Moving to Oahu with 2 young teens - neighborhood/schools question (Honolulu: how much, hotels)

[ToulaHawaiiBound]

I guess it depends on where you are coming from as to whether $500,000 seems like a lot of money. Here in Silicon Valley, in the town where we live you wouldn't get a house for less than $1mil so when we look at Hawaii prices we feel like we are getting a bargain.

I have read a lot about the locals in Hawaii being frustrated at mainlanders pushing prices up, but the truth is we could never afford to buy here in Silicon Valley, everything is out of our reach, in the areas where we would want to live.

[Jonah K]

Originally Posted by pansygal

We will be starting our own business, so we'd be self employed. But we would definitely not be able to afford $30K (total/year) for private school. That is just crazy money.

For some reason, starting a small business in Hawai'i and not being able to afford an extra $30K/year to send one's kids to a private school raises a "red flag" for me.

There are plenty of people that come to Hawai'i with dreams of starting a successful business. Some succeed, but most fail. Unless one's done their research and thoroughly understands the nexus between business and politics here, starting a business can somewhat onerous. Here's a link to an article in "Hawaii Business" magazine that might be somewhat enlightening...
Pro-Business Legislators - Hawaii Business - September 2010 - Hawaii

[Yankeemama]

The high school in Hawaii Kai, Kaiser High is o.k. but Haole kids from the mainland are still going to have a hard time in Hawaii Kai. Does the O.P. know about furlough fridays? Moving to Hawaii is not like moving from one state to another state on the Mainland. Heed these peoples' advice.

[survivorqt]

furlough fridays for schools are over

[LoveSummer7]

Originally Posted by Jonah K

For some reason, starting a small business in Hawai'i and not being able to afford an extra $30K/year to send one's kids to a private school raises a "red flag" for me.

Regarding the 30k per year for school, the only people I know for whom that would be considered "affordable" are the rich.

Any middle class person I know would have to think really long and hard about whether they could afford to spend that amount of money per year on schooling. I think that's one of the reasons why so many of us with kids have to think long and hard about whether or not moving to Hawaii would be good for our families...

Does this mean that unless you are truly wealthy you shouldn't bother moving to Hawaii with kids?

What does that mean for all of the middle class families who cannot afford private school already living in Hawaii? Are their kids mostly doomed to not be able to get into college or University because they didn't attend private school? Are kids in public schools doomed even if they have parents who are highly involved in their education?

I'm not intending to put blinders on here or ignore all the warnings being given... but just trying to understand how any middle class caucasian family with kids in public schools in Hawaii has a chance to make it?

[Yankeemama]

I think Iolani and Punahou are about 20,000 dollars a year tuition or around that amount. Good luck getting your kids in from the Mainland. Yes, condos in Hawaii Kai can be found for $500,000. but not a lot of square footage and steep taxes as well as steep condo fees. Some of the schools are decent but not great compared to comparable areas on the mainland. You pay a lot to live on Oahu but you don't get that much in the way of education esp. for the amount of taxes you will property taxes. Honolulu is one of the most expensive cities in the U.S. so why do people assume a middle class family can just up and move to such an expensive place without high paying jobs lined up. Hawaii Kai is one of the most expensive places on Oahu. I am not trying to be rude but when has kids, moving thousands of miles away w/o family to fall back on seems unwise. Also, middle class local families DO struggle and many have to move off island but remember many local families have family that can help out. Many families on Oahu live in multi-generational dwellings. Also, most people will not use the word Caucasian and there is actually a thread on this forum discussing that exact topic. I would advise that you check it out. I DO wish you and hour family the best in finding a place to live. Please do a lot of research in regards to Oahu.

[Yankeemama]

Sorry for all of the typos. My Ipad changes spelling and I don't always catch it.

[LoveSummer7]

Originally Posted by Yankeemama

Honolulu is one of the most expensive cities in the U.S. so why do people assume a middle class family can just up and move to such an expensive place without high paying jobs lined up.

You are right on about that... But keep in mind that there is a range of middle class incomes:

ex. an upper middle class family with an income of 100k plus, moving over with 450k cash from selling say, 3 properties on the mainland (ex. their home that they live in now, plus 2 properties that were purchased as investments and were rented out)
vs. a lower middle class family with an income of 40k and no cash...

