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Old 06-14-2019, 06:52 AM
 
Location: Lawton, OK
83 posts, read 27,068 times
Reputation: 43

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There is one as a matter of fact in Oklahoma City and even Moore, OK and many in DFW, TX. Tulsa could use a WinCo too.

Lawton has about 100,000 people now and is the military town of the Army's field artillery training post, Fort Sill.

I was stationed at Fort Sill from 1989-1991 and now I'm a veteran resident of Lawton.

Lawtonian consumers are screwed when it comes to grocery shopping. The only decent place now to shop is on-post at the Fort Sill commissary if one is in the military or has special privileges as a Veteran.

Back in 1990 while stationed here in uniform, there was indeed a 24-hour you-bag-it-yourself discount warehouse supermarket in Lawton. It was the first such market I've ever witnessed in my life as matter of fact. I can't remember the name of it but it is now gone.

The only thing we have now in town gone way down hill over 3 decades is Walmart and a few small stores such as ALDI's. ALDI's and Country Mart are often expensive. They have a very limited product selection as compared with BIG BOX warehouse supermarkets. Sam's Club and Costco are not practical for a person living in small apartment with limited space to store foods which are sold in bulk at those annual membership joints.

While living in Sacramento County, California from 2008 through 2016 and in Boise, Idaho from 2016 through early 2019, I was a stone's throw away from a WinCo supermarket. Low prices, huge selection and much better produce quality than Walmart.

I was getting my generic bran flakes cereal at WinCo for $1.28 a box. Walmart generic bran flakes in Lawton run $2.28 a box!!

The WinCo in Boise, Idaho had local dairy milk, a brand called Meadow Gold there. The Walmart in Lawton doesn't even have milk from local Oklahoma dairy farms. Aren't there any Holstein cows in Oklahoma or did the tornadoes carry them all away Dorothy and Toto style?

I miss my WinCo badly now that I'm in forlorn place called Lawton.

This town is super horrible for bicycle riders: potholes the size of brontosaurus eggs and cracks in the pavement the size of the Grand Canyon.
The only LBS bike shop in town, Terry's Bicycles, is a mickey-mouse cowboy joint, unprofessional workmanship.

Are there suburban communities around Oklahoma City that are more prestigious than Lawton? Moore is tornado-prone I've read.
At least Lawton for all it's wild-west-style-ruggedness is relatively tornado-safe.

I asked WinCo corporation for a store In lawton at their website but I still have gotten not reply yet.

Here is the "big-box supermarket chain of the west" at the following link, you will have to use copy/paste:

www.wincofoods.com/

PS - I emailed Mayor Booker to ask him why the streets are so torn up in Lawton. So far, no reply. Is this town too cheap or too poor for infrastructure?
Why do the stupid Republicans running this joint refuse federal tax money for expanded Medicaid? Why in the devil are we stuck with high grocery taxes and toll on a federal Interstate highway? Are redneck Oklahomans afraid the Democrats might grab their guns? I will vote for every Democrat on the ballot at the state level and local. The damn rich should pay more taxes to maintain public works in this state. Even the Dept. of Public Safety building in Lawton looks slummish.

Last edited by JohnPBailey; 06-14-2019 at 07:04 AM..
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Old 06-14-2019, 01:53 PM
 
Location: Stillwater, Oklahoma
20,589 posts, read 15,269,278 times
Reputation: 6282
Good luck getting much of anything good in Lawton. Stillwater has been wishing for a Target to come for decades. Instead, it got Super Wal-Mart #2. You might have better luck in getting a Sprouts. If Stillwater can have a Sprouts, then why can't Lawton?

Roads are torn up in a lot of places. The excuse probably is due not to having as much road money as usual, due to drop in city sales tax collections. For the rural people, it surely has to do with Republicans cutting the Road and Bridge Fund by $230 million dollars a year or two ago, in order to balance the state budget. As I seem to recall, the Republican legislators wondered why there was so much money missing from that fund and demanded an audit. The audit revealed it was due to their own doing, ha, ha. With many roads and bridges now damaged from flooding, Oklahomans better hope the Feds will be generous with their disaster money to fix them.

