Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I have been seeing Portage all over the local news consistently for the past couple years now. And the majority of it has not been good news at all. I personally believe that Portage is going downhill. Others may not. What do you think, and WHY do you think this could be happening? I constantly hear people referring to Portage as "East Gary" or "New Gary" or the like. While I do not believe Portage has reached "Gary status" yet, I would still like to get the opinion of people who either currently live in Portage or live in nearby towns like Chesterton, and Valparaiso on what they feel about Portage. Thanks!
(Also, the reason I am asking this question is not to bash on Portage, but to just get an honest idea of what is really going on there.)
Some components to consider:
1. Schools (quality at each level - elementary, middle, high)
It's nowhere near Gary ... but it has definitely been sliding downwards over the last decade. BUT .... what Portage does have in its favor is a large segment of the population who believe in their town and do everything possible to stop the slide.
Schools ... aren't that hot and are getting worse. Schools are ALWAYS key to maintaining a good community & property values ... unfortunately for Portage, I think that the best the town can hope for it to maintain the level it's at now. I don't see it ever improving.
Housing stock ... varied but lacks high end subdivisions like Chesterton & Valpo have.
Shopping ... no high end stores, but truthfully, I find those over rated anyway. I'd rather shop at a local farmer's market than a Whole Foods any day.
Safety ... it's not a high crime area by any means. The riff raff that does exist is mainly of the young punk variety. (Like those POS kids who tortured girls on the school bus.) And there are crappier areas ... and not so crappy areas.
Affordability ... It's definitely affordable. But I get where you're going with this line of questioning. There will always be poor, middle class & rich ... and everyone needs somewhere to live.
As usual, I can always count on a very well written and thoughtful response! Thanks! I really am trying to find out what was going on with Portage.
A few years ago, a family I know were selling their home in Munster so that they could move into a much bigger and newer home for much less money in Portage. Their other reason was because they said that "Munster would inevitably 'change' due to its surroundings"...I then stated that if Munster were to have "turned for the worst", it probably would have happened 20 years ago...They ignored me...5 years later, they are selling their house and moving back to MUNSTER! They are very lucky that they not only were able to sell their home in Portage but also are not really losing any money because of the profit they made on their original Munster sale...but this whole ordeal brought up a huge question: Is the trend of towns going downhill actually heading east into places like Portage and Hobart? Many people think that due to some of the South Suburbs, places like Munster, Dyer, and Schererville would eventually go downhill as well. But it seems that the opposite is actually happening and that these towns are gaining much higher income families and becoming more affluent. It seems as though many of the families (esp. section 8 ones) who are moving from the south suburbs are now skipping most of Lake County all together and heading into Porter county where the section 8 residences are MUCH newer and in much better shape...I would be curious to hear from people who moved from Lake county to Portage and see what they think.
As usual, I can always count on a very well written and thoughtful response! Thanks! I really am trying to find out what was going on with Portage.
A few years ago, a family I know were selling their home in Munster so that they could move into a much bigger and newer home for much less money in Portage. Their other reason was because they said that "Munster would inevitably 'change' due to its surroundings"...I then stated that if Munster were to have "turned for the worst", it probably would have happened 20 years ago...They ignored me...5 years later, they are selling their house and moving back to MUNSTER! They are very lucky that they not only were able to sell their home in Portage but also are not really losing any money because of the profit they made on their original Munster sale...but this whole ordeal brought up a huge question: Is the trend of towns going downhill actually heading east into places like Portage and Hobart? Many people think that due to some of the South Suburbs, places like Munster, Dyer, and Schererville would eventually go downhill as well. But it seems that the opposite is actually happening and that these towns are gaining much higher income families and becoming more affluent. It seems as though many of the families (esp. section 8 ones) who are moving from the south suburbs are now skipping most of Lake County all together and heading into Porter county where the section 8 residences are MUCH newer and in much better shape...I would be curious to hear from people who moved from Lake county to Portage and see what they think.
I actually posted on the Chicago suburbs board recently relating to the questionyou posed in red. The specific question I responded to was "how long until Munster Dyer and Lowell turn for the worse..". I responded with:
"Although your question includes Dyer and Lowell, for argument's sake you can include St. John and Munster into that question as well, since they all essentially border Illinois. I think these towns will stave off a big downturn that you're suggesting due to Southern Chicago residents pushing south/east.
