The Government's New Year's Resolutions: I Will Not Shut Down (how much, closing)

[robbobobbo]

Originally Posted by Carlingtonian

I think it should be based on whether the schools closed--and I don't have kids. But if the schools are closed and the Federal Government is not, then all those parents have to scramble to figure out what to do with their kids.

Don't working parents who aren't government employees have to do that? Is it a huge problem for a parent working at the Labor Department, but not for an employee at Safeway?

[Carlingtonian]

Originally Posted by robbobobbo

Don't working parents who aren't government employees have to do that? Is it a huge problem for a parent working at the Labor Department, but not for an employee at Safeway?

Fair point. Maybe all businesses should close if the schools do. Though ChristineVA makes some good points, I do think it would be simpler for everyone if all major institutions (schools and employers) did the same thing when bad weather hits. But I know that's a pipedream.

Definitely with ArtyGuy on cleaning off one's car before heading out, though!

[ArtyGuy]

Originally Posted by airjay75

I am totally with you on this. It is one of my biggest pet peeves, and it really is dangerous. I know in Pennsylvania, it was illegal to drive if you did not completely clear your car of snow before driving it. I seem to recall reading some articles in the past about people being killed by ice flying off of the roof of the car in front of them and smashing through their windshield. Yet another example, in my opinion, of people not knowing how to handle winter driving conditions.

It is a law in many places because as you pointed out, it is incredibly dangerous. A sheet of ice or snow coming off a car while on the highway and hitting the windshield of another car is fatal accident waiting to happen.

[ChristineVA]

Originally Posted by ArtyGuy

It is a law in many places because as you pointed out, it is incredibly dangerous. A sheet of ice or snow coming off a car while on the highway and hitting the windshield of another car is fatal accident waiting to happen.

As I was out driving around Woodbridge today, I came to the conclusion that NO ONE in Woodbridge must have a garage despite evidence to the contrary. It was a rare sight to see anyone with their roof or back window cleaned off. There were 2 inches of snow on every car around me and as I drove behind them, I got my own personal snow storm. I realize it's a pain to clean off the top of your car, especially if you have an SUV, but I think we all know now that is very dangerous.

[spencgr]

Originally Posted by airjay75

Do you have data to support your $300 million claim? I'd be delighted to see it.

Shutdown Will Cost U.S. Economy $300 Million a Day, IHS Says - Bloomberg

The Costs of the Government Shutdown - ABC News

Government shutdown cost feds 6.6 million days of work - FederalNewsRadio.com

2013 IN REVIEW: Government Shutdown Temporarily Closes Local Historic Sites « CBS Philly

[spencgr]

[quote=Carlingtonian;32858240]That is just not true. Federal employees' salaries are fixed amounts and already obligated under the federal budget. It's no

That statement isn't logical unless you assume that the productivity of the federal workers actually has no value to the American public. Now other might feel that way, but I actually do feel there is a value....

Under your rationale, where because the salary is already paid for, there is no "cost", how many days can this go on? Is there no cost for 1 day? For 2 days? For 2 weeks? For two months? For two years? Where do you draw the line at value and cost?

[Carlingtonian]

Originally Posted by spencgr

That statement isn't logical unless you assume that the productivity of the federal workers actually has no value to the American public. Now other might feel that way, but I actually do feel there is a value....

Of course I believe we provide great value in return for our salaries. It just can't be quantified on an hourly basis--as your $300 million assertion claims. Whatever the cost of the salaried federal workforce, it's a cost that has already been budgeted for, already obligated. It's not as if snow day means we work some Saturday later in the year and get paid an extra 8 hours for that.

Originally Posted by spencgr

Under your rationale, where because the salary is already paid for, there is no "cost", how many days can this go on? Is there no cost for 1 day? For 2 days? For 2 weeks? For two months? For two years? Where do you draw the line at value and cost?

The "cost" of a snow day is not monetary. If there is a cost, it's a cost of time--and it's borne by the employees: If it's a busy period, they must find the time to get the work done. If the snow day is in a less-busy period (like now), it probably doesn't make much of a difference. To compare the occasional snow day to being off for two months or two years is a false comparison.

[spencgr]

Originally Posted by Carlingtonian

To compare the occasional snow day to being off for two months or two years is a false comparison.

But there has to be a point where it goes from the "occasional snow day" to where you feel it is meaningful. Two snow days, five, sixteen? If sixteen are meaningful, one has to be, too.

And while this may be a slow time for your area, I'm sure it is a very busy time for many other areas of other agencies. If not, why don't we propose a mandatory (unpaid) federal shut down for this time. If nothing is getting done, what are the taxpayers paying for?

So, should snow days reflect only who is busy at the time?

[Carlingtonian]

Originally Posted by spencgr

But there has to be a point where it goes from the "occasional snow day" to where you feel it is meaningful. Two snow days, five, sixteen? If sixteen are meaningful, one has to be, too.

One can easily scramble to make up for periods of idleness. Ever take a sick day? A vacation day?

Even with the week of shutdown we had in October, most of us scrambled and got the work done when we got back. Is there a duration of shutdown after which that wouldn't be possible--or would take so long to make up for that the year's output would be affected? Of course. Where that line is I don't think can easily be determined.

Originally Posted by spencgr

And while this may be a slow time for your area, I'm sure it is a very busy time for many other areas of other agencies. If not, why don't we propose a mandatory (unpaid) federal shut down for this time. If nothing is getting done, what are the taxpayers paying for?

Most of us are not hourly employees. We're not in a factory, making things that correlate to the number of hours worked. The work is in large part cognitive and has busy periods as well as slow periods. It waxes and wanes. That's why such positions are salaried; the person is paid to do what it takes to get the job done.

But even in the private sector--with a few exceptions, like retail and manufacturing--the period around Christmas and New Year's is usually slower.

[spencgr]

Originally Posted by Carlingtonian

But even in the private sector--with a few exceptions, like retail and manufacturing--the period around Christmas and New Year's is usually slower.

How many private companies closed down today due to the weather?