African-American Woman Slain by Scranton Police (movies, safe, office)

[SteelCityRising]

Well it looks like NEPA might be getting yet ANOTHER major media "black" eye (with special emphasis upon "black"), and sadly, once again, racism might be a factor. While I think we had all best reserve total judgment until all of the details of this case are out what we DO know, objectively, is that Brenda Williams, 52, of Scranton was wielding a knife and was shot to death by a group of Scranton police officers. Ms. Williams has a history of mental illness. This is the third fatal shooting by Scranton city police officers since 2002; the other two were found to be "justified" (even though in a May 2004 incident an innocent person was shot to death).

A lot of people are outraged by this incident, as there are already about three dozen comments posted on the web site of the Times-Tribune. About 1/3 support the officers while the majority feel as if excessive force was used. I'm inclined to agree with the latter. There were a group of officers facing this woman. There was no reason why they all had to shoot her to death multiple times because she was holding a knife. I'm still uncertain as to why they couldn't have used a taser or shot her in an extremity, where she might have had a chance of survival.

As expected people are now pulling the "race" card as well, since all of the cops are white (are there even any black cops on the city's force?!) and the deceased is black. Some claim that if Williams were Caucasian she wouldn't have been gunned down, but I'm inclined to side with the officers now UNTIL an investigation is completed. After all, if you had someone with mental illness charging at you with a knife, you might, in the heat of the moment, react in the same manner as they did. I still think they should have used a Taser, but what do I know?

[DavidWebb]

They could have just shot her in the legs and that would've been the end of it!!

[BLUEDIAMOND64]

Originally Posted by ScranBarre

Well it looks like NEPA might be getting yet ANOTHER major media "black" eye (with special emphasis upon "black"), and sadly, once again, racism might be a factor. While I think we had all best reserve total judgment until all of the details of this case are out what we DO know, objectively, is that Brenda Williams, 52, of Scranton was wielding a knife and was shot to death by a group of Scranton police officers. Ms. Williams has a history of mental illness. This is the third fatal shooting by Scranton city police officers since 2002; the other two were found to be "justified" (even though in a May 2004 incident an innocent person was shot to death).

A lot of people are outraged by this incident, as there are already about three dozen comments posted on the web site of the Times-Tribune. About 1/3 support the officers while the majority feel as if excessive force was used. I'm inclined to agree with the latter. There were a group of officers facing this woman. There was no reason why they all had to shoot her to death multiple times because she was holding a knife. I'm still uncertain as to why they couldn't have used a taser or shot her in an extremity, where she might have had a chance of survival.

As expected people are now pulling the "race" card as well, since all of the cops are white (are there even any black cops on the city's force?!) and the deceased is black. Some claim that if Williams were Caucasian she wouldn't have been gunned down, but I'm inclined to side with the officers now UNTIL an investigation is completed. After all, if you had someone with mental illness charging at you with a knife, you might, in the heat of the moment, react in the same manner as they did. I still think they should have used a Taser, but what do I know?

It is very hard to reserve any opinion like you say unless you were there and ALL the facts are known. Was she advancing toward anyone, and exactly what was going on. Does not matter that she had a mental illness it matters what she was doing, whether it be threatening with a knife, etc. It would be interesting to know all the facts.

[thecoalman]

Originally Posted by ScranBarre

...shot her in an extremity, where she might have had a chance of survival.

Paul have you ever shot a pistol? Doubtful as that is the talk of someone that never has.

When you shoot someone you shoot at the largest possible target possible, e.g body mass. Shooting people in the legs only happens in the movies. Go get yourself a short barreled 9mm and take a shot at a small stationary target, now try it in rapid succession... you 'll be lucky if you hit the first shot and that is stationary in a controlled environment without all the stress of the situation.

Shooting to kill is also a safety measure, you don't want bullets missing the target and going off to kill the innocent person nearby.

[BLUEDIAMOND64]

Originally Posted by thecoalman

Paul have you ever shot a pistol? Doubtful as that is the talk of someone that never has.

When you shoot someone you shoot at the largest possible target possible, e.g body mass. Shooting people in the legs only happens in the movies. Go get yourself a short barreled 9mm and take a shot at a small stationary target, now try it in rapid succession... you 'll be lucky if you hit the first shot and that is stationary in a controlled environment without all the stress of the situation.

Shooting to kill is also a safety measure, you don't want bullets missing the target and going off to kill the innocent person nearby.

coalman good point, it is called police training and again unless you were there it is hard to speculate.

[mattjd]

wow, several white police officers shooting a knife wealing black woman...geez, might as well have grabbed a whip and made her pick cotton. this has racism written all over it. let's just give her family members millions of dollars to shut them up and forget about this whole thing. last thing we want is al sharpton marching through scranton singing "we shall overcome!"

[CHS89]

What if a hispanic cop shot her? Or a black cop? Or an asian cop? Would you even care then?

People read way too much into everything these days.

[thecoalman]

Originally Posted by TheHighHat

coalman good point, it is called police training and again unless you were there it is hard to speculate.

Most people that have never shot a weapon don't realize how hard it is to hit something with a shorter barreled pistol. They are made for close range.

[ConfusingRotary]

I really don't think this is a race issue, or you'd hear similar stories more often. As for the officers using too much force, it depends on what this woman was doing. Not enough facts to really say either way

[The Commish]

Originally Posted by TheHighHat

It is very hard to reserve any opinion like you say unless you were there and ALL the facts are known.

Wrong.

It's hard to come to a conclusion until they release the investigation. This whole "have to be there" line of thinking is a bit too deferential to perpetrators of violence. It's safe to make reasonable conclusions based on the evidence that the report will discuss. A conclusion in this case doesn't turn on some intangible fact that's incapable of being included in the report. The police have standards for the use of deadly force, and it's not impossible to determine whether the victim's conduct justified the use of deadly force.