Oklahoma is simply a very poorly run Republican state. For more proof of how true that is, when they raised the tax on gas by 3 cents, it wasn't to fix the roads. Instead, it was to help raise teacher pay. Raising teacher pay was a good thing, but I want all my gas taxes to go toward maintaining the roads. Much of the free highway from Stillwater to Tulsa is in poor shape. Blame Democrats of the past on toll roads. They claimed the first toll road would become free when it paid for itself. But no, Democrats only wanted to use the money to build more toll roads.

Are redneck Oklahomans afraid the Democrats might grab their guns? Yes, but much less so with President Trump in office. I bet gun sellers are so down in business that they hope the country will go back to having a Democrat for president in 2020.

Republicans are against all government welfare, so, of course, they are going to be against more Medicaid. Their excuse is that it makes people dependent on the government to live. But I think they are a bunch of conservative, successful people who look down on poor people. Their attitude, "I got mine, why can't you?" Really, Republican legislators are in there mainly to serve the best personal and corporate interests of wealthy people. Getting Republicans to raise tax on oil companies just a little was like pulling hen's teeth. But after many years of being denied, education interests finally came before oil interests.

The working man is lucky to get scraps from the state. But lots of working people keep voting for them, and Democrats have trouble coming up with anybody good, if at all. I've heard you get what you pay for. You also get what you vote for. At least, voters were smart enough in 2018 to throw out a bunch of sorry Republican legislators. Bad governing by them finally became too much to tolerate for another term. I can only think of 3 good things Oklahoma Republicans have done for the less than rich people--allowing a vote on alcohol law reform, finally raise teacher pay and not gutting the legalized medical marijuana program. It was so good how all legislators had to take a cut in pay. It was well deserved. Their wasting time and tax dollars from passing unconstitutional bills and other management blunders could not go on unpunished.

Oklahoma needs drastic tax reform to remove sales tax on food. Many small towns and counties rely upon the food sales tax, so it's hard to figure out how to eliminate it without making someone pay. Removing corporate state income tax would be good to attract more business and industry to the state. Make up for lost revenue by getting rid of state tax incentives. Do those two things and you have a level playing field for every corporate interest big and small.

If Oklahomans really want to fix things Republicans refuse to fix, then they will have to do it through the petition process and get questions on the ballot. This means for increased Medicaid, raise in minimum pay and significant tax reform.

Last edited by StillwaterTownie; 06-14-2019 at 02:38 PM..
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Old 06-15-2019, 01:25 AM
 
Location: Lawton, OK
83 posts, read 27,068 times
Reputation: 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by StillwaterTownie View Post
Good luck getting much of anything good in Lawton. Stillwater has been wishing for a Target to come for decades. Instead, it got Super Wal-Mart #2. You might have better luck in getting a Sprouts. If Stillwater can have a Sprouts, then why can't Lawton?

Roads are torn up in a lot of places. The excuse probably is due not to having as much road money as usual, due to drop in city sales tax collections. For the rural people, it surely has to do with Republicans cutting the Road and Bridge Fund by $230 million dollars a year or two ago, in order to balance the state budget. As I seem to recall, the Republican legislators wondered why there was so much money missing from that fund and demanded an audit. The audit revealed it was due to their own doing, ha, ha. With many roads and bridges now damaged from flooding, Oklahomans better hope the Feds will be generous with their disaster money to fix them.

Oklahoma is simply a very poorly run Republican state. For more proof of how true that is, when they raised the tax on gas by 3 cents, it wasn't to fix the roads. Instead, it was to help raise teacher pay. Raising teacher pay was a good thing, but I want all my gas taxes to go toward maintaining the roads. Much of the free highway from Stillwater to Tulsa is in poor shape. Blame Democrats of the past on toll roads. They claimed the first toll road would become free when it paid for itself. But no, Democrats only wanted to use the money to build more toll roads.

