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Did you consider taking your parents out the hell hole you find it to be?
Quote:
Originally Posted by everythingatall
I am by no means rich. I'm solidly middle class. But you're right - I wouldn't leave Chicago for Orlando for any other reason than to take care of my aging parents. Orlando offers me, a single woman in her late thirties, nothing at all other than a car culture, underpaid jobs, dreadful theme parks and a demographic that is generally poorly educated and lower class. There's literally nothing to do in Orlando. Theme parks? No thank you. The Orlando Museum of Art? Same tired space and exhibits as when I volunteered there in 2001. Independent and foreign films that I love so much? Where? The Enzian? Well, they sold out years ago when they decided to show the same film for four weeks at a time. That theatre would die a quick death in my neighborhood. Book talks, university lectures, architecture tours, etc? Not in Orlando.
When I meet new people here in Chicago, I have them guess where I'm from. I say, "What's the worst state in the nation?" About eighty percent of the people say Florida. The remaining 20% say Texas or Mississippi or some other southern state. Or when I tell them I'm from Florida, they immediately say, "I'm so sorry!"
And it's not just about Orlando having "poor" people. It's just a different state of mind. In general, well educated people who are interested in culture, good food, walkable neighborhoods, public transit and excellent opportunities for higher education just don't choose states like Florida. Florida state universities are fine. I graduated from two of them but they aren't at all comparable to the kind of educational experience and connections you'll make at top schools like Northwestern and University of Chicago. Culturally and educationally, Florida is a wasteland, especially the Orlando area. Other than family or a really, really, really well paying job, I cannot imagine any big city sort of person would willingly move to Orlando or be at all content there.
Orlando was an okay place to grow up, certainly not the worst. I return and am always kind of sad that it seems to be getting worse. The city itself doesn't seem to have any sort of vested interest in making it a nice place to live for the demographic they *should* be trying to attract. I feel like this time in Orlando's history has reached some sort of tipping point and it's tipping the wrong way.
And in my next post on the Chicago forum, you'll find me complaining how the gentrification of my beloved neighborhood here in Chicago.:-)
ETA: People are leaving Illinois in droves but the ones I know wouldn't even consider Florida. My neighbors and friends are primarily between 25-70. They wouldn't move to Florida because they wouldn't be able to find viable employment or a community in Florida that provides anything comparable to what they have here. Five of my very good friends have left in the past year, because they were offered jobs outside of Chicago. Respectively, they moved to Boston, London, San Francisco, Boston and Washington D.C.
Thanks for posting an educated response and not just one generated by a disdain for snow or a love of Mickey Mouse.
You're welcome!
I'm the type of person who hates Disney. I'd sooner spend a summer in Nigeria working on a goat farm than a day at Disney. It's just not my thing, and I don't quite understand that obsessive culture that goes with it. It's weird to me.
The snow? Well, I won't lie and tell you how amazing and awesome and beautiful it is but it's certainly not the worst thing in the world. I am out for at least an hour with my dog almost every single day of the year here in Chicago. The only exceptions last year were when the temperature was below zero for 48 hours in January. It was just unsafe for either him or I to be outside. Other than those days, winter is fine. I bundle up, put on some snow boots, put boots/sweater on my dog and enjoy the city. I love being outside and refuse to spend winter indoors. It would kill my spirit. My dog loves winter. I don't love it but I also don't hate it as much I hate Florida summers.
Did you consider taking your parents out the hell hole you find it to be?
My dad is still working by choice and will likely work until he dies or they push him out. He and my stepmom live in a fancy house on the coast. They like coastal living and would likely not leave Florida. They have grandkids and all that.
My mom, on the other hand, would probably leave in an instant but the weather and cost of homes would likely deter her. Her home has been paid off for many years. Living together is not an option as one of us would end up maimed. :-) She also has a grandchild in Orlando. I am so, so, so lucky that I see my mom whenever I want. She spends about 3-4 weeks a year in Chicago over the course of 5-6 visits. I visit Orlando at Christmas and random other times like last weekend. We also meet in cities around the United States a few times a year like NYC or Vegas. I will say with total honesty that I am privileged to see my mom as much as I do. If we weren't able to spend so much time together, I'd likely be closer to Orlando.
