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Old 07-29-2016, 01:07 PM
 
Location: Jacksonville, FL
11,155 posts, read 14,694,093 times
Reputation: 7136

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Quote:
Originally Posted by nmnita View Post
I am still wondering what it is about Pine Bluff that you find attractive? It has high crime as you have mentioned, is a small town that probably wouldn't be very receptive to your sexual orientation, there are almost no jobs, so being highly educated I wonder what you would do for a living and the entire town is minority or almost. Would this make you feel at all out of place? It might make some people uncomfortable.
For some reason, I'm attracted to non-pretentious, non-high-growth places. I'm an "off the beaten path" kind of person. I don't like places that are considered popular, either.
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Old 07-29-2016, 03:16 PM
 
Location: Cushing OK
14,545 posts, read 18,207,281 times
Reputation: 16829
I moved from socal, and high heat and smog and rush everywhere. The smog made it hard to breath, the heat I was used to as I was born into it, and the rush was very tiresome. When I came to visit a friend who'd moved to Cushing, it was so amazing and wonderful that the sky was blue and the air wasn't visible. I took short walks at home since I got too short of breath.

I then discovered the cost of houses. Next year I moved here.

Its been a huge adjustment. But I was never one to like and embrase the hurry up mantra in socal. And I love the relative calm and we'll get to it mantra here. And I have a small house for the cost of rent for a small apartment. I even like the storms. It's hot here during summer, but maybe thanks to livinging in one of the hottest valleys out there (Riverside sbd) and the smoggiest in the whole country, the heat here doesn't seem near as bad as some make it to be.

Culturally, I'm just staying me. Me had decided it was time to quit running the race, and that things are slow and it may take forever to get stuff done is only occasionally frustrating. I still want a car, and with transportation I could connect with the pagan group in OKC and other interests I feel isolated from. But general life is so much more calming and comfortable I can accept the cost.

I have been much happier living here than schrunced up in my apartment amid grey smelly air. Today we have phones so you can keep in touch with friends. If you find you don't then maybe they weren't real friends. I do my hobbies like yarn art and don't feel like I should be doing something better. I'll never 'fit in' like a native, but then I didn't in California anymore.

Some of us grew up in socal back when it was slower, friendlier and not so much in a hurry, and where people didn't reject houses because they didn't have the perfect open kitchen or (horrors) ONE bathroom and everything didn't feel 'small'. I've got a nice yard, absolutely beautiful trees, and a house that's older than me and with charm, and even have come to like the changes in weather.

You have to understand that when you move, no matter how perfect the place, it will mean you have to adjust, but sometimes that's the best part because you do feel like a new start.
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Old 07-29-2016, 08:16 PM
 
32,738 posts, read 18,185,279 times
Reputation: 35405
Quote:
Originally Posted by StillwaterTownie View Post
Really, though, by far, the biggest reasons why people hate college towns are due to the lack of decent paying jobs as well as limited shopping and too few good restaurants. Many people aren't impressed by fast food outlets all over the place.
I am!!! That is what I miss since we live near a small town. No Whataburger, no Taco Bell, no Carl's Jr., nothing except McD and Sonic. I am sick of those.

Yes, Nightbird, I left in 88 and never looked back. It's not for me. Besides, the city I was from is completely different. We ended up moving to the Inland Empire just to get away from the constant b.s., good riddance. I have no compulsion to going back. Not even for a visit.

Okay, nep321, enjoy your stay in Pine Bluff and let us know how it goes.
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Old 07-29-2016, 10:08 PM
 
5,980 posts, read 5,514,210 times
Reputation: 18329
I lived in both AR (was so miserable there and hated it) and OK (liked it very much.) So that's the basis for my opinions.

Oklahoma is environmentally VERY beautiful, and the population in most areas is comfortably low. It is a beautiful place for a vacation!

Unfortunately, it's also true that Eastern Oklahoma and Arkansas are socioculturally in the twilight zone. Social and cultural lives in the small towns there are ruled by churches that are anti-education and anti-environment. For all the constant proclamation of "Christian" values, many if not most people there smoke and drink too much, trash their yards and towns up, and express a lot of hate towards those who are not like them. The meth problem in that area is VERY bad. When I lived in Ft. Smith, Poteau was well known for being a center for drug trafficking. I personally saw a very close correlation between the religious fundamentalism and the alcohol and drug abuse and domestic violence.

If you are someone who would want to say in public that you believe in evolution and global warming, you probably would not be accepted into the social and cultural life of any small town in that area.

