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Yes, misbehaving may be getting him a lot of attention and he may actually be acting up because it gives him a sense of control when everyone drops everything to hold him and have a long understanding conversation with him.
If one of my kids was acting like this, I'm give a quick slap on the rear end and tell him to straighten up, but a time out might also work. The problem with giving a lot of time and attention as a reward for bad behavior is that it encourages bad behavior.
I totally agree. I'm in fact an in home behavior counselor for an autism program, and positively reinforcing negative behaviors is the single biggest issue I work on with families. As soon as the attention for negative behaviors stops, and reinforcement of positive behaviors starts the negative behaviors stop. Not saying the OP's son has autism, but I do see this behavior in my clients. Especially the ones who understand how to manipulate a situation.
We've tried completely ignoring him, though, when he does that, and it's gotten worse -- that's why we switched gears to trying to help him calm himself down. And he does get positive attention from us, in the form of cuddling while reading a book, etc. But maybe not enough.
We've tried completely ignoring him, though, when he does that, and it's gotten worse, that's why we switched gears to trying to help him calm himself down.
If this is only the result of reinforcing unacceptable behavior, of course, it's going to get worse before it gets better. It's hard for parents to take the hard path.
But ever since reading your thread, I've been thinking of that movie about Temple Grandin. She took great comfort in her body being confined by that mechanical cow thingy. Granted, she couldn't handle people touching her (your son can). The mechanical thing filled that need.
BUT she wasn't seeking comfort for unacceptable behavior. She was seeking comfort for other emotional needs. I think that's where the difference is. Even if your son is Autistic (not saying he is), he still can't be rewarded for unacceptable behavior. And he'll still need to eventually learn how to calm himself, not rely on others.
Kids put on quite a show for their parents. The proof in that is how your son can quickly calm himself at school. He is capable. He is either playing you or you are enabling him or most likely both. I know it's hard to hear that you are encouraging this behavior. I know it's even harder to stop what you're doing. It's difficult to make changes that appear to be hurting your child but you need to recognize that he is capable and what's happening is mostly show.
My son would put on a big show for me when he (suddenly in his mind) had to stop what he was doing and go somewhere. He'd tantrum. He'd cry. He'd beg. He'd negotiate. He'd do whatever he could to try to change his reality. I'd keep a monitone voice and just repeat calmly something about sticking to committments or whatever was appropriate. He'd get out of the car all angry and go by himself inside the building of where he was going, say boy scouts for example. I'd ask people what he was like when he walked in. They said he was all smiles and happy. Geeze, my son could turn it on and off!
Even if he was truly upset about something, he was completely capable of not showing it in situations that weren't appropriate. He saved it all for me! LOL Even though I wasn't reinforcing inappropriate behavior via hugging, I certainly was doing something wrong, even though I kept monitone and stuck to my guns.
And after all of these years, I KNOW what I did wrong. I allowed discussion and debate when I shouldn't have allowed it. We're so hung up on these days on letting our children express their feelings and opinions that we have gone overboard in some areas. And if you give in just once, they'll continue to try to get you to give in again for months and months! Giving in once is like taking a hundred steps back in progress. I sure learned that the hard way.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lawmom
And he does get positive attention from us, in the form of cuddling while reading a book, etc. But maybe not enough.
Nobody is saying you're not giving positive attention. All the positive attention won't override reinforcing negative behavior.
lawmom...He IS only 5 years old....too young to think things through himself....and much too young to contemplate his angry behavior....Sounds to me like he hates school, and that's why he's angry...and as far as I'm concerned that's veeery normal, and he's definately not alone....I would Give him some time to adjust before you submit him to some shrink, or counsilor's take on his behavior....he really doesn't sound like he's abnormal at all.
lawmom...He IS only 5 years old....too young to think things through himself....and much too young to contemplate his angry behavior....Sounds to me like he hates school, and that's why he's angry...and as far as I'm concerned that's veeery normal, and he's definately not alone....I would Give him some time to adjust before you submit him to some shrink, or counsilor's take on his behavior....he really doesn't sound like he's abnormal at all.
