NOVA is the most unfriendly avoiding place I've ever lived (Norfolk: middle-class, renting)

[oneasterisk]

What's the big deal with old money and new money? Who cares! It spends the same...

[chariega]

Originally Posted by oneasterisk

What's the big deal with old money and new money? Who cares! It spends the same...

Not to get off topic, but to answer your post, while it may spend the same, the institutions and prestige related to wealth are short lived and superficial here compared to other parts of the state. The number of top earners there may not be as high, but the idea of prestige is created more so by old money.

Like I mentioned before, the salaries here may be high, but that doesn't necessarily equate to wealth, thus creating institutions and social constructs related to "old money." There are a lot of broke, paycheck to paycheck, six-figure earners here compared to elsewhere. <--Maybe that's what makes people seem unfriendly here to some

[JD984]

Originally Posted by chariega

Not to get off topic, but to answer your post, while it may spend the same, the institutions and prestige related to wealth are short lived and superficial here compared to other parts of the state. The number of top earners there may not be as high, but the idea of prestige is created more so by old money.

Like I mentioned before, the salaries here may be high, but that doesn't necessarily equate to wealth, thus creating institutions and social constructs related to "old money." There are a lot of broke, paycheck to paycheck, six-figure earners here compared to elsewhere. <--Maybe that's what makes people seem unfriendly here to some

I don't really buy this. There are plenty of wealthy people in NoVa, as measured by incomes and net worth, who are not living paycheck-to-paycheck. However, they are more likely to send their kids to local public schools, join the community pool and shop at Target, whereas in Richmond their wealth might be more obvious because they send their kids to the same private schools they attended and join a private "country club." As a result, the wealthy in Richmond have a pretty good handle on who has money, whereas NoVa is full of "millionaires next door" whose actual financial status is largely unknown to those around them. While more recently acquired, their wealth is no more ephemeral, and their friendliness (or lack thereof) is more likely a function of the pace of their daily lives than their balance sheet.

You end up broke when you don't prudently manage your personal finances. That could just as easily be the case for a six-figure earner in NoVa as for someone in Richmond who inherited money from a Phillip Morris executive.

[VTHokieFan]

Originally Posted by stpickrell

Hey, when I move to Loudoun County, do I get to be part of "real" Virginia again? Or is even Winchester tainted by the stain that is Northern Virginia?

West Loudoun is legit but once I-66 widens you get into NOVA.

[brattpowered]

Originally Posted by jimmycrapcorn

I want to know if anyone else has noticed this. I find the DC area and Northern Virginia in general to be pretty much the strangest coldest place I have ever lived. People dress like they've got big money in the city, but no one talks and nobody makes eye contact. Metro stations can be full of people who aren't talking, and the packed yet silent trains are eery sometimes. Everyone seems afraid of everyone else. I've noticed neighbors don't wave when you pass by. I have a Jeep, and nobody out here does the Jeep wave either. Everyone is an avoider unless they're in safe groups and I'm not sure what it's all about. People look right at you or start talking in other cities. Around here strangers seem really really uncomfortable if you try to say hello without provocation. Am I missing something? This is like living in an antisocial Stepford community.

I don't think this is a generalization, I think job opportunities aside, as far as human contact goes this feels like a bad place to live. I would LOVE to hear some opinions on why it's like this.. Too many foreign embassies, too much Intelligence, Miltary.. Too many CIA and FBI people? What?? What is WRONG with DC?

You just pass by too many people in such a small place to be able to say hi to anyone and start an impromptu hootenanny or ice cream social, or whatever your perfect interaction would be. Just think about how many people you pass by. Another thing is a level of suspicion that seems to be endemic in the urban Northeast (of which NoVa is a part of now). Everyone thinks everyone else is out to con them, and it may be true. It's the rat race.

[Caladium]

Originally Posted by chariega

Not to get off topic, but to answer your post, while it may spend the same, the institutions and prestige related to wealth are short lived and superficial here compared to other parts of the state.

Examples, please. I'm having a hard time buying this argument, too, since as far as I know Northern Virginia is building more cultural arts centers than Richmond is. We're building more libraries, theaters, concert halls, parks, and stadiums, too. Our institutions may be younger than Richmond's, but does that make them superficial? Plus, we're part of the DC metro area, so locals support and regularly attend events there. Surely you are not trying to claim Richmond has more museums than the Smithsonian.