Are redneck Oklahomans afraid the Democrats might grab their guns? Yes, but much less so with President Trump in office. I bet gun sellers are so down in business that they hope the country will go back to having a Democrat for president in 2020.

Republicans are against all government welfare, so, of course, they are going to be against more Medicaid. Their excuse is that it makes people dependent on the government to live. But I think they are a bunch of conservative, successful people who look down on poor people. Their attitude, "I got mine, why can't you?" Really, Republican legislators are in there mainly to serve the best personal and corporate interests of wealthy people. Getting Republicans to raise tax on oil companies just a little was like pulling hen's teeth. But after many years of being denied, education interests finally came before oil interests.

The working man is lucky to get scraps from the state. But lots of working people keep voting for them, and Democrats have trouble coming up with anybody good, if at all. I've heard you get what you pay for. You also get what you vote for. At least, voters were smart enough in 2018 to throw out a bunch of sorry Republican legislators. Bad governing by them finally became too much to tolerate for another term. I can only think of 3 good things Oklahoma Republicans have done for the less than rich people--allowing a vote on alcohol law reform, finally raise teacher pay and not gutting the legalized medical marijuana program. It was so good how all legislators had to take a cut in pay. It was well deserved. Their wasting time and tax dollars from passing unconstitutional bills and other management blunders could not go on unpunished.

Oklahoma needs drastic tax reform to remove sales tax on food. Many small towns and counties rely upon the food sales tax, so it's hard to figure out how to eliminate it without making someone pay. Removing corporate state income tax would be good to attract more business and industry to the state. Make up for lost revenue by getting rid of state tax incentives. Do those two things and you have a level playing field for every corporate interest big and small.

If Oklahomans really want to fix things Republicans refuse to fix, then they will have to do it through the petition process and get questions on the ballot. This means for increased Medicaid, raise in minimum pay and significant tax reform.

Gasoline prices are relatively cheap in Lawton right now. I just tanked up the day before yesterday at $2.15 for regular at Murphy's Express. I drive a little 1995 Toyota Corolla and don't usually use more than a tank a month.

Being a disabled age-55 man on limited income I am bedridden at home a lot and drive my car very little anyway.

I'm getting screwed by PSO (Piece of Sh_t Outfit) on the electric bill. My current bill is just over $91.00 for a mere 733 KWH of power consumed this billing cycle month. Just under $27 for the FUEL costs but OVER $58 for "ELECTRIC SERVICE" fee, what the hell! They hit me last month at only $27-something for the SERVICE when my fuel bill then was under $6.00 for 162 KWH. I moved into my new Lawton apartment on May 8 and got a partial electric bill on May 15. I was shocked even then to see over $35 for just 8 days of electric use.

In Oklahoma it's not the coal or petroleum companies that are gouging electric consumers, but that damn PSO!

My electric FUEL bill is still only 3.67 cents per kilowatt-hour! 3.67 measly cents for diesel or coal or whatever they use as a conversion energy source (commercial industrial bulk rates) to run my 1,000 watt room air conditioner for one whole frickin' hour is a steal!!

Imagine what your fuel costs would be if you had your own portable generator run your home.

Last edited by JohnPBailey; 06-15-2019 at 02:19 AM..
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Old 06-15-2019, 11:10 AM
 
50 posts, read 14,102 times
Reputation: 80
Default In My Experience ...

If you want to spend the minimum amount for groceries, you might have to shop at a group of stores. One store might have the best price of all for one particular product, but another chain's store might have the best price for something else.

For example, the WinCo that I go to has the best price per unit for frozen blueberries, but Kroger and ALDI have the two best prices for bite-sized shredded wheat.

It helps if your area has dollar stores. The last time I priced one, a 64oz bottle of laundry ammonia cost $3.78 at WalMart, but the same thing cost $1 at Dollar Tree.
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Old 06-15-2019, 11:36 AM
 
Location: Lawton, OK
83 posts, read 27,068 times
Reputation: 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by TedF0ster View Post
If you want to spend the minimum amount for groceries, you might have to shop at a group of stores. One store might have the best price of all for one particular product, but another chain's store might have the best price for something else.

