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I had pertussis about 5 years ago. I caught it from an unvaccinated child in my daughter's Mother's Day Out at church. I was vaccinated as a child but didn't know to get a booster as adult.
I was so sick and in so much pain they gave me sedatives to knock me out. I was in bed for two weeks and had a cough for several months. My ribs were bruised, I couldn't eat because I coughed so hard everything would come back up. I broke blood vessels all over my face, some I had to have lasered off. I had what is considered a mild case because my childhood vaccination actually lessened the illness.
The very idea of an infant going through that kind of torture, especially when it is preventable, is unimaginable.
My husband had the same experience of getting it as an adult because he didn't know about getting an adult booster. He has permanent lung issues as a result (they flare up several times a year).
My friends and I were lucky. We got sick after my husband, and all got immediate treatment before it turned into terrible coughing spasms.
Maybe parents who opt out could be required to watch a video showing small children with the disease. I don't know. It's not like the information is not out there. Some parents choose to ignore it, I guess, so perhaps they would just think the video was Big Pharma propaganda.
That would only be fair JustJulia if all parents were also required to watch a video showing small children vaccine damaged....and you're right...the imformation IS out there...and most peple who do oft out have done their own research, and made a very informed decision...if you think they might think CDC videos are "propaganda"...what would you call the others...there's no gain (is there) to tell people about the side effects and reactions?.....If vaccines are soooo wonderful,why does the government have to mandate them?...and why have literally billions been paid to compensate for vaccine injury?....."Bad Flu Season Forecast" blares the headlines....have you ever wondered who these doomsday prophets are, and where do they get their psychic news?
That would only be fair JustJulia if all parents were also required to watch a video showing small children vaccine damaged....and you're right...the imformation IS out there...and most peple who do oft out have done their own research, and made a very informed decision...if you think they might think CDC videos are "propaganda"...what would you call the others...there's no gain (is there) to tell people about the side effects and reactions?
Legitimate links please.
Quote:
Originally Posted by purehuman
If vaccines are soooo wonderful,why does the government have to mandate them?...and why have literally billions been paid to compensate for vaccine injury?
Legitimate links please.
Quote:
Originally Posted by purehuman
"Bad Flu Season Forecast" blares the headlines....have you ever wondered who these doomsday prophets are, and where do they get their psychic news?
I know science scares you, but I'll take a shot anyway. Virologists, Immunologists, Infectious Disease Specialists, Public Health Officials, and even the dreaded CDC compile data from doctor's offices, hospitals, schools, the military, etc. They follow the trends of virulence/severity, strains, infection rates, and movement. Based on these data points they predict prevalent strains, rates of infection, and potential severity.
Let's start with this one: the majority of kids who got pertussis had been immunized. First of all, even according to your link, that is not entirely true. Here is what the article says:
•For pertussis cases in which vaccination histories are known, between 44 and 83 percent were of people who had been immunized, according to data from nine California counties with high infection rates.
Secondly, "immunized" can mean anything from one dose of vaccine to the full 5 or 6 (depending on age).
Thirdly, No vaccine is 100% effective. Most routine childhood vaccines are effective for 85% to 95% of recipients. The second fact is that in a country such as the United States the people who have been vaccinated vastly outnumber those who have not.
Therefore: If, in a school of 1000 students, 950 are immunized and 50 are not, and there are 100 cases of pertussis, 60 among the immunized and 40 among the unimmunized, the percent among the immunized is still much lower, e.g. 6% for the immunized and 80% among the unimmunized.
***********************************************
Let's look at this:
In San Diego County, more than two thirds of the people in this group were up to date on their immunizations.
What does "up to date" mean? In Califonia, the Tdap booster for 11 year olds was not mandatory until 2011, after this article was written. It is known that pertussis immunity, whether from immunization or natural disease, wears off. That is why the Tdap vaccine was developed and recommended for kids 10+. It was introduced in 2005. In 2010, when this article was written, up to date in California meant having had five doses of DTaP vaccine, with the last one at age 5. IIRC, most of the Cali cases were in older children and adults, whose immunity had worn off. (My state, Colorado was more on the stick and passed the Tdap mandate for the 2007 school year.)