But even that upper middle class family will have to take on a small mortgage to purchase a home even close to what they had back home, and will now have to start from scratch in saving for retirement because whatever they had accumulated on the mainland went towards buying a much more expensive home in Hawaii, plus any leftover cash was kept unspent and available in case of unexpected expenses... SO, even the upper middle class family will find 20-30k per year in tuition a lot of money when they were hoping to utilize that money to save for future retirement.

Not saying anyone should feel sorry for the upper middle class example here, but wanted to point out that one shouldn't assume that just because someone balks as 20-30k per year tuition that means they are destitute dreamers.

Originally Posted by Yankeemama

Hawaii Kai is one of the most expensive places on Oahu. I am not trying to be rude but when has kids, moving thousands of miles away w/o family to fall back on seems unwise.

It all depends on how much one has saved up I suppose.

Originally Posted by Yankeemama

Also, most people will not use the word Caucasian and there is actually a thread on this forum discussing that exact topic. I would advise that you check it out.

Saw that thread ages ago... yes... Haole is the term you are referring to no doubt. No problem with the use of that term, but since it isn't used here where I live now, and heck, I'm still here, not in Hawaii, I didn't think to use that term in my post. I would no doubt use the word Haole much more if I already lived in Hawaii.

As for pansygal who wants to start a business in Hawaii, we don't know how much they have in savings... for all we know they will be just fine. She asked "What type of discrimination would my haole children likely encounter in a middle class public school, such as in Hawaii Kai?" and the majority of your comments had nothing to do whatsoever with her very reasonable question.

I just get my back up when I see people here inquire about moving and then be treated like irresponsible children on these forums for daring to inquire about moving to Hawaii. There are many posters here who seem to honestly want to help... they very kindly answer the questions being asked by mainlanders WITHOUT throwing in a lecture. But others here seem to have nothing better to do than reprimand people. (Not singling you out specifically Yankeemama.. haven't read enough of your past posts to make a judgement call on that... but there are some posters here, who shall remain nameless, who are guilty of that over and over again.)

[Jonah K]

Originally Posted by LoveSummer7

Regarding the 30k per year for school, the only people I know for whom that would be considered "affordable" are the rich.

Any middle class person I know would have to think really long and hard about whether they could afford to spend that amount of money per year on schooling. I think that's one of the reasons why so many of us with kids have to think long and hard about whether or not moving to Hawaii would be good for our families...

Does this mean that unless you are truly wealthy you shouldn't bother moving to Hawaii with kids?

What does that mean for all of the middle class families who cannot afford private school already living in Hawaii? Are their kids mostly doomed to not be able to get into college or University because they didn't attend private school? Are kids in public schools doomed even if they have parents who are highly involved in their education?

I'm not intending to put blinders on here or ignore all the warnings being given... but just trying to understand how any middle class caucasian family with kids in public schools in Hawaii has a chance to make it?

Many of the private schools in Hawai'i provide need-based financial aid to qualified students. If one applies in a timely fashion, money is available.
Punahou School: Financial Aid
Iolani School - Financial Aid

While many of the public schools in Hawai'i are mediocre (or worse), some of them are quite good. Every year, Honolulu Magazine publishes a comprehensive report that "grades" them. Here's a link...
Grading the Public Schools: The 2010 Grades - Honolulu Magazine - May 2010 - Hawaii

For the most part, every student that graduates from high school in Hawai'i won't get into Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Stanford, or UC Berkeley. However, there are plenty of institutions of higher learning out there and the local colleges and universities in Hawai'i are perfectly adequate for many people.

Middle-class families in Hawai'i "make it" all of the time; however, their standard of living is often lower than middle-class families in other states - it's called the "price of paradise." Eighteen years ago, the "Price of Paradise" was the title of a two-volume collection of essays about issues that Hawai'i residents face. Sadly, those essays are still relevant today. Here are links to the PDFs of each volume...
The Price of Paradise, Volume I
The Price of Paradise, Volume II

[Dr. Vox]

^ In a nutshell, if you can't afford(or don't want to pay) for Punahou or Iolani, then its best to stay where you are. Again, finacial aid is there for families who qualify and whose students pass the SSAT. I would advise you to go to your local bookstore and get a book that covers the SSAT(check out amazon.com) for review. Finally, if you aren;t willing tio shell out for either of those schools, and you don't want to send them to Pacific Buddhist Academy(around $800 a a mon th tuition), then I would say its best not to come to Oahu at the present time.