Preppers, Permies & Off griders - Need advice. (house, neighborhood)

[oregonwoodsmoke]

Incidentally, the last time I checked, the state of Oregon offers generous tax credits for anyone going off-grid, tax credits for solar and tax credits for wind generation. Nobody has any objection to off-grid.

[hamellr]

Originally Posted by oregonwoodsmoke

I've always found the building inspectors to be quite friendly, but on the other hand, I've got my permits and i am not trying to sneak anything by.

I've found building inspectors to be very friendly in general. Usually letting little things like deadlines slide a bit and willing to take the time to explain on a very basic level what the rules are.

[Yojimbo11]

"I do not understand why anyone would build without permits and inspections. The codes are for safety. The completed inspections are necessary if you ever sell, and nobody can see into the future to be 100% certain that they will never sell."

I happen to be born and already live in Oregon, no one declared you overseer who is welcome here.

And Obviously you don't understand, AGAIN no one is trying to get around a permit. Inspections and codes are not for safety, they are for General contractors, Architects and building inspectors to collect money & fees off of induce uniformity and promote the building industry, Owner/builder be damned.

Building codes are designed around Wood houses with a traditional septic system, windows in every room as a fire exit isn't really practical when you are earth berming a fireproof plaster or concrete structure.

The 1800s logging hotel we live in now is a fire trap, falling down and virtually inhabitable and entirely up to code (Just passed inspection + government loan for the first time home buyer letting us escape) the hassle begins if I want to tear it down and rebuild it, The code entirely allows for the current unsafe structure to remain and financed the new purchaser for far more what it would cost them to build a nice house.

I can dump a trailer on most parcels in the state that are a death box in a natural disaster, entirely inefficient dirty and ugly for under a thousand in permits and few questions asked.

If someone is trying to find out about potential restrictions on compost or incinerating toilets with a grey water recycle that doesn't require a filthy ground destroying septic tank we have to put up with technologically ignorant trolls slinging accusations that we are trying to do something unsafe and are "unwelcome" here.

Containerist (the website of the guy who developed and popularized shipping container houses) BTW says you can't get shipping container house permitted in Oregon and he does write books entirely on the permitting process.

[Steve Pickering]

Originally Posted by Yojimbo11

... ... Containerist (the website of the guy who developed and popularized shipping container houses) BTW says you can't get shipping container house permitted in Oregon and he does write books entirely on the permitting process.

Why not? A call to the local Planning and Zoning saw no reason why it could not be done here.

[Larry Caldwell]

Originally Posted by Yojimbo11

I am not looking for anyone to "look the other way" if you don't think building inspectors have a degree of discretion and disliking your earthbermed cob house can lead them to make your life a living hell that's a strong indication you haven't done much building.

The "substandard" accusations and assumptions you make about alternate structures is exactly the foul hateful attitudes I am doing my best to avoid when I have to deal with these people.

You don't sound like much of an off-grider.

Just build the structure according to your approved plans and you will get no static from any building inspectors, ever. Plumbing and electrical inspectors will evaluate your work to meet minimum codes. Yes, there is a low voltage code, so if you want to run off batteries, bone up. Plumbing codes are pretty rigid because lack of sanitation kills people. The horrible plumbing in older homes is an example of what happens when you do it wrong. Your heating system has to heat the house to 65 degrees in the middle of the room 3 feet off the floor. UL certified heating appliances or an EPA approved wood stove are required.

Just do it right.

[Yojimbo11]

Originally Posted by Steve Pickering

Why not? A call to the local Planning and Zoning saw no reason why it could not be done here.

The reason given in the book I have is the Oregon state code is based on the 2006 international residential code which cites unspecified obstacles making permitting a container house in the "non-viable" category. I haven't confirmed it personally.

Not a big fan of the container house honestly, the popularity has made finding good units hard, raised the price and you have to be weary of people trying to unload chemical laced containers claiming they were food grade. They could make a good base structure for a Earth berm. We are leaning towards a rammed earth design with a climate appropriate plaster that could be anything from cob to shot-crete. Plaster choice is site dependent.

[Steve Pickering]

Give CEB a thought or two. I may lease my machine when I am through. It is a 2001 series.

Compressed Earth Block Machines - Advanced Earthen Construction Technologies

[Larry Caldwell]

Originally Posted by Yojimbo11

Inspections and codes are not for safety, they are for General contractors, Architects and building inspectors to collect money & fees off of induce uniformity and promote the building industry, Owner/builder be damned.

Building codes are designed around Wood houses with a traditional septic system, windows in every room as a fire exit isn't really practical when you are earth berming a fireproof plaster or concrete structure.

Attitudes like that are why we go to great lengths to keep you from making messes the next people have to clean up. If you think the Oregon Residential Specialty Code doesn't make provisions for alternative construction methods, you know nothing about building codes. Yes, there are prescriptive paths for cheap and safe houses, but even the big builders move off that path when the owner wants something different.

You may think a concrete house is fireproof, but the contents are not. For that matter, a conventional stick framed house with sheetrock walls is pretty fireproof too. It's the contents that flash, and kill people by smoke inhalation.

I have built earth sheltered houses, and there is nothing impractical about them. Yes, habitable rooms need to have emergency egress, but there are rooms in any house that are not habitable. The back wall is typically laundry, pantry, bathrooms, closet, hallway or other storage. You can even put a fallout shelter back there with a little thought to exiting.

Spend less time protecting your ignorance and more time learning how to do things right.

[Yojimbo11]

"Spend less time protecting your ignorance and more time learning how to do things right."

For the record I've spent my entire life patching up a 1800's era farm house made from Douglas county timber milled on the land where it sits today there's not a aspect of major construction I haven't done to this house at least twice and it passed inspection when it sold. I spent the last 3 years of school researching and writing endless papers on natural building techniques, organic farming, solar, wind and hydro power methods and have 5 to go before I finish my degree in engineering.

I have four 1500 SQFT earthbermed domes under my belt but they were built at a boy scout camp that is entirely code and inspection free.

The only thing I am ignorant of is the path of least resistance through the red tape which is why I am soliciting personal experiences from like minded people who found a path through it.

Trying to learn which counties where people have head pleasant easy times with the inspectors is precisely what I am doing, a building inspector that has seen similar structures is going to much easier to deal with than one that hasn't, different counties have time limits to build, some don't. Some counties allow temporary dwellings while building, some don't.

These are the type of questions I am exploring from like minded people who have gone through this and don't mind sharing the name of the county they are in.

But the topic keeps getting de-railed by people that think a composting toilet is a nefarious plot to poison ground water and collectivists hoping to seize it one day have to chime in about the re-sell value.

Despite what you insist on alleging a person seeking out the most reasonable bureaucracy and least amount of red tape to deal with is not violating any codes or doing anything wrong.

[hamellr]

Originally Posted by Yojimbo11

Despite what you insist on alleging a person seeking out the most reasonable bureaucracy and least amount of red tape to deal with is not violating any codes or doing anything wrong.

What you are seeing is one person's "reasonable," is another person's "trying to get around the rules."