My wife and I lived in Orlando for 5 years, most of our time was split between the area next to Baldwin Park and College Park.
We moved out to California this past March.
Reasons:
1) Not so much the oppressive humidity (but you don't realize how bad it is until you are there year-round), but the lightning storms that come with the summers, and how the constant storms can debilitate you from doing many activities at all.
2) I believe Orlando is one of the least educated metro cities in the US. This is due to all of the people in the area working in Travel and Tourism. Generally speaking, Disney doesn't exactly attract MENSA members either. My wife and I wanted a better cultural fit when it came to education as well as diversity - which is why SF is where we ended up.
3) Job market is very limited for educated people, with the exception of certain industries - see reason #2.
4) Mold - it grows everywhere because of reason #1. If you have problems with allergies, a very humid area that sees a lot of mold growth is likely not going to be very fun.
5) We don't have kids - Orlando is a very family friendly city, but not very friendly if you're trying to find other DINKs (dual income no kids). Haven't had a problem finding that in the Bay Area in only 7 months.
6) Terrible public transportation options - I-4 is the only free major highway in the area, and it's now (as I am hearing from my co-workers back in Lake Mary) going under a major facelift. You might not pay income taxes, but if you live outside of proximity of I-4, then you're paying to use a toll road. Orlando is the only major metro city in the entire US to not have a federally funded loop highway around it. Lynx buses are a joke. I left just before SunRail opened, but it seemed like a train to nowhere, as you couldn't get to the airport, couldn't get to Disney, and most suburban areas aren't built for walking traffic. We love the public transport options here. We pared down to one car that's paid off, and I take an express bus to work every day and my wife takes BART, the El/Subway line to work.
Now, things we miss about Orlando:
1) no state income taxes - we lived near I-4 for the majority of our time there, so we rarely had to use toll roads. That's a big income boost to the bottom line - and makes sense for the area given the low salary base of the tourism workers.
2) Publix - well, this is my wife's complaint more than mine, and she doesn't even do most of the grocery shopping. We use Trader Joes now, but it's small and limited.
3) Decent proximity to the beach - also mostly my wife's complaint. The west coast beaches are more beautiful, but the water is freezing - and people don't go to the beach in northern CA to lay out, since it's usually overcast.
4) Sweet tea - southern sweet tea is impossible to find at the fake BBQ places in SF.
Good post I would have left Central Florida for Northern California as well. California climate is way better than Florida. I hate heat and humidity. I like it cool and dry. Only downsize to California is the super high cost of living. Florida def has its pro's and con's but it was not for me.. the people and weather drove me nuts.
If you want to look for a climate that is similar to Orlando, FL, check out Bridgeton, NJ. High crime rate, high hispanic population, lots of immigrants from Latin America, rude people, little to no jobs, dirty buildings, gangs, graffiti, bad schools, etc.
I wonder if part of the difference in viewpoints is that when people say "Orlando", they're talking about different parts of the Metro area. Within walking/biking distance of my home, there were at least a dozen events going on this past weekend. If you up it to a 10-minute car ride, it becomes 30-40 different events. In the summer, there are fewer events, but there's still options like two farmer's markets within a bike ride from here, things like Food Truck Friday, free concerts, kids' activities and shows, movie nights, social events, and so on. Coming up, in addition to Halloween festivities, you've got the corn festival, a bunch of charity 5K events, a pickelball (?) tournament, hayrides, the last of the local Octoberfests, and more meet ups than I can count. Heck, even my grocery store around the corner did a cheese tasting event this past weekend. I'm in the Windermere-Winter Garden corridor comparing it to northern PG County in the DC Metro. It might be different if I was comparing Pine Hills to the Adams Morgan part of DC. (It would be a more apt comparison to compare Windermere-Winter Garden to Adams Morgan, although I didn't live in Adams Morgan or to compare Pine Hills to PG County, even though I don't live in Pine Hills.) Ideally, when you move from one place to another, it isn't a lateral move -- you move up when you move out.
In this thread, I've seen a lot of people end up comparing the worst of the geographic area that they moved from--regardless of whether they personally lived in it--with the best of the geographic area that they move to--regardless of whether or not that's where they settle down.
