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i find it a little surprising. maybe the state gives them out more freely than others.
Which means we are taxed more freely to pay for it too.
Knew it was bad, but did not realize it was that bad.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JasonF
We have low incomes, high unemployment, and a very high cost of living. Toss in the seemingly endless supply of flakes, lazy entitled whiners and drug addicts who come to Oregon to mooch off those of us who work and frankly it's surprising we're not #1.
Probably one of the most surprising things about moving to OR was the sheer volume of bottomfeeders who are perfectly capable of working, but instead would rather have everyone else pay for them to sit at home smoking pot and playing video games all day.
The equation can only come together by an "endless supply" and "sheer volume" of senators, representatives and administrators who freely dish-it-out.
I would like to add a few cents to this discussion.
For two years I was one of those "unemployed" that could possibly be described as "lazy" or "unmotivated" or even an "entitled whiner" but I am not; far from it.
I am now in school courtesy of the Trade Act for Displaced Workers and have been for the past two years. My unemployment status was through no fault of my own, a stuation my ex-employer took great pains to point out. My education was not paid for by me nor were my books or other school fees. I also recieved an income. Someone had to pay for all that.
Point is; even though I was unemployed I was working - probably harder than at any time previous. My job, if you want to call it that, was to gain training - training I would never have gotten had I not taken advantage of the Trade Act - to gain entry back into the workforce. Training that was a real knutt buster. And the program did what it was intended to do. I now have a job again as well as a degree, and instead of "taking" from the system, I can now give back to it.
My remarks are not intended to be an invalidation of those who claim there are welfare queens who mooch and perfectly able bodied people who could put in a full day's work (or even 6 hours) but do not. There are those out there but the vast majority of folks who take advantage of food stamps, discounted medical services, free transport and suchlike are working poor but like all of you - and now me - they do work.
As with the working poor, the unemployed for the most part bust butt securing anything they can get. One of the reasons even "McJobs" are in short supply. What is not often pointed out during discussions regarding unemployment and welfare is that many who do qualify for such "entitlements" as food stamps do not use the services either because of pride (yers truly sad to say) or because they are unaware they exist or that they are qualified to use them.
Oregon is a particularly hard hit state with regard to jobs. Not only is there a high unemployment rate but such jobs as are available generally do not pay a living wage. I believe Oregon's unenviable standing in the food stamp rankings will remain for sometime to come.
Well put FVwinters, and good for you. I realize these are tough times, and I personally have no beef with retraining programs if people like yourself need to reboot and gain good employment.
I still think something is a bit screwy in Oregon these days with the stamps, but I will also concede these are very tough times. Best to you.
I would like to add a few cents to this discussion.
For two years I was one of those "unemployed" that could possibly be described as "lazy" or "unmotivated" or even an "entitled whiner" but I am not; far from it.
I am now in school courtesy of the Trade Act for Displaced Workers and have been for the past two years. My unemployment status was through no fault of my own, a stuation my ex-employer took great pains to point out. My education was not paid for by me nor were my books or other school fees. I also recieved an income. Someone had to pay for all that.
Point is; even though I was unemployed I was working - probably harder than at any time previous. My job, if you want to call it that, was to gain training - training I would never have gotten had I not taken advantage of the Trade Act - to gain entry back into the workforce. Training that was a real knutt buster. And the program did what it was intended to do. I now have a job again as well as a degree, and instead of "taking" from the system, I can now give back to it.
My remarks are not intended to be an invalidation of those who claim there are welfare queens who mooch and perfectly able bodied people who could put in a full day's work (or even 6 hours) but do not. There are those out there but the vast majority of folks who take advantage of food stamps, discounted medical services, free transport and suchlike are working poor but like all of you - and now me - they do work.
As with the working poor, the unemployed for the most part bust butt securing anything they can get. One of the reasons even "McJobs" are in short supply. What is not often pointed out during discussions regarding unemployment and welfare is that many who do qualify for such "entitlements" as food stamps do not use the services either because of pride (yers truly sad to say) or because they are unaware they exist or that they are qualified to use them.
Oregon is a particularly hard hit state with regard to jobs. Not only is there a high unemployment rate but such jobs as are available generally do not pay a living wage. I believe Oregon's unenviable standing in the food stamp rankings will remain for sometime to come.
Well said. Thanks for bringing some perspective to the discussion.
Glad you landed on your feet with job after some support. I hope these programs help as many people like you as they can. The people who abuse they system, across the board, should not be tolerated.
But, as the saying goes: "one bad apple spoils the bunch". I hope the abuse is only a small percent.
It seems as if food stamp usage really increased in Oregon after the crash in '08, and I think that was probably more due to people losing their jobs rather than an influx of newcomers looking to milk the system.