For example, the WinCo that I go to has the best price per unit for frozen blueberries, but Kroger and ALDI have the two best prices for bite-sized shredded wheat.

It helps if your area has dollar stores. The last time I priced one, a 64 oz bottle of laundry ammonia cost $3.78 at WalMart, but the same thing cost $1 at Dollar Tree.
No such luck for me in Lawton, OK. We badly need the likes and prices of a WinCo here.

If I think something I habitually buy at Walmart is more costly than at WinCo, it is HIGHER at ALDI or ALDI doesn't have it.

I can get generic lemon ammonia cheap at Walmart still.

WinCo often has Dole salad greens for 98 cents a bag. The ones at Walmart often have brown lettuce in the bags even the pull dates say they are still "fresh".

My favorite golden delicious apples are lousy quality at Walmart and the more expensive such apples at ALDI are also lousy quality.

I used to get nice, beautiful golden delicious apples at Boise, ID WinCo for $1.28 a pound.

I can't get the apples I like anywhere in Lawton. I haven't yet checked the apples out at Country Mart.
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Old 06-15-2019, 11:44 AM
 
Location: Lawton, OK
83 posts, read 27,068 times
Reputation: 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by TedF0ster View Post
If you want to spend the minimum amount for groceries, you might have to shop at a group of stores. One store might have the best price of all for one particular product, but another chain's store might have the best price for something else.

For example, the WinCo that I go to has the best price per unit for frozen blueberries, but Kroger and ALDI have the two best prices for bite-sized shredded wheat.

It helps if your area has dollar stores. The last time I priced one, a 64oz bottle of laundry ammonia cost $3.78 at WalMart, but the same thing cost $1 at Dollar Tree.
I always bought my frozen mixed berries, strawberries and blueberries at WinCo. Lots of special mixed fruit blends I liked to at the best prices. Now, I have to buy frozen fruit at Wally-World.

The trailer-trash class of people in Lawton don't give a damn about values when it comes to shopping.
I'm stuck in a crap town only because my rent is relatively cheap.

I envy the people with special commissary privileges on nearby Fort Sill for military people and service-connected vets. Lawton might be OK for active army but sucks for off-post civilians.
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Old 06-15-2019, 03:25 PM
 
16,030 posts, read 1,319,310 times
Reputation: 25921
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnPBailey View Post
I always bought my frozen mixed berries, strawberries and blueberries at WinCo. Lots of special mixed fruit blends I liked to at the best prices. Now, I have to buy frozen fruit at Wally-World.

The trailer-trash class of people in Lawton don't give a damn about values when it comes to shopping.
I'm stuck in a crap town only because my rent is relatively cheap.

I envy the people with special commissary privileges on nearby Fort Sill for military people and service-connected vets. Lawton might be OK for active army but sucks for off-post civilians.
On a serious note - if everything in Ok is so terrible why did you move here?

A simple Google search shows grocery stores in the area and their Wednesday adds. Power companies disclose delivery charges.

Your language is somewhat offensive from trailer trash to damn and whatever else you have used.
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Old 06-15-2019, 04:54 PM
 
Location: Lawton, OK
83 posts, read 27,068 times
Reputation: 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Threestep View Post
On a serious note - if everything in Ok is so terrible why did you move here?

A simple Google search shows grocery stores in the area and their Wednesday adds. Power companies disclose delivery charges.

Your language is somewhat offensive from trailer trash to damn and whatever else you have used.
I never said everything is OK in OK at all. I only came here on account of a cheap apartment that I could actually afford without sharing with a roomie. Yes, there is definitely a good reason rent is cheap here. Most Americans don't want to live here and the ones with significant means won't.

The GOOD:

I LOST living with roommates by comin here: they all stink!!
I came to lower elevation which helps my asthma.