There's a few reasons I have for thinking this way. First, the property values really aren't that low in these areas. They may be low compared to a similar area of Chicagoland suburbs, but compared to towns like Lansing, Ford Heights, Chicago Heights, Sauk Village, etc they aren't low. Also, there's an interesting barrier between Illinois and Indiana. Part of it may be because there is a Forest Preserve at the state border, but in actuality much of the riff raff from the aforementioned Illinois towns aren't seen much in these Indiana towns. They generally seem to stay in Illinois. Lastly, and this is kind of sad to admit, but the white flight in NWI has basically resulted in a highly concentrated area of desirable towns that middle to upper class people in NWI want to live in. People have been pushed south away from East Chicago and Hammond, and south/west to get away from Gary. This has resulted in Munster, Dyer, St. John, Schererville, and Crown Point (you may toss in Lowell too - but thats' pretty far south) being basically the towns where the educated people with good jobs reside. Essentially what I'm saying is that, there's no place else for them to "flee" to if they want to stay in NWI and near Chicago. This therefore will keep property values at respectable levels and keep riff raff out of the nicer NWI towns. It'll be interesting to monitor this in the coming years and decades though."
Therefore, to answer your question Northwest Indiana, I believe the answer is yes. Riff raff won't be able to love into these nicer towns due to the reasons I listed above, and will be essentially forced east to Portage and Hobart.
Last edited by svillechris; 09-05-2010 at 02:08 PM..
Keeping it real, the only reason people say portage is getting worse is because the other races moving into the area. In some instance it's true but other races are not the only ones making our city bad.I am a black american, a working man, believe in my Lord and savior and soon as I moved into my house I have never seen how fast the for sale signs that were posted on lawns. It made me feel discouraged but all I can do is show my light.I believe if we keep our city a buy and not rent, lesser apartment town. Also minimize local government help like section8.
Well I'm driving to walmart yesterday and I notice a crowd of people standing around in the cold. Now being from the streets either your waiting on a ride or waiting to sell dope and where are they from theses apartments yea, the ones by sunset lounge. I've heard of people having their houses broken in, vandalized that live close to these apartments.I tell you what I like to become the dark knight for one day. This is why i say less apartments in portage because girls move in and bring their ghetto boyfriends and his friends into the nieghborhood or vise versa.Apartments in this area are to cheap for the riff raffs to get. We need to go back to my parents days you see a kid get out of line you spank them then their parents get them. Where are the parents for these kids.DO YOUR JOB!
Keeping it real, the only reason people say portage is getting worse is because the other races moving into the area. In some instance it's true but other races are not the only ones making our city bad.I am a black american, a working man, believe in my Lord and savior and soon as I moved into my house I have never seen how fast the for sale signs that were posted on lawns. It made me feel discouraged but all I can do is show my light.I believe if we keep our city a buy and not rent, lesser apartment town. Also minimize local government help like section8.
Race alone may be the reason for some to form such an opinion -- The unfortunate reality is that racism still exists in NWI and the country as a whole. But I think for most, the perception that schools are declining and crime is increasing is what fuels the sentiment that Portage is going downhill. The result is these cases is usually declining property values, and then it often just turns into a downward spiral. Myself and other posters don't really think that Portage is there yet, but I think it needs some work before it can turn around. The new mayor just got elected so we'll see what his plans are.
Either way, whether a city goes "downhill" does not necessarily relate to race. There are potentially dozens of other factors that come into play. NWI in general is becoming more and more diverse racially, but not all of NWI is turning into "Gary/Hammond/E. Chicago". There are just so many other variables. (E.g. Class, municipal administration or mis-administration, diversity of industry, etc.) Chuckity in a prior post mentioned a few other factors.
There have been numerous discussions about the race/class/crime nexus this on the subforum, but you're really talking about a far broader sociological issue that is discussed in far more detail on other forums such as Politics and Other Controversies, Great Debates, and Crime and Punishment, et. al
I only said these things because I have heard it from the horses mouth sort of speaking. Even my neighbors I over heard speaking on this matter but like you said prejudice & racism is another issue. We as a community can not turn the other way when we see these things as if it's not our business," let the government figure it out "some would say,half the mess were in is because of them letting things go so far.I only say it's not bad coming from where I use to live and I attend to keep it up and do my part.
You only have to review a few of the recent crime reports to confirm Portage is going down the commode. Within a period of 10 days there was a bank robbery and attempted parking lot robbery near the intersection of Lute Rd and Willocreek. Yes, minorities responsible for both crimes.
