to give up the savings I've responsibly accumulated toward providing for myself in old age, all to go toward the care of a POS parent. According to the NC statute, the whole thing becomes a domino effect. Having depleted your own funds to care for an undeserving parent, your own kids are now expected to care for you. What if you don't want that burden on them?

I think if these laws become enforced in a more nationwide manner, you'll see offspring who will look for the means to divorce themselves from that onerous burden. OR, you may see an increase in elder abuse as those offspring simply pull their parents from care facilities and put them in their own homes. That "lock them in the basement" scenario wouldn't be far off.

Yes, most of us would be part of the "sandwich generation" - caring for parents while still trying to put our kids thru/ college. Luckily, my parents have been very conservative and have not only longterm care insurance but they have some money wh/ hopefully will last thru/ their lifetimes. And it is a good thing they were able to plan that way. They always said - "we won't be able to do anything for you as far as an inheritance, but we will be able to take care of ourselves." I felt THAT was a gift.

So far, we are able to help them when they are sick - or have had surgery - but they are able to take care of themselves w/ all their activities.

I know I am very fortunate, b/c that is not always the situation.

That statute is old, but as long as it is on the books, I would think it could be enforceable.

I agree - if people are forced to take care of toxic parents . . . when there is no relationship there or only a surface relationship, this would put everyone in a terrible position. However, I have seen families "take in" hateful grandpa and try to make it work (causing a real strain on the whole family).

I think moving a parent in with you would be one thing; to be hauled into court and held responsible for DEBT that parent had incurred . . . now that is beyond my comprehension. I am working hard to take care of myself and put my son thru/ college . . . I sure can't take on someone else's debt!!!