Should I challenge NLT moving violation for poor signage, or just pay? (Alexandria: school, DMV)

[revheck]

I received a moving violation ticket at 11am Memorial day for making a left hand turn from N. Washington St in Old Town Alexandria onto Montgomery Street. I turned from a dedicated left turn lane with a white arrow on the pavement pointed directly at Montgomery street. Posted above on the traffic light are two signs: one does indicate NO Left Turn (in small print "onto Montgomery Street"), but the other shows Left Turn (in small print "onto Powhatan St"). Powhattan St makes a 45 degree turn there.

If I had stopped and studied the signage carefully I would have realized that LHT onto Montgomery are not allowed. However, there are dozens of similar NLT signs posted on N. Washington St and all but this one say in small print "between 7-9 am weekdays" (meaning no lht during commuter rush, but otherwise allowed). I thought that was what the sign meant.

If I plead guilty and pay the $90 fine I get 2 points to added to my DMV record, which is what I want to avoid. I points just went back to 0 after my last speeding ticket dropped off after 3 years.

Will I get anywhere going to traffic court and pleading "not guilty" because of confusing signage? Or is that not valid excuse and I would just be wasting my time?

[jeff22152]

Admittedly, Alexandria has atrocious traffic signage, and you seemingly made an honest mistake at an odd intersection. MAYBE the traffic court will show some leniency, but I would expect to pay.

[spencgr]

If your time spent in traffic court is worth it to you, no harm trying.

[johnsonkk]

I'd argue that the signage is intended for business days and it was a holidays. School zones operate the same way and on non- school days, judges have dismissed tickets since the purpose of slowing down is for kids safety.

The reason for the restriction during 7-9 is to reduce road congestion of which is not an issue on holidays. What did the officer 👮 say?

[spencgr]

Originally Posted by johnsonkk

I'd argue that the signage is intended for business days and it was a holidays. School zones operate the same way and on non- school days, judges have dismissed tickets since the purpose of slowing down is for kids safety.

The reason for the restriction during 7-9 is to reduce road congestion of which is not an issue on holidays. What did the officer 👮 say?

The sign is not a 7-9 restriction. It's a 100% "no left turn" anytime sign.

[johnsonkk]

Originally Posted by spencgr

The sign is not a 7-9 restriction. It's a 100% "no left turn" anytime sign.

Then I retract my recommendation. I think the judge will ask how long the driver has been in NOVA and if more than a year, any feigned confusion will not end on a decision for the driver.

[boyd888]

Is that a new sign? I know that intersection and looked it up and the sign you were accused of violating doesn't exist on all angles of the street view so I feel like it must be newer. Probably why there was a cop there ticketing people too.

Personally I think it's a waste of time as you did violate the sign and will be found guilty. However, it is also your right to go court and complain at a judge/officer about the poor signage (that it is is misleading as it is not 7a-9a like other similar signs). The fine is already low, but it might get knocked down more to like $25.

Afterwards you can take the driver's improvement test for +5 points to get you into good territory. No point in doing it before court though.

[leavingwash]

If you have the time to go to court, it may be worthwhile. In some cases they will ask if you are concerned about the fine or the points...and since you are concerned about the points they may simply have you pay the fine and waive the points.

wouldn't hurt to be prepared with any info you can find on whether that is a new sign..

[gomason]

I know this intersection very well. I worked right around the corner and it took me months to realize that turn wasn't allowed. I would try the argument that you were confused, if youre going to try to fight it. Like it or not, the signs are there and I don't think they would accept a "poor signage" argument.

[boyd888]

Originally Posted by leavingwash

If you have the time to go to court, it may be worthwhile. In some cases they will ask if you are concerned about the fine or the points...and since you are concerned about the points they may simply have you pay the fine and waive the points.

Points are assessed by the DMV, not the court. The court can't "waive" points. The Judge usually mentions this in the opening statement of the session. They would have to convict you of a lesser charge that doesn't have points like defective equipment or something.