She said he has always had problems controlling his anger and his anger had already escalated prior to these recent changes in his life.
We've tried completely ignoring him, though, when he does that, and it's gotten worse -- that's why we switched gears to trying to help him calm himself down. And he does get positive attention from us, in the form of cuddling while reading a book, etc. But maybe not enough.
Thanks for all of the suggestions.
That's different than catching him being good "Oh you're doing a great job sitting nice", "oh thanks so much for helping me", "great job petting the dog nicely" etc. Reinforce the random things that you want him to do more, and withhold attention from the negative ones. Yes it will get worse before it gets better, but that shows it's working. He's actually ramping it up and testing the waters because he's only going to do what it takes to get the attention. However everyone has to be on the same page, or withholding attention will never work. Once he learns it's easier to get reinforced/attention for the positive behaviors the negative ones will stop. It's very hard to change these behaviors, but I have to say it's much easier to change a 5 year old than a 10 year old. Good luck
And I really don't think he hates school at all, either -- he really liked preschool, and while he's pretty tight-lipped about kindergarten so far (he's only been there 3 days), his teacher says he seems to be doing a great job, and knowing him, he will be quite happy there once he settles in.
I am perfectly will to take a look at what we are doing that's reinforcing his behavior -- the parents' actions are what needs to change first and foremost in almost ever case. I will take a good look at it for a few days. One thing that is difficult is that DH is much, much, much more apt to "give in" with both kids. He has a very hard time with noise, and to avoid the shrieking/screaming/chaos he just gives them what they want. I've told him over and over how that is NOT helpful and is making things much, much worse!
Hm, I think I am on to something here. we both need to be on the same flipping page when it comes to the kids. I am much more capable of either ignoring or giving a consequence, though I'm not perfect of course -- I'll admit to sometimes caving when I'm really tired.
Sadly, it's probably going to harder to change your husband since he's older and is more set in his ways with his tollerance issues. The good news is that kids behave differently for different people. (My children never gave my husband crap because it didn't get them anywhere.) That means you can still get your children to stop doing it with you even if you can't get your husband onboard. Of course, it would be ideal if you can form a united front because you'll still have major drama surrounding you if hubby is still giving in.
We've tried completely ignoring him, though, when he does that, and it's gotten worse -- that's why we switched gears to trying to help him calm himself down. And he does get positive attention from us, in the form of cuddling while reading a book, etc. But maybe not enough.
Thanks for all of the suggestions.
There are really three different kinds of tantrums and each needs a bit different technique
A) Frustration because the child can't communicate. Very common before
he/she can say many words.
B) Feeling afraid, angry or out of control and don't know how to handle those emotions.
C) Not getting what the child wants and screaming, kicking, whining as a way to get that thing.
For type A a good strategy is to try to help the child put into words what he/she wants. If you ignore or walk away from a child in this situation, it just makes things worse. You may also want to teach sign language as a way of preventing some of these kinds of tantrums.
For type B a good strategy is to sit with the child, hold him/her, talk to him/her etc. to help get through the emotions. Leaving a child alone in this situation just adds to the fear or anger. Another way to help is to teach him to breathe out his anger.
Practice when your child is calm first:
Relaxing together -taking deep breaths together. Practice that with
him as a regulatory pattern .
When the tantrum starts:
Take him away from that scene first. Then hold his hands say "You are not calm. Let's become calm. Breathe in........." "Breathe out...." Breathe in a very exagerated manner. He may not be able to really do the heavy breathing but will try. This will take his mind off whatever was bothering him first. After a few minutes, tell him "You are calm now! Wow! We both are calm and that feels so much better" and return to what you were doing.
Type C tantrum is the one that you need to ignore, walk away from etc. It does help here to acknowledge what the child is feeling before walking away. *I see you are very angry because......* If this tantrum is severe, you may want to do the breathing with your child instead of the ignoring. Just don't give in and give them what they want.
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