On the other hand, if you are apolitical and just want to talk about regular things like food or your garden or the wildlife, you'll get along fine. Or if you just want to mostly be on your own and don't expect to have close local friendships with like-minded people, you'll be fine. I enjoyed my time in Oklahoma. I lived in a cute little house by a creek in a small town, and my neighbors were lovely people. I got along socially by just avoiding discussing politics and religion and keeping my mouth shut when people were proclaiming their love for Jim Inhofe (seriously, look him up). I felt a little like an anthropologist or a time traveler ! Getting some distance from my experience there, though, I realize how lonely I was then.

I traveled a lot for work in OK. These are some small towns in eastern OK that I remember liking: Oolagah, Miami, Grove, Wagoner, Eufala, Talihina, Hugo, Tishomingo, and Sulphur. I still wish that I had bought land in Sulphur! Guthrie, which is on the northern edge of the OKC metro area, is really nice and probably more "progressive" than many other towns.

The further west you go in OK, the less dominant the fundamentalists are, and Western OK has a beauty all it's own.
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Old 07-29-2016, 10:23 PM
 
Location: Texas
71 posts, read 67,475 times
Reputation: 133
Quote:
Yeah but I was there two weeks ago and was impressed. It was a peaceful, low key area. Not one of those places where you see people and crowds, which I can't stand. I like quiet and I don't like people. Therefore, I like Pine Bluff. And I think the city has a bright future.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nep321 View Post
For some reason, I'm attracted to non-pretentious, non-high-growth places. I'm an "off the beaten path" kind of person. I don't like places that are considered popular, either.
No joke OP, I think you are looking for a place more like Cheyenne Wyoming. I seriously love Wyoming, though I'm not sure I could live there year round myself. Maybe Casper too, but I haven't been there to confirm. If you ever get an itch for some city amenities you can just hit the highway straight south to Denver.
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Old 07-30-2016, 05:03 AM
 
Location: Bella Vista, Ark
74,850 posts, read 87,256,121 times
Reputation: 45417
Quote:
Originally Posted by nightbird47 View Post
I moved from socal, and high heat and smog and rush everywhere. The smog made it hard to breath, the heat I was used to as I was born into it, and the rush was very tiresome. When I came to visit a friend who'd moved to Cushing, it was so amazing and wonderful that the sky was blue and the air wasn't visible. I took short walks at home since I got too short of breath.

I then discovered the cost of houses. Next year I moved here.

Its been a huge adjustment. But I was never one to like and embrase the hurry up mantra in socal. And I love the relative calm and we'll get to it mantra here. And I have a small house for the cost of rent for a small apartment. I even like the storms. It's hot here during summer, but maybe thanks to livinging in one of the hottest valleys out there (Riverside sbd) and the smoggiest in the whole country, the heat here doesn't seem near as bad as some make it to be.

Culturally, I'm just staying me. Me had decided it was time to quit running the race, and that things are slow and it may take forever to get stuff done is only occasionally frustrating. I still want a car, and with transportation I could connect with the pagan group in OKC and other interests I feel isolated from. But general life is so much more calming and comfortable I can accept the cost.

I have been much happier living here than schrunced up in my apartment amid grey smelly air. Today we have phones so you can keep in touch with friends. If you find you don't then maybe they weren't real friends. I do my hobbies like yarn art and don't feel like I should be doing something better. I'll never 'fit in' like a native, but then I didn't in California anymore.

Some of us grew up in socal back when it was slower, friendlier and not so much in a hurry, and where people didn't reject houses because they didn't have the perfect open kitchen or (horrors) ONE bathroom and everything didn't feel 'small'. I've got a nice yard, absolutely beautiful trees, and a house that's older than me and with charm, and even have come to like the changes in weather.

You have to understand that when you move, no matter how perfect the place, it will mean you have to adjust, but sometimes that's the best part because you do feel like a new start.
Sounds like you are moving with an open mind, the right attitude and realize you will need to make adjustments. The worst thing about moving for so many, is relocating and then wanting everything the way it used to be: you know the type, the ones who say, well, where I lived last time we had this or that.
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Old 07-30-2016, 05:15 AM
 
Location: Bella Vista, Ark
74,850 posts, read 87,256,121 times
Reputation: 45417
Quote:
Originally Posted by 601halfdozen0theother View Post
I lived in both AR (was so miserable there and hated it) and OK (liked it very much.) So that's the basis for my opinions.

Oklahoma is environmentally VERY beautiful, and the population in most areas is comfortably low. It is a beautiful place for a vacation!

Unfortunately, it's also true that Eastern Oklahoma and Arkansas are socioculturally in the twilight zone. Social and cultural lives in the small towns there are ruled by churches that are anti-education and anti-environment. For all the constant proclamation of "Christian" values, many if not most people there smoke and drink too much, trash their yards and towns up, and express a lot of hate towards those who are not like them. The meth problem in that area is VERY bad. When I lived in Ft. Smith, Poteau was well known for being a center for drug trafficking. I personally saw a very close correlation between the religious fundamentalism and the alcohol and drug abuse and domestic violence.