More of the quirks that I don't miss about living up north….Talking with my SIL this past weekend, she mentioned that in her rather expensive city apartment up north, one challenge is that even though she's paying as much for a one-bedroom apartment as we are for a three-bedroom apartment, she doesn't have control over her own heat and A/C system. The building has specific times where they turn the boiler on for heat and specific times when the boiler is shut off so they can have A/C. If you end up having a cold day before the boiler is turned on, you have no heat. If you have a warm day in winter, you have no A/C. She also has to deal with assigned parking (even though because she lives near downtown means that people often park in the space, so she has to either search for on-street parking and take her chances, or call the cops and wait for the car to get towed so she can park her car after work). I love the idea of living in an apartment where this weekend I had the windows open and the air turned off the whole weekend by choice (instead of because the heat was already running and it would have been 90+ degrees inside if I didn't open windows) and the ability to easily park my car right in front of my apartment without having to get police assistance to do so.
More of the quirks that I don't miss about living up north….Talking with my SIL this past weekend, she mentioned that in her rather expensive city apartment up north, one challenge is that even though she's paying as much for a one-bedroom apartment as we are for a three-bedroom apartment, she doesn't have control over her own heat and A/C system. The building has specific times where they turn the boiler on for heat and specific times when the boiler is shut off so they can have A/C. If you end up having a cold day before the boiler is turned on, you have no heat. If you have a warm day in winter, you have no A/C. She also has to deal with assigned parking (even though because she lives near downtown means that people often park in the space, so she has to either search for on-street parking and take her chances, or call the cops and wait for the car to get towed so she can park her car after work). I love the idea of living in an apartment where this weekend I had the windows open and the air turned off the whole weekend by choice (instead of because the heat was already running and it would have been 90+ degrees inside if I didn't open windows) and the ability to easily park my car right in front of my apartment without having to get police assistance to do so.
There are a few on here who insist on comparing suburban Orlando to NYC or any other northern city. If your SIL moved to a suburb, she wouldn't have the issues you mention. Comparing your situation to a downtown urban environment is really not giving anyone the real scoop.
There are a few on here who insist on comparing suburban Orlando to NYC or any other northern city. If your SIL moved to a suburb, she wouldn't have the issues you mention. Comparing your situation to a downtown urban environment is really not giving anyone the real scoop.
It really depends…when I lived in suburban Maryland (the same distance out from the heart of DC as I am from the heart of Orlando now), I had the same issue with the boiler that my SIL has in the downtown area. I was only in the apartment for a year, and when I knew that the temperature outside was not going to mesh with what the super had decided to do with the heat or A/C, I packed my bags and went to stay with friends, visit family, or stay in a hotel for those days. My MIL lives in a smaller city in the DC metro (comparable to Lake Mary), and she has the same issue in her condo. It has to do with the age/type of the building rather than the geographic area, but it does seem to be more common up north. I've never heard of it in Florida.
My dad is still working by choice and will likely work until he dies or they push him out. He and my stepmom live in a fancy house on the coast. They like coastal living and would likely not leave Florida. They have grandkids and all that.
My mom, on the other hand, would probably leave in an instant but the weather and cost of homes would likely deter her. Her home has been paid off for many years. Living together is not an option as one of us would end up maimed. :-) She also has a grandchild in Orlando. I am so, so, so lucky that I see my mom whenever I want. She spends about 3-4 weeks a year in Chicago over the course of 5-6 visits. I visit Orlando at Christmas and random other times like last weekend. We also meet in cities around the United States a few times a year like NYC or Vegas. I will say with total honesty that I am privileged to see my mom as much as I do. If we weren't able to spend so much time together, I'd likely be closer to Orlando.
Living together is not an option as one of us would end up maimed. :-) ROTFL
Sounds like the folks are doing OK on their own. Hardly in need of care. Thankfully.
I'm a 'young professional' who likes living in suburban areas outside of cities, so Orlando is a good fit for me. There are different viewpoints on what an educated professional is, but I have a Masters and I don't feel like there's a lack of opportunity for me. Could there be less of a crowd with Masters degrees? Maybe, but that's not an issue for me personally. As long as you're not an ******* and have common sense I think we'd get along. Ha. Just my 2.5 cents.
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