It seems as if food stamp usage really increased in Oregon after the crash in '08, and I think that was probably more due to people losing their jobs rather than an influx of newcomers looking to milk the system.
I think you are right that use has gone up with the recession, just as it should. But I disagree that some people, domestic or imported, are not milking the system. I really do not imagine that people in, say, Iowa, would be using these services at the level they do here. The attitude I seem to detect it, "you can get it, why not apply?" Maybe it is my upbringing, but I feel that taking "pride" in pulling one's own weight is fundamental to a vibrant democracy. And I am a hardened liberal.
It does seem to me that it is a combination of a breakdown in that pride, and a well-meaning, but in my opinion overly kind-hearted and naive public policy that jointly lead to the Oregon pattern.
What I cannot reconcile with this is our very weak support for public education in Oregon; it seems destined to turn us in to the West Virginia of the West Coast. I don't typically whine about taxes, or for that matter generosity and kindness, if I can see how they will help make the individual and the state stronger.
Easy access to public assistance in a long-term immigrant state can attract and enable the wrong element for our long-term success. Witness the panhandler youth culture or Portland.
I think you are right that use has gone up with the recession, just as it should. But I disagree that some people, domestic or imported, are not milking the system. I really do not imagine that people in, say, Iowa, would be using these services at the level they do here. The attitude I seem to detect it, "you can get it, why not apply?" Maybe it is my upbringing, but I feel that taking "pride" in pulling one's own weight is fundamental to a vibrant democracy. And I am a hardened liberal.
It does seem to me that it is a combination of a breakdown in that pride, and a well-meaning, but in my opinion overly kind-hearted and naive public policy that jointly lead to the Oregon pattern.
What I cannot reconcile with this is our very weak support for public education in Oregon; it seems destined to turn us in to the West Virginia of the West Coast. I don't typically whine about taxes, or for that matter generosity and kindness, if I can see how they will help make the individual and the state stronger.
Easy access to public assistance in a long-term immigrant state can attract and enable the wrong element for our long-term success. Witness the panhandler youth culture or Portland.
Do they hang out in,say, LaGrande?
Forget it. I did not say that "some people, imported or domestic, are milking the system". I can't respond to your disagreement with that because that is not what I said.
Just that the number of recipients rose quite sharply after the crash and that most likely the people who lost their jobs at that time had more of an impact on the food stamp roles than people moving from out of state. That is what I said.
Last edited by Metlakatla; 05-18-2011 at 09:52 AM..
Forget it. I did not say that "some people, imported or domestic, are milking the system". I can't respond to your disagreement with that because that is not what I said.
Just that the number of recipients rose quite sharply after the crash and that most likely the people who lost their jobs at that time had more of an impact on the food stamp roles than people moving from out of state. That is what I said.
Well, I do agree with that statement (the recession is th 800 lb. gorilla), but that should not put us as no #2 in the country by itself. A number of other states are even harder hit. Nor do I want to kick anyone while they are down.
But it seems like part of the problem existed before. I wonder if this is partially why we have such a youth panhandler epidemic. Anyone who can fog a mirror can get food stamps for essential, and any cash they can muster will cover the tall boys cans of PBR or weed or whatever....
One problem is the closure of saw mills across the state. Many communities were timber dependent, those jobs paid living wages to high school graduates. Then along came 'Spotted Owl' timber harvesting closures and jobs started disappearing in these communities. In time the young migrated away for jobs, their parents couldn't sell their homes because no one wanted to buy a home in a economically depressed community. Some of the mills fired up for the housing bubble but closed when it burst. There are just no employment opportunities for 50+ miles around for many. They can't afford to move, many are over 40, they deserve help. It's not as if they aren't doing what they can, look for many back yard gardens as they try to supplement their diets.
One problem is the closure of saw mills across the state. Many communities were timber dependent, those jobs paid living wages to high school graduates. Then along came 'Spotted Owl' timber harvesting closures and jobs started disappearing in these communities. In time the young migrated away for jobs, their parents couldn't sell their homes because no one wanted to buy a home in a economically depressed community. Some of the mills fired up for the housing bubble but closed when it burst. There are just no employment opportunities for 50+ miles around for many. They can't afford to move, many are over 40, they deserve help. It's not as if they aren't doing what they can, look for many back yard gardens as they try to supplement their diets.
This sums up my hometown in Oregon very well. It also attracts people who are living on government benefits of some kind because rents are cheaper.
I think that rural Oregon has a higher percentage of people receiving assistance than Portland does, despite the panhandling youth. I wonder how many of them actually get food stamps anyway; it's been my understanding that someone had to have an actual physical address in order to get them.
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