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Ok, despite my (and other recent parents in this thread) best effort to remain civil and on topic some have a very hard time addressing specific points rather than posting a laundry list of your complaints about kids. Maybe pulling some of your comments out will help you since it's apparently hard for you.
You know for somebody who posted a thread bemoaning "intolerance" you seem to be VERY intolerant of anyone whose opinions don't mirror your own.
Just an observation so please don't start cyber-slapping me around too.
on one hand you state:" Everyone puts up with noise from IPODs of people sitting beside you, snoring, talking, loud drunks etc. THAT'S PART OF BEING ON A COMMERCIAL FLIGHT"; yet you go on to complain about someone removing their shoes on a plane. Confusing. I didn't know there were written rules of conduct we were to expect when paying the gawd awful expensive cost of tickets to fly. I simply expect consideration and I give it as well. Are you booking your seats online ahead of time when flying so as to select your seats?
Also I don't think drunks are allowed to fly. I've never encountered a drunk but have encountered kids kicking the back of my seat for 8 hours with mom sitting next to them, never reprimanding them. I've never been on a plane with anyone talking loud at all except for screaming children. I will say that most of the time the parent(s) are trying to calm the child(ren) but not all the time. You speak of people not being tolerant or compassionate to kids; but what about the same applying to non kids? It works both ways, yes?
Guess you missed the rest where i said I didn't say anything or give the person dirty looks.
You know for somebody who posted a thread bemoaning "intolerance" you seem to be VERY intolerant of anyone whose opinions don't mirror your own.
Just an observation so please don't start cyber-slapping me around too.
LOL, cyberslapping? I've never heard that one before. I will look it up to see if I am doing that. Anyway, my original post was asking why people are intolerant of regular average kids, not 'tell me your worst kid stories'. That's what I got. The poster got on my nerves a bit with the brat comments b/c I had already repeated myself. The response back to him/her was long and snippety because i was tired of people missing the point, I don't see how that was read as I was intolerant of them because their views didn't mirror mine. Until that point no one had gotten personal, but when you start a post off with 'this is the attitude...resent your kids" one really can't expect to get a nice response.
Since the convo is definitely deteriorating I won't even add anymore. Here's what I gathered is the summary of answers....
People generalize their negative experiences to all kids, especially those without kids or the elderly regardless of if they have grandchildren or not.
It's easier to give dirty looks and complain rather than try to be compassionate as one person did who didn't have kids.
Doesn't matter if the restaurant I'm in is kid-friendly, I don't want them there.
Even though there are other alternatives for me, I refuse to go there and think all kids should stay home.
Kids should only be allowed to eat with their parents at Mcdonalds.
Too many people do not parent efectively or discipline so that is projected on everyone else.
I think that part of this divide comes from a difference in philosophy about going out with kids in general. People used to get a sitter if they were going somewhere and would go out without their kids. People still do this of course, but now it is also becoming more common to go out with your kids. I go everywhere with my daughter. If she can't go, chances are I won't be there. I work during the week, so when I am not working, I want to be with her. Other people seem to assume though that it's a drag for me to always "have to" bring her along, so I don't see mine as being really a mainstream perspective yet. It's probably these folks who think that having to bring their kids along is a drag who don't want to see you out with your kids either. If their own kids are a drag, then someone else's kids must be a nightmare.
When today's seniors were children, single parenting was rare, and there was much more support from relatives (grandparents, aunts, uncles) even neighbors were there and looked out for one another.
People had time and ENJOYED interacting with the kids.
Nowdays, both parents often need to work just to cover expenses, and many times one parent is left carrying the whole load on their own.
Families are spread across the globe, so kids are not able to interact with grandparents and learn valuable life lessons from them.
Kids are getting fat because so much of their time is spent in front of the TV, or playing video games......Its not safe for them to walk down the street or ride their bike thru the
neighborhood anymore. Child molesters and abductors are around every corner.
Forget about leaving them with a sitter, because chances are they are abusing the kids they are supposed to be caring for.
Instead of making an effort to discipline (not punish) an unruly child, we label them ADD or ADHD and drug them into submission.
We need to set an example and be positive role models for not only our children, but for humankind in general.
As Mahatma Ghandi once said "Be the change you want to see in this world"
Kids are kids - but when I see children acting like wild animals - I want to smack the parents.
sounds like your child was being a child - not misbehaving and I would have told the man to mind his own business that I did not pay good money to be annoyed by grumpy old men!