Interestingly, the article from your link does not even mention the Tdap vaccine and its role in preventing outbreaks, and instead focuses on some supposed new strain of pertussis.
..If vaccines are soooo wonderful,why does the government have to mandate them?.
..
Round and round she goes...where she stops nobody knows. I must confess I get tired of debates where the person responding never seems to assimilate or digest any of the information she/he is given.
This is an easy one though that's been answered many times before by myself and by others. So this time, I hope you pay attention. Government mandates vaccinations because of a simple scientific concept called "herd immunity". The real goal of vaccination is not simply to stop all vaccinated children from getting sick, its to prevent a generalized outbreak or epidemic of a disease. Vaccines work by: (1) preventing the person vaccinated from getting sick; and (2) preventing vaccinated persons from spreading the disease to others. When a high percentage of the population is vaccinated (say 80% or better) this is generally sufficient to confer "herd immunity" and prevent an epidemic of a disease from sweeping through a community.
Without a "mandate" there is simply no way to obtain 80% or better compliance with vaccination for a particular disease. That's why its required. That's why CDC guidelines on vaccination are necessary. Now is there some part of this you still don't understand?
You than ask if vaccination is such a good thing than why have millions been paid to compensate the "victims of vaccination".
The United States adopted by legislation a no-fault system of compensating anyone who has been injured by a vaccine. The entity responsible for compensating people making these claims is the Vaccine Compensation Fund (VCF). A few people do respond poorly to vaccination. Although, many people have no idea what the primary problems usually are. The primary side effect of vaccination is what physicians call "anaphylaxsis". This means an individual who has an allergic reaction to a particular vaccine. These reactions can vary and cause minimal harm or significant harm. The VCF was largely created because it was recognized there were a handful of individuals who develop serious injuries like this and shouldn't have to bear the entire cost of the injury on their own. Thus, even though there is nothing wrong with a particular vaccine because it can have dramatic effects on a handful of people a system of compensation is available those people.
The fact that a few people have serious allergic reactions to a vaccine is a strong argument for making vaccination for the rest of us mandatory. Those who are allergic are at a much higher risk of developing the disease than vaccinated individuals are.
Quote:
...."Bad Flu Season Forecast" blares the headlines....have you ever wondered who these doomsday prophets are, and where do they get their psychic news?
This kind of a comment demonstrates your general lack of knowledge about public health and how public health departments protect us from disease. I've commented before that the biggest problem with public health is that it has been hurt by its level of success. Because so few people in the USA develop diseases like polio, measles, diptheria etc., virtually no one thinks much about these problems and they have not a clue what their county health department is doing to make certain they don't get sick. Allow me to educate you a little about that.
Public health departments around the nation (and more importantly the world) are constantly engaged in what is called "disease surveillance". Doctors are legally obligated to report all new cases of various infectious diseases they come in contact with to the local public health office. This information is tabulated by people known as "epidemiologists". The system is set up, so that if a dangerous disease suddenly appears like a new strain of flu that this will be known by public health authorities around the world in literally hours. Measures than can be taken quickly to limit the spread of disease and to get authorities working quickly on a vaccine that will prevent a new strain of illness.
Have you ever wondered where flu vaccines come from? Typically, we go to the southern hemisphere of the world (which has seasons in reverse order than our own) and we make a vaccine based on the strains of flu found in that part of the world. That's how we are able to create a seasonal flu vaccine that is usually 60% to 80% effective against the strains of flu that than appear in our hemisphere in the Fall. "A bad flu" season is often forecast based on what is happening in other parts of the world with different seasons than our own.
In short, that's much of what goes on in the public health world. A whole lot of "behind the scenes" work that has been extraordinarily effective in preventing mass epidemics (and fatalities) from disease. You won't know much about it unless you read journals like the "New England Journal of Medicine" on a regular basis. Its a good system. Its a system that has served our country and our world well. I greatly fear though that because of (1) people who want to cut huge portions of government spending; and (2) a few anti-vaccination people that this excellent system may be on its way out. Only than, will we begin to realize what we lost.
Last edited by markg91359; 04-29-2012 at 08:47 AM..
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