Does anyone recall Miller, Atnea....and even Gary in the 60's? They were decent communities for the most part. We took the South Shore from Ogden Dunes to downtown Gary frequently for the movies. Flashforward 40 years: Last year a homeless person was raped at the Miller South Shore station (and later the victim of a fatal hit-and-run) by a minority residing in Atnea. Atnea was a typical middle class community back then, but subsequent to white flight has become just another eyesore.
I purchased my first set of snow tires at the Firestone on Rt20 in 1970. 40 years later I returned and found an employee panic button on the exterior of the building while I waited for my vehicle to be serviced. The minority employee was so beligerent and hostile he was reported to corporate. They ultimately compensated me several hundred dollars for poor service and other factors.
Merrillville became a city in 1971 with many residents of Gary fleeing South. 40 years later the tide has changed. Crown Point is the new Merrillville for those seeking peace of mind.
Last year I met a Portage resident also having his car serviced at a dealership on Rt30. He was very relieved to learn Chicago did not win the bid for the Olympics. Why? He realized the related development of the south side would result in the displacement of minority residents into NW Indiana.
For those who disagree with my observations; I would welcome anyone to name any area or city that did not deteriorate as a result of increased minority population and/or white flight. I have lived in Valpo for the past 5 years and can see the writing on the wall. 10 or 15 years from now it will probably be necessary to relocate, despite the fact this small congregation of homes is isolated from the city, benefitting from a single entrance/exit and surrounded by woods.
I go to Portage all the time and see no signs of it being Gary.
I frequently go to the Wal-Mart, Lowes, etc.. . . and all I see is plenty of business like Aldi, etc. . .
Gary is Gary because there's nothing here.
Portage still has Home Depots and big box stores and stuff that you just don't have in Gary.
Just because a few minorities are moving in doesn't mean you're on your way to becoming a gang town.
Now, if you have corrupt city government, only one industry that is no longer employing most people, a crumbling infrastructure, underfunded schools, and corrupt police department, THEN you can be like Gary, until then, you're just in a little funk.
Quote:
Originally Posted by m rebate
You only have to review a few of the recent crime reports to confirm Portage is going down the commode. Within a period of 10 days there was a bank robbery and attempted parking lot robbery near the intersection of Lute Rd and Willocreek. Yes, minorities responsible for both crimes.
Does anyone recall Miller, Atnea....and even Gary in the 60's? They were decent communities for the most part. We took the South Shore from Ogden Dunes to downtown Gary frequently for the movies. Flashforward 40 years: Last year a homeless person was raped at the Miller South Shore station (and later the victim of a fatal hit-and-run) by a minority residing in Atnea. Atnea was a typical middle class community back then, but subsequent to white flight has become just another eyesore.
I purchased my first set of snow tires at the Firestone on Rt20 in 1970. 40 years later I returned and found an employee panic button on the exterior of the building while I waited for my vehicle to be serviced. The minority employee was so beligerent and hostile he was reported to corporate. They ultimately compensated me several hundred dollars for poor service and other factors.
Merrillville became a city in 1971 with many residents of Gary fleeing South. 40 years later the tide has changed. Crown Point is the new Merrillville for those seeking peace of mind.
Last year I met a Portage resident also having his car serviced at a dealership on Rt30. He was very relieved to learn Chicago did not win the bid for the Olympics. Why? He realized the related development of the south side would result in the displacement of minority residents into NW Indiana.
For those who disagree with my observations; I would welcome anyone to name any area or city that did not deteriorate as a result of increased minority population and/or white flight. I have lived in Valpo for the past 5 years and can see the writing on the wall. 10 or 15 years from now it will probably be necessary to relocate, despite the fact this small congregation of homes is isolated from the city, benefitting from a single entrance/exit and surrounded by woods.
So, what are you saying?
Just come out and make your bigoted claims that Blacks and Latinos = crime.
Look, Gary was a one industry town that went down, therefore the tax base eroded, when the tax base eroded, the schools, the police force, and all infrastructure eroded.
Since White people had ALL of the money and power, they were able to flee the sinking ship, but minorities who had been discriminated against since 1906, when Gary was born had no such luck, they had to stay in a city that was dependent on an industry that was gone, live in houses who's property value had gone down, and send their kids to schools that were crumbling. Of course out of that you're going to get crime.
People who make the race = crime argument completely ignore the social context of the entire thing. People used to make those same arguments against the Irish, Italians, and Jews before they became White in American terms, when really it was just that they had been ostracized and vilified communities who had been denied opportunities, becoming resentful of a society that has always discriminated against them.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Chuckity...Thanks!