I expect to hear children make noise at fast food restaurants, Friendly's, Denny's...those sort of places. But just about anywhere else, it makes me nuts. Kids running around between dining tables, kids crying, kids yelling...parents changing diapers on restaurant tables...temper tantrums at the store...it is just awful. I love children, and yes, it is difficult to make children be quiet...but I feel that if your children aren't yet able to behave properly in a social setting, then they probably aren't ready to go there yet.
Shame on the sub set of 55-65 year olds that are children haters. WHERE O' WHERE have the cookie baking grandmothers and fishing buddy grandfathers gone. Not all in this age bracket are haters but there does seem to be a specific group that are so incredibly selfish and self centered all they can think about is Me! Me! Me! It's their lack of closeness with their own children that helps create the problems with future generations. The decline of the family unit begin with this subset of grandparents. I have children 11, 13 and 19. It makes me sad to think of them all grown up. The bright spot though is looking forward to the day that I can be granma to their children. I really think that this children hating group are missing out. How sad to know that all you have left to enjoy in your life is your own selfish shallow pleasures such as eating out at cracker barrel and playing with your little lap dog. Sad Really
I think that part of this divide comes from a difference in philosophy about going out with kids in general. People used to get a sitter if they were going somewhere and would go out without their kids. People still do this of course, but now it is also becoming more common to go out with your kids. I go everywhere with my daughter. If she can't go, chances are I won't be there. I work during the week, so when I am not working, I want to be with her. Other people seem to assume though that it's a drag for me to always "have to" bring her along, so I don't see mine as being really a mainstream perspective yet. It's probably these folks who think that having to bring their kids along is a drag who don't want to see you out with your kids either. If their own kids are a drag, then someone else's kids must be a nightmare.
ADVentive, good post. I'm a full-time working mom, and my weekends revolve around my children. We go to kid-friendly places, and I still have to deal with my 2 year old's frequent tantrums. I was hesitant to take him to the movies, but he seems to do quite well there. I know for a fact that if he didn't, we wouldn't go, because it would be time ill-spent. As for dining with the boys, I just don't think they're ready to go out with us to a formal place. Even places like Red Lobster or Olive Garden, sometimes the wait time is enough to get them antsy. So it's something I usually pass on, and until they're older, it's Chuck E Cheese for now.
My boys are active and at times, a lot to handle. Because of my husband's work schedule, I'm usually tending to them alone. There have been times when they behaved in ways that I found absolutely intolerable, and so this was addressed as soon as we came back home. My older son is 5, and so I can reason with him (there aren't many behavior problems with him, except the chattering). However, I have horror stories about my 2 year old (which I'm thinking of starting a new thread on, BTW, to get some pointers).
Anyway, I dislike it when children behave badly, even when they're my own. But I don't think any of us can afford to be anti-children (isn't this the parenting forum???) Parents should address bad behavior, and not ignore it. At the same time, children do need to be exposed to public areas that are age appropriate, how else will they learn how to behave?
Being a mother of young kids, I haven't forgotten them at the age of one. I don't think there's any way to shush a baby that age, and that shouldn't be expected. Besides, why is there so much focus on younger children, who tend to slip occasionally? Even the "little angel" can have her moments. I've been to New York City parks where the children are not the ones with behavioral issues, but the teenagers. So if we want to talk about discipline, how about all the loud, rude, eye-rolling teenagers that speak a language I cannot understand? One can conclude it's those same young children that grow into those rude teenagers. Once gain, it's important to emphasize the parent's role in rearing well-mannered - albeit not perfect - children.
It's so easy to judge another parent. I remember seeing other mothers that would be ignoring their young one while he/she cried in their stroller & thinking, "what kind of mother would do that??" Now I know the answer: the kind that is tired and has tried to calm the child down with everything, but to no avail. So she simply lets him be. I've learned now that it's better not to judge, since I don't know that person's circumstances.
[QUOTE Anyway, my original post was asking why people are intolerant of regular average kids, not 'tell me your worst kid stories'. QUOTE]
You posed the question Problem is a lot of "regular average kids" today are little brats...not all!!! and for that I blame the parents
Yes, McDonalds is a kid place, that is where I took mine not out to a fancy restaurant.
Heck the last cruise I was on in the main dining room kid picking little stones out of this planter and throwing them at people...the wiat staff finally had to same something cause Mommy & Daddy were in lala land
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Problem is a lot of "regular average kids" today are little brats...not all!!! and for that I blame the parents