As for being short lived, more cultural institutions have failed in Richmond than here. That's not a diss on Richmond--that's part of being an older city--but the point is if our institutions have not failed, how can you call them short lived?

Originally Posted by chariega

There are a lot of broke, paycheck to paycheck, six-figure earners here compared to elsewhere. <--Maybe that's what makes people seem unfriendly here to some

There are? Maybe some, but actually, since we have such a healthy economy, I think we have fewer than most other cities. Most people I know seem to be doing really well. If we're so broke, how come you see so many long term residents here shopping for additional or bigger pieces of property?

[chariega]

Originally Posted by Caladium

Examples, please. What I see is that Northern Virginia is building more cultural arts centers than Richmond is. We're building more libraries, theaters, concert halls, parks, and stadiums, too. Our institutions may be younger than Richmond's, but I would hardly call them superficial. And more cultural institutions have failed in Richmond than here. That's not a diss on Richmond--it tends to happen in an older city--the point is if our institutions have not failed, how can you call them short lived?



There are? Maybe some, but actually I think we have fewer than most other cities. Most people I know seem to be doing really well. If we're so broke, how come you see so many long term residents here shopping for additional or bigger pieces of property?

Increased building here is more a function of population more than anything. More people, more places to entertain them. The same things are or have in recent years gone up in Richmond especially in the Fan, Carytown and Shockoe Bottom; shopping, restaurants, etc. on the southside (Stony Point) and west end (Short Pump) with plans to build further west into Goochland. Richmond has grown tremendously since I was a kid. We can only see if the growth you mentioned here will translate into traditions for an area as transient as this as compared to someplace else where the traditions and institutions have existed for decades maybe centuries...


On broke DC area people...people may not be poor but they're not rich...Put it this way, just because the salaries are higher here, doesn't mean people are wealthy, especially when most of that money is used to pay for the increased cost of living, expensive toys, etc.--and not necessarily used to BUILD wealth or even translate that salary into traditions as it is in areas where people are really wealthy (i.e., schools, clubs, etc. in NY, MA, LA, Chicago). 100K salary is middle class here and is not rich. If that wasn't the case, wealth and prestige would exist in larger areas of the region beside small parts of Bethesda, DC and Great Falls. I don't consider buying a $600K 2,500 square foot house in Aldie on a 7,000 sq. ft plot of land wealthy. For this area, that's middle class.

I say all that to say this: Anyone can "claim" to be wealthy here, but buying expensive things or overspending on homes, doesn't make it so. To me, the true wealth just isn't here as it pertains to prestige, tradition and old money for other Virginians to be remotely jealous of Northern Virginia's "money."

[Cardiff Kook]

Originally Posted by VTHokieFan

West Loudoun is legit but once I-66 widens you get into NOVA.

I'm confused

[chariega]

Originally Posted by GMUAlum08

I'm confused

me too, especially since 66 doesn't even go through Loudoun County...

[Caladium]

Originally Posted by chariega

I say all that to say this: Anyone can "claim" to be wealthy here, but buying expensive things or overspending on homes, doesn't make it so. To me, the true wealth just isn't here as it pertains to prestige, tradition and old money for other Virginians to be remotely jealous of Northern Virginia's "money."

LOL, indeed--anyone with lots of money can claim to be wealthy. That is the defining characteristic of the word, after all.

It's ok by me if you want to define "wealth" as meaning "prestige and tradition" but the dictionary disagrees. It defines it like this:

Wealth. Noun.
1. a great quantity or store of money, valuable possessions, property, or other riches: the wealth of a city.
2. an abundance or profusion of anything; plentiful amount: a wealth of imagery.
3. Economics .
a. all things that have a monetary or exchange value.
b. anything that has utility and is capable of being appropriated or exchanged.
4. rich or valuable contents or produce: the wealth of the soil.
5. the state of being rich; prosperity; affluence: persons of wealth and standing.

I see the words "money" rich" and "economics" mentioned several times in the above, but not "prestige and tradition"

You may not want to hear this, but when I hear someone saying something snooty like the quote above, my reaction is "Holy cow, now that person is really jealous." But hey, it's ok by me. If people in Richmond want to look down their noses at "new money" I'm happy to keep all our "not prestigious enough" new money up here and not send it to Richmond.

Ooops, there I go being one of those rude Nova people again. How boorish that we don't know our place!