African-American Woman Slain by Scranton Police (Wilkes-Barre, Pittston: apartment, renting, neighborhood)

[Mr Yuk]

So if the woman was white, it would be different? How?

Until someone is in the position as a police officer in harm's way, they need to reserve judgment until all the facts are known.

Amazing how people love to criticize the police, yet they won't hesitate to call the police when they're in trouble.

[Mr Yuk]

Originally Posted by ScranBarre

Look, people, it's obvious that some of you misunderstood me, but what should I expect? I posted this immediately after reading the dozens of knee-jerk comments on the web site of the Scranton Times-Tribune newspaper in reference to the rather detail-deprived article. As I said I CAN NOT form a judgment one way or the other yet without knowing all of the facts involved.

Was the woman charging at an officer? We don't know.
Was she just saying threatening things while pointing a knife at an officer? We don't know.
Did she have to be shot MULTIPLE TIMES? We don't know.
Was race a factor? We don't know.
Could the officers have instead used a Taser to subdue her? We don't know.


There are too many variables here, but I was just trying to provide a brief synopsis of the situation, and race being a potential motivating factor CAN NOT be ruled out given the rampant homophobia/racism that we all know exists in Coal Country. It's entirely possible the officers could have all been African-American and shot a Caucasian knife-wielding woman to death.

It's all conjecture until we learn more. Thank you, though, for jumping down my throat. MY PERSONAL OPINION is that Tasering a woman holding a knife should have easily subdued her. MY PERSONAL OPINION is that this mentally-ill woman was failed by the system intended to ensure her own safety. MY PERSONAL OPINION is that race was NOT a motivating factor here. MY PERSONAL OPINION is that, just as with the other two recent incidents in Scranton of an officer killing someone (including the one where an innocent bystander died), this will also be ruled as a "justified" use of force. MY PERSONAL OPINION is that someone in the neighborhood, who, according to the article, witnessed this woman behaving errantly earlier in the day SHOULD HAVE notified police, who then should have notified someone equipped and trained to deal with the mentally-deranged.

Saying "you weren't there so you can't have an opinion" is a typical answer I'd expect to hear from some in Scranton. In that case let's let the Scranton P.D. shoot ANYONE commiting ANY crime under the premise of "he/she/it charged right at me", and then it will stand because "we weren't there" to offer a counter-argument. While I have nothing but the utmost respect for police, considering this is the THIRD FATAL SHOOTING made by a city cop in the past several years this is something that needs to be taken seriously.

You're in the DC area for a week, and you're already looking down your nose at NEPA residents as a bunch of coal cracking hicks? Geez, that didn't take long...

[scrantonluna]

Originally Posted by ScranBarre

Was the woman charging at an officer? We don't know.
Was she just saying threatening things while pointing a knife at an officer? We don't know.
Did she have to be shot MULTIPLE TIMES? We don't know.
Was race a factor? We don't know.
Could the officers have instead used a Taser to subdue her? We don't know.

If you read the initial article, there was about an hour between the time the officers responded and when the woman was shot, so it's not like they went in and just popped her.

Word is that she charged them and left no options. Did she have to be shot more than once? First, let's put aside the adrenaline issue and the fact that all firearms classes teach the 'double tap' method - the simple truth is that often one or even several bullets is not enough to stop a person immediately. They don't just fall to the ground and die. People who have been shot can certainly cause a lot of damage in their last moments, and that's even in the wounds are life threatening. Many people who have been shot are still around to tell about it.

Everything I have heard so far from sources indicates a good shooting.

Lastly, whether you believe it or not, this is a tragedy for everyone involved. I doubt very much that any of those four officers started their night looking to kill anyone. Even if their choice was the right one, it won't be easy to live with.

[SteelCityRising]

Originally Posted by go phillies

You're in the DC area for a week, and you're already looking down your nose at NEPA residents as a bunch of coal cracking hicks? Geez, that didn't take long...