If you are someone who would want to say in public that you believe in evolution and global warming, you probably would not be accepted into the social and cultural life of any small town in that area.

On the other hand, if you are apolitical and just want to talk about regular things like food or your garden or the wildlife, you'll get along fine. Or if you just want to mostly be on your own and don't expect to have close local friendships with like-minded people, you'll be fine. I enjoyed my time in Oklahoma. I lived in a cute little house by a creek in a small town, and my neighbors were lovely people. I got along socially by just avoiding discussing politics and religion and keeping my mouth shut when people were proclaiming their love for Jim Inhofe (seriously, look him up). I felt a little like an anthropologist or a time traveler ! Getting some distance from my experience there, though, I realize how lonely I was then.

I traveled a lot for work in OK. These are some small towns in eastern OK that I remember liking: Oolagah, Miami, Grove, Wagoner, Eufala, Talihina, Hugo, Tishomingo, and Sulphur. I still wish that I had bought land in Sulphur! Guthrie, which is on the northern edge of the OKC metro area, is really nice and probably more "progressive" than many other towns.

The further west you go in OK, the less dominant the fundamentalists are, and Western OK has a beauty all it's own.
glad you liked OK better than AR but think you might be in the minority. Our granddaughter, hubby and girls moved from Ok to AR because they liked it here so much better. Of course they do have a problem in the fall It is called love for OU while living near Fayetteville.

You mention some of the small towns in NE Ok. And you also talk about Ft Smith being like living in a time machine: we spent a couple days house hunting and researching places like Grove and Miami, they were way to small town, old fashion for us and we are pretty conservative in many ways.

I don't know how many years ago you lived in Ft Smith, I think I have asked you this before when you have
posted negatives about AR, but you might be surprised how it has changed.

I will say, to you and to the OP, no place is right for everyone; some of what you say is true, most is an over exaggeration of life here. Again it depends on what you want out of life.
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Old 07-30-2016, 12:05 PM
 
Location: United States of Jerry Falwell
11,412 posts, read 5,038,465 times
Reputation: 9279
Quote:
Originally Posted by 601halfdozen0theother View Post
I lived in both AR (was so miserable there and hated it) and OK (liked it very much.) So that's the basis for my opinions.

Oklahoma is environmentally VERY beautiful, and the population in most areas is comfortably low. It is a beautiful place for a vacation!

Unfortunately, it's also true that Eastern Oklahoma and Arkansas are socioculturally in the twilight zone. Social and cultural lives in the small towns there are ruled by churches that are anti-education and anti-environment. For all the constant proclamation of "Christian" values, many if not most people there smoke and drink too much, trash their yards and towns up, and express a lot of hate towards those who are not like them. The meth problem in that area is VERY bad. When I lived in Ft. Smith, Poteau was well known for being a center for drug trafficking. I personally saw a very close correlation between the religious fundamentalism and the alcohol and drug abuse and domestic violence.

If you are someone who would want to say in public that you believe in evolution and global warming, you probably would not be accepted into the social and cultural life of any small town in that area.

On the other hand, if you are apolitical and just want to talk about regular things like food or your garden or the wildlife, you'll get along fine. Or if you just want to mostly be on your own and don't expect to have close local friendships with like-minded people, you'll be fine. I enjoyed my time in Oklahoma. I lived in a cute little house by a creek in a small town, and my neighbors were lovely people. I got along socially by just avoiding discussing politics and religion and keeping my mouth shut when people were proclaiming their love for Jim Inhofe (seriously, look him up). I felt a little like an anthropologist or a time traveler ! Getting some distance from my experience there, though, I realize how lonely I was then.

I traveled a lot for work in OK. These are some small towns in eastern OK that I remember liking: Oolagah, Miami, Grove, Wagoner, Eufala, Talihina, Hugo, Tishomingo, and Sulphur. I still wish that I had bought land in Sulphur! Guthrie, which is on the northern edge of the OKC metro area, is really nice and probably more "progressive" than many other towns.

The further west you go in OK, the less dominant the fundamentalists are, and Western OK has a beauty all it's own.
This is true for the most part. Much of Arkansas and Oklahoma are like a cultural twilight zone compared to most of America. There are pockets in both states that are different (moreso in Arkansas than Oklahoma) but this region of the country is very different for the most part and is almost like traveling back in time.

I consider the Ft Smith area to be more culturally Oklahoma than Arkansas. It has more cultural ties to OKC and Tulsa than it does to Little Rock. Where did you live in Oklahoma? If your Arkansas experience was Ft Smith and this type of conservative culture/politics bothers you, I can see why you prefer Oklahoma over Arkansas. As nmita says, most people tend to be the other way around, but their Arkansas experience is more likely NWA or Little Rock, which in my opinion, are nicer than Oklahoma's cities.

