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I think it's perfectly ignorant for a doctor to declare that only the unvaccinated can spread illness. Frankly I think I should have the right to sue a doctor if he fires the unvaccinated backed with a statement that I would have no worries of contacting said illness and I contacted it from somebody who is vaccinated attending his practice.
Quite frankly I wouldn't go to a doctor that didn't know vaccination wasn't a 100%, I wouldn't go to a doctor that requires me to vaccinate on his schedule, I wouldn't go to a doctor that didn't know that most of the people involved in outbreaks have been vaccinated and because of that don't stay home during said outbreak so they become vessels of disease and spread it around schools and public areas. I wouldn't trust that doctor with a pimple. We all have our preferences.
You have some really black and white reasoning do you know that?
Yes, it is true that sometimes vaccinated people can spread disease. However, this does not equate with the idea that no one should get vaccinated to prevent the spread of disease. Whether you are looking at chicken pox or any other disease, the percentage of people who are vaccinated who spread disease is far, far less than the percentage of non-vaccinated who spread the disease.
That's what this argument is about. Nothing in life is absolute. Its also completely true that vaccination is not a 100% guarantee someone won't get sick with the disease they are being vaccinated for. There are no 100% guarantees in life period. The idea is that it is 90%-95% effective. Than, if everyone else does their part and gets vaccinated 90% to 95% of vaccinated people will not get sick and will not spread the disease. These large numbers of vaccinated people will stop the spread of disease through "herd immunity".
FYI, there a number of reasons why vaccination cannot be 100% effective. A batch of vaccine may be ineffective. The vaccination may be improperly or incorrectly administered. The dosage may be inadequate. The person may have been exposed to the disease too recently for the vaccine to stop it. CDC studies these things and periodically revises vaccination guidelines to improve overall efficacy. For example, when it comes to the flu shot, mist has been found to be more effective for some age groups, the shot has been found to be more effective for different age groups.
You want perfection than go to heaven. Vaccination isn't perfect, but a 90% to 95% reduction in any infectious disease is worth having. Prior to the approval of the chicken pox vaccine the disease killed about 100 people a year and caused 11,000 hospitalizations. If you calculate each hospitalization had an average cost of $10,000 than the economic cost of the hospitalizations alone was $110,000,000. That's why the chicken pox vaccine is worth giving. This same article addresses the "cost effectiveness" of the vaccine and concludes that if all we considered were just the savings in hospital costs that the vaccine has more than paid for itself.
there are 2 doses need, both before the age of 6. I don't understand what would stress her out. I should also point out that, with it becoming a routine vaccine, kids won't be passing it around like they used to. she might not get it as a child, and it can be very serious if she gets it as an adult.
Thats not how it was explained by her doctor but I may have misheard. But I still dont want her to get it. Id rather her get chicken pox as a normal child. Just my own persona preference.
No Eleanora1...it is YOU who do not understand that a vaccinated baby has a HIGHER risk of catching disease thanks to his/her immune system being compromised by all the TOXINS they put in vaccines....sorry.....your sources from the CDC are INDEED a pack of lies.
Not only is the myth of the *toxins* in vaccines silly given the fact that our exposure to these same toxins is much higher from the natural environment, but...
Autism may be detectable in infants as young as 6 months old, according to a study released Friday in the American Journal of Psychiatry, suggesting the condition has a stronger genetic and biological root.
Quote:
According to Dr. Nancy Minshew, director of the NICHD Collaborative Program of Excellence in Autism at the University of Pittsburgh, who was not involved in the study, the current findings suggest that a child might have autism long before he or she begins to show outward signs.
Fair enough. Many of us older boomers have scars on our arms or legs from the smallpox vaccine.
I had a friend (my age, 25) who asked me where my small pox vaccine was. She wait raised in India. I was telling her how people don't get that vaccine anymore because it is irradiated in the US. I then started telling her about the how people are now becoming anit vaccine. She was shocked and appalled that people would pass on vaccine. She started talking about people in India are dying because they can't get certain vaccines and people will line up down the street anytime they are giving out a vaccine. People are really really grateful.
I think it's perfectly ignorant for a doctor to declare that only the unvaccinated can spread illness. Frankly I think I should have the right to sue a doctor if he fires the unvaccinated backed with a statement that I would have no worries of contacting said illness and I contacted it from somebody who is vaccinated attending his practice. Quite frankly I wouldn't go to a doctor that didn't know vaccination wasn't a 100%, I wouldn't go to a doctor that requires me to vaccinate on his schedule, I wouldn't go to a doctor that didn't know that most of the people involved in outbreaks have been vaccinated and because of that don't stay home during said outbreak so they become vessels of disease and spread it around schools and public areas. I wouldn't trust that doctor with a pimple. We all have our preferences.
Who said that? Vaccines prevent illness. Any sane person with a little knowledge knows that. No one said they are 100% effective, and no one said ONLY unvaccinated can spread illness. Where do you even get these ideas? It is about prevention. It is about reducing the chances, not completely doing away with any chance of getting sick.
I bet if you started asking around, you'd have a tough time finding a doctor who meets your criteria. Ignorance is bliss I guess.
Thats not how it was explained by her doctor but I may have misheard. But I still dont want her to get it. Id rather her get chicken pox as a normal child. Just my own persona preference.
If all of her friends are vaccinated, who is she going to catch it from?
[quote=lkb0714;23029617]You appear to be incapable of talking about the actual article.
Not a single doctor in that article made the claim that "only the un-vaccinated can spread illness". That is another fallacy you have completely made up.
Let's not get carried away, you have been missing my point for awhile. It's not that hard to grasp.
This is what I'm responding to in the article which I read, maybe you didn't?
"For Allan LaReau of Kalamazoo, Mich., and his 11 colleagues at Bronson Rambling Road Pediatrics, who chose in 2010 to stop working with vaccine-refusing families, a major factor was the concern that "unimmunized" (really, unimmunized?) children could pose a danger in the waiting room to infants or sick children who haven't yet been fully vaccinated."
My dispute isn't based on vaccination spreads illness. My dispute is how can a doctor base his decision on the above when immunized children could pose the same danger in the waiting room as well. It tells me they are not that bright.It's not rocket science, really, how gullible are parents suppose to be?
Let's just have some honest doctors please. It's time and or money. Saying this is misleading and might get them into a heap of trouble if they do end up having a child who contracts something from their office and the parents find out their office isn't as safe as they proclaim. Not only that it pits vaccinated parents against non vaccinating parents with false claims of disease free offices.
This is my point. How could you disagree? Unless you can prove that nobody can spread illness who is vaccinated you cannot. If you don't see how ignorant this is then I guess I would just avoid any care from you as well. I'll tell you one thing though, most parents are not that stupid contrary to the picture you paint of us. Most of us are educated and know that this can't possibly hold water!! Therefore, I wouldn't go to those doctors.
Oh you would seriously take my word for it if I said "thousands of great scientist say that vaccines are not as effective as people think?" Why would your "hear say" be any different than mine?
Here, some scientist aren't always honest, doctors either.
I'm sick of it really, if we have to list all sources with links than we ALL do. Show the links to the thousand of scientist that are great. I'm not arguing that there are some great scientist but rules are rules. I can show you a couple that are not that great as well.
If all of her friends are vaccinated, who is she going to catch it from?
Maybe the one who lacks a booster? Maybe the one who only got 55% immunity? Gosh, factually, it could be anyone!
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there are 2 doses need, both before the age of 6. I don't understand what would stress her out. I should also point out that, with it becoming a routine vaccine, kids won't be passing it around like they used to. she might not get it as a child, and it can be very serious if she gets it as an adult.