Unlike NEPA here in DC diversity is everywhere I look. I've seen gay couples holding hands in public, and nobody bats an eye. If my partner and I were to hold hands while walking down a typical street in Pittston I'm sure we'd be in for an earful (if not worse). I've heard more languages spoken here in one week than I had during an entire lifetime in NEPA. Today, during my first-ever trip to the Smithsonian Zoo, I met a number of my co-workers who were Asian-American, African-American, and Middle Eastern in descent, along with me to represent the LGBT community. Every other vehicle down here has either a McCain/Palin or Obama/Biden bumper sticker, indicating that people here are truly well-versed in politics (unlike those in NEPA who blindly vote for a straight ticket time after time because they are too lazy to fully research the candidates' backgrounds). While at Target tonight buying some household products I had an engaging conversation with a recent immigrant to the country, and she was very excited to be in NoVA.

I'm sorry to say this, but I don't see any reason now to ever want to return to Scranton/Wilkes-Barre after getting a true "feel" for a new area. I never realized how much far BEHIND the rest of the nation that part of NEPA was until I left. People in Scranton/Wilkes-Barre still "fear" commuter rail service, loft apartments, same-sex civil unions, people of color, people who are non-Roman Catholic and dare to challenge Bishop Martino's politicizing from the pulpit, etc. People still think that the manufacturing sector is going to make a strong comeback in NEPA, and until that mindset changes the "Brain Drain" is going to continue indefinitely until Scranton/Wilkes-Barre eventually resembles a giant retirement community. Pittsburgh is a prime example of a city very similar to Scranton/Wilkes-Barre that has just begun to SUCCESSFULLY reinvent itself---with the resistance to change and progress I see exhibited by so many back in NEPA I don't think I'll ever be tempted now to move back. Considering I was hoping to spurn my own business venture someday and hire a few people, it is only Scranton's loss, not mine, that there will be one less well-paying entrepreneur in its midst.

[AbbeysMom]

To be fair Scranbarre I think that you need more than one week to get a "true feel" for your new area. I am however very glad that you are so excited about where you are now living, I think you are painting all of the people of NEPA with a very broad brush. You have not been in NoVA long enough to get a feel for the area. It's new and exciting, and that's great hopefully it will remain exciting for you.

I am glad that you are able to openly be yourself there. But please don't begin to put those of us who are here in Scranton/Wilkes-Barre/Pittston down. If it's so bad here then why are so many coming here from NY and NJ?

You need to learn to take each individual that you meet in life and base your opinions on your interaction with those people you have met. Your opinion may change of NoVA after you have truly lived there for a substaintial amount of time and begin to meet people.

You seem to be upset because the tone of this thread is leaning against this being a racial issue, and then you say that you didn't mean for it to go that way, however you did put that in the subject line of your post, so it is you who in effect brought the "racial issue" into this post.

It was a very tragic event that this woman was shot, but it could have been far more tragic had we also lost one or more of those 4 police officers. Loss of life is always tragic. As another poster stated I don't think that any one of those men went there with the intention of shooting anyone. Mental illness is a terrible thing and my heart goes out to the family of Mrs. Williams and she is in my prayers that she is now at peace.

[NYRangers 2008]

NEPA, it is what it is. Diversity and all that other stuff doesn't make me like an area. Low taxes and affordable homes in nice neighborhoods do.

[AbbeysMom]

Well people help, but those things you mention don't hurt.

[LIMAMA4]

I live in NY and am moving up to NEPA next year. I have never met a nicer group of people. I enjoy being in PA because of the people. The high cost of living and the high taxes here on Long Island seem to make the people alittle uptight. The beautiful and affordable cost of living in PA plus the people make a complete package for me. I truly believe that my family and I will be very happy in our decision to make the move.

[W-B proud]

To get back to the original subect... I don't think there is enough information about this incident to draw a conclusion yet. Besides a handful of news clips, nobody really knows what what transpired yet. The only info we have is that a mentally unstable, black woman charged police officers with a knife in her hand. It is way to early to pull "race" into this. Hopefully there will be a thorough investigation by AN OUTSIDE OF THE AREA department, and we will find out what really happened that night. That being said, If it were me, and I charged an officer with a knife, I would expect to be shot dead in that situation. I don't think the race of the woman had anything to do with this, IMO.

[RebelPhotog]

Originally Posted by go phillies

So if the woman was white, it would be different? How?

Until someone is in the position as a police officer in harm's way, they need to reserve judgment until all the facts are known.

Amazing how people love to criticize the police, yet they won't hesitate to call the police when they're in trouble.

well stated