I am not sure I agree with the statement that the further west you go in Oklahoma the less dominant the fundamentalists are. This is the buckle of the Bible Belt and the dominance of the Southern Baptist church is pretty much statewide and extends into the Texas panhandle as well. The culture finally starts to change pretty significantly once you get to New Mexico.

A more correct statement would be the further east you go in Arkansas, the lest dominant the fundamentalists are. Little Rock is a fairly liberal place and eastern Arkansas, while more conservative than Little Rock, is more liberal than western Arkansas. At least out there you can buy alcohol in most places (you can't in most of western Arkansas). By the time you reach Memphis, you have returned to the 21st century.
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Old 07-30-2016, 12:25 PM
 
Location: Oklahoma
8,286 posts, read 6,893,594 times
Reputation: 7396
Quote:
Originally Posted by bawac34618 View Post
This is true for the most part. Much of Arkansas and Oklahoma are like a cultural twilight zone compared to most of America. There are pockets in both states that are different (moreso in Arkansas than Oklahoma) but this region of the country is very different for the most part and is almost like traveling back in time.

I consider the Ft Smith area to be more culturally Oklahoma than Arkansas. It has more cultural ties to OKC and Tulsa than it does to Little Rock. Where did you live in Oklahoma? If your Arkansas experience was Ft Smith and this type of conservative culture/politics bothers you, I can see why you prefer Oklahoma over Arkansas. As nmita says, most people tend to be the other way around, but their Arkansas experience is more likely NWA or Little Rock, which in my opinion, are nicer than Oklahoma's cities.

I am not sure I agree with the statement that the further west you go in Oklahoma the less dominant the fundamentalists are. This is the buckle of the Bible Belt and the dominance of the Southern Baptist church is pretty much statewide and extends into the Texas panhandle as well. The culture finally starts to change pretty significantly once you get to New Mexico.

A more correct statement would be the further east you go in Arkansas, the lest dominant the fundamentalists are. Little Rock is a fairly liberal place and eastern Arkansas, while more conservative than Little Rock, is more liberal than western Arkansas. At least out there you can buy alcohol in most places (you can't in most of western Arkansas). By the time you reach Memphis, you have returned to the 21st century.
While can see why you might think that, my experience in that area was that it was that they felt pretty much like an autonomous area (Fayetteville/Ft. Smith). I would suppose historically that area was tied to Tulsa to a great degree but much less so now. Quite frankly, it felt pretty remote to OKC and that's where I came from when I moved there.

And my feelings about that are based on living in northern OK (Ponca City, and Enid) as well as western Oklahoma in Elk City and Clinton. Western Oklahoma is really joined at the hip with OKC, Ponca City was kind of a mixed bag with Tulsa and OKC being fairly equal and Wichita also having an influence.

Poteau WAS in Oklahoma so it was obviously influenced by the state capitol but once you crossed into Arkansas, I didn't feel like it was really all that much tied to OKC.
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Old 07-30-2016, 02:31 PM
 
Location: Cushing OK
14,545 posts, read 18,207,281 times
Reputation: 16829
Quote:
Originally Posted by nmnita View Post
Sounds like you are moving with an open mind, the right attitude and realize you will need to make adjustments. The worst thing about moving for so many, is relocating and then wanting everything the way it used to be: you know the type, the ones who say, well, where I lived last time we had this or that.
I've actually lived here for eight years. I honestly don't know if I could take socal again. There were a few times I really missed *someplace to go* and yet given the choice, I have ways to fill the occasional boredom. And its certain people and places so at some point I will plan a trip to a local science fiction con like the one in OKC.

Getting out of smoggy Dodge wasn't a new idea. My ex and I had made plans to move from busy, smoggy socal up to the tall trees in the area next to Oregon. We almost did but no houses were selling. I don't know if that would have changed the fate of the marriage, but for me, moving somewhere like that, slower and uncrowded, the desire for that never went away. And when I did, that place was for both of us, and I didn't want to do that.

I know people who would love it here, except for the politics. They wouldn't feel comfortable in 'enemy territiory'. But my attitude towards that is much the same as the other things which will never be 'me'. It doesn't have to. If I can breath air without grey goop visible, and are not crammed in tight as a sardine, the rest is agree to disagree territory.

I read about people who have their 'must' list. They want somewhere different and that part is very well defined. But the stuff which might well NOT match the list which likely comes with it makes them so uneasy. Yes, you move to a different kind of place you are out of your comfort zone. But sometimes that's good. You see past the label. If you can, so can they. We aren't the label but what else we do and show of ourselves.
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