The BAD:

high grocery taxes
poor shopping choices in Lawton, Google revealed nothing spectacular, I've tried and tested everything on Google except local farmers markets
poor street conditions and infrastructure: horrible for bicycle riders like me: all these fat/lazy people in Lawton like their gas-guzzling vehicles, they can now gleefully drive those pigs now that gas is approaching $2/gallon.
rude local cab companies
the lousy weather
the humidity
the mold in my apartment from the humidity
I have to drive to Wichita Falls, TX for my VA primary-care doctors appointments because there is a waiting list with 500 vets on it for primary care at the Fort Sill VA clinic
the fat cats at PSO who squeeze money out of poor Oakies unmercifully
the highway robbery at the pike toll booths
the stupid bureaucrats at the Public Safety office who refuse to transfer my valid driver's license from Idaho to Oklahoma on the account that my name is different on my Idaho license than on my BC





If poor Oklahomans were to wise up and vote Democrat things would get much rosier for the poor, even the working poor, in Tornado Alley.

The Republican Christian Righters have all the poor people spun here.

If you would like me to add "God" to the word "damn" I'll be happy to oblige.

I bet OK is a right-to-work state with no union presence.


Yes, I naturally assumed that since rent is cheap in Oklahoma, everything else would follow suit.
Rent by far is my biggest single monthly living cost.

As I said, landlords here can't charge too high because of the undesirability of Oklahoma living.
Real estate values for homebuyers rank 41st in OK for American states as well.
Mississippi is dead last at 50 with the lowest cost of living index/real estate values overall.


PSO does NOT have the Peak hours Off-Peek hours thing dissected on my bill: just this there's something fishing they are hiding in the crazy-skyhigh Rate Billing ("Service" fee). Notice how super low the FUEL costs are.

Does it really cost $58-something for PSO (based in Pennsylvania) to "deliver" 733 KWH of monthly electricity to my little apartment AFTER the raw diesel or coal costs? Part of the reason Oklahomans may be screwed at the meter is because OK doesn't have its very own in-state electric company. We may be paying an out-of-state import shipping fee for kilowatts.

See a Tiny Pic image of my PSO bill breakdown below:




What "tariff" or "rate code" am I being billed at according to this website?
https://www.psoklahoma.com/global/ut...ril%202019.pdf

There is nothing about on-peek/off-peek/tier levels disclosed on my billing statement. Just a blanket SERVICE (rate) fee, a TAXES fee and a total FUEL cost listed.

Last edited by JohnPBailey; 06-15-2019 at 05:26 PM..
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Old 06-15-2019, 10:54 PM
 
Location: Stillwater, Oklahoma
20,589 posts, read 15,269,278 times
Reputation: 6282
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnPBailey View Post
I never said everything is OK in OK at all. I only came here on account of a cheap apartment that I could actually afford without sharing with a roomie. Yes, there is definitely a good reason rent is cheap here. Most Americans don't want to live here and the ones with significant means won't.

istThe GOOD:

I LOST living with roommates by comin here: they all stink!!
I came to lower elevation which helps my asthma.

Well, yeah, especially Lawton. You probably need to move out of Lawton and move to the Oklahoma City area, assuming the rent would be affordable. It's the best way to do Oklahoma when it isn't Tulsa. Oklahoma City doesn't get as hot as Lawton during the summer time, so that's a plus.
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Old 06-16-2019, 01:03 AM
 
Location: Lawton, OK
83 posts, read 27,068 times
Reputation: 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by StillwaterTownie View Post
Well, yeah, especially Lawton. You probably need to move out of Lawton and move to the Oklahoma City area, assuming the rent would be affordable. It's the best way to do Oklahoma when it isn't Tulsa. Oklahoma City doesn't get as hot as Lawton during the summer time, so that's a plus.
Oh, the other positive of Lawton is that this town is thankfully not tornado-prone and heavy-hail-storm-prone unlike OKC metro area. The tornadoes scare me even more than the big electric bills. I saw Dorothy and Toto fly away in their Kansas house to Oz.

An old couple who just moved out of my complex says there are nicer communities on the east side of Lawton. I'm in the town's ghetto region to the west near Cache Road.
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