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Old 08-25-2010, 08:37 AM
 
2,131 posts, read 4,914,168 times
Reputation: 1002

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Quote:
Originally Posted by missionhome View Post
Ontario Airport is already big enough. Los Angeles World Airports owns Ontario Airport as well and has been trying to get airlines to offer more flights there. Why do the airlines not offer flights there??? Its not close enough to Los Angeles where the majority of the region's fliers live. El Toro would be way too far away and likely just a spoke airport like John Wayne is, not a major aviation hub like LAX.

As long as LAX has capacity (which it does now), airlines will prefer to be at the airport closest to the heart of the region (which for us is the region stretching from the L.A. Westside to Downtown L.A.).

--If Ontario can't convince the airlines to fly into it, why would a huge El Toro airport be able to??? Ontario is 37 miles from Downtown L.A., 43.0 miles from Hollywood, 52 miles from the Westside, etc... El Toro would be 50 miles from the Westside, 38 miles from Downtown L.A., 45 miles from Hollywood, etc...
What about the more than three million people that live in Orange County and the millions who visit Disneyland every year? Isn't that a big enough customer base to justify a big airport?
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Old 08-25-2010, 12:49 PM
 
Location: Mission Viejo, CA
2,498 posts, read 11,438,053 times
Reputation: 1619
Quote:
Originally Posted by wrcousert View Post
What about the more than three million people that live in Orange County and the millions who visit Disneyland every year? Isn't that a big enough customer base to justify a big airport?
3 million people is not nearly enough to justify an INTERNATIONAL airport that offers the amount of flights that LAX has. If LAX was closed, it would force airlines operating international flights to look elsewhere, but as long as it is open with space available, the international flights will be from there. L.A. County is 3 TIMES LARGER than Orange County and a larger business and tourist destination (partly because it just has so much more people).

Orange County could justify a slightly larger airport, about the size as San Diego Airport in terms of number of flights and passengers carried (and OC is roughly the same population as San Diego County) and could use a second runway.

An airport in Orange County wouldn't be able to attract the foreign airlines (Orange County isn't known outside of the USA, but L.A. is), but it could possibly become a hub airport for an airline based in the United States. Right now American and United both go head to head with a hub at LAX (United carries about 20% of LAX passengers and American carries about 18%). Southwest, Delta, and Alaska also have a large presence with focus cities or international gateways. Because of this intense competition at LAX, one or more of these airlines might be tempted to move the majority of their flights to Orange County. That airline would risk loosing out on the larger passenger base in L.A. County.

Disney is an ok incentive for a larger airport, but the network airlines are not attracted to the low-yielding vacation passenger with the family that is searching for the lowest fare possible. They prefer high paying business passengers who want fully refundable tickets. The low cost airlines like Southwest are the exception and specifically have served leisure travelers, but doesn't offer international flights like Delta, United, American, etc...

--Basically El Toro could have served as a larger DOMESTIC airport to serve Orange County and allow the airlines to offer more frequency to their hubs to connect passengers to their final destination. We could have also had some 767 service to Hawaii, although service to Hawaii has struggled at Orange County airport over the years compared to LAX. The notion that El Toro would make LAX obsolete is silly though and doesn't take into account the importance of yields, location, customer base, and landing fees/costs of operations at an airport.

-My husband's in aviation and I used to work at an aviation consulting firm. Most aviation experts thought a huge El Toro Airport would be like Ontario or Pittsburgh or St. Louis. An airport way to big for the size of the local population and could only survive if a domestic airline decided to make it their hub.

Last edited by missionhome; 08-25-2010 at 01:04 PM..
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Old 08-28-2010, 05:23 PM
 
Location: Columbia, California
6,664 posts, read 30,612,996 times
Reputation: 5184
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoldenZephyr View Post
I have been wondering. I remember a couple of years ago lots of excitement about Orange County building the next great American park. I was really excited by the idea and remember the Navy auctioning off the land and talk was that the park would be complete early in the next decade (2012) I think.,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,Anyone know the status or can give more info on the story and why things seem so delayed? Are they still building the park. The idea seems great, I hope it doesn't die, but I am sure there are lots of problems.
Great America is owned by Cedar Fair that also owns Knott's Berry farm. They almost sold off Knott's last year.
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Old 10-26-2012, 08:20 PM
 
Location: Las Flores, Orange County, CA
26,329 posts, read 93,755,036 times
Reputation: 17831
Orange County's planned Great Park a victim of hard times - latimes.com
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Old 10-30-2012, 11:24 PM
 
125 posts, read 495,864 times
Reputation: 63
Has anyone taken the balloon ride? Is it worth it?
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Old 10-30-2012, 11:44 PM
 
11,715 posts, read 40,449,173 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by venicebeachcalifornia View Post
Has anyone taken the balloon ride? Is it worth it?
I tried once. Then found out I'd needed to be there at dawn to get a reservation for that day. I settled for a picture of it.
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Old 11-16-2012, 07:36 AM
 
Location: Las Flores, Orange County, CA
26,329 posts, read 93,755,036 times
Reputation: 17831
Irvine plans review of Great Park funds - latimes.com
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Old 11-16-2012, 04:08 PM
 
2,131 posts, read 4,914,168 times
Reputation: 1002
It's time to bring this back to the voters. The Great Park is a total waste of tax payers money. There are far better uses for that extremely valuable property.
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Old 11-16-2012, 04:23 PM
 
Location: Huntington Beach, CA
5,888 posts, read 13,005,312 times
Reputation: 3974
Quote:
Originally Posted by wrcousert View Post
It's time to bring this back to the voters. The Great Park is a total waste of tax payers money. There are far better uses for that extremely valuable property.
Just what the developers want... They will be able to get in below market value.

We need the park. but spending over half the budget on Planning is not a good start. Time to do an audit .
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Old 11-18-2012, 12:19 AM
 
2,654 posts, read 5,465,602 times
Reputation: 1946
Quote:
Originally Posted by DinsdalePirahna View Post
Just what the developers want... They will be able to get in below market value.

We need the park. but spending over half the budget on Planning is not a good start. Time to do an audit .
You might just get that much needed audit you are wisely looking for. Larry Agran lost his grip on the Irvine City council, and I'm sure the new majority will be eager to probe & talk about the mis-management